[Spoilers] Under The Fat Goose Inn (D4 general talk)

[LemonDemonGirl]

D4 is such a fascinating mix of over-design and spare design. It's probably the ultimate expression of Blizzard's linear design philosophy.

100% they made this game in a vacuum. These devs only played their own game. I wouldn't believe anyone involved with the design of the game had a strong opinion of like Marvel Heroes or Fate.

100% this. I downloaded Diablo 3 and Immortal and the combat, system and story feels the exact same.

[Biomega]

This is my top tilt with the game right now.

Why it's not a thing is beyond me.

Gem bag and refund all paragons button - those are my top 2 complaints.

[Tojara]

Base game in general is pretty good IMO. A lot of my little gripes with the game at the moment are almost exclusively related to space and UI related issues on the PC, both of which could be fixed. I sincerely hope they don't have design constraints to where they have to handle the console/PC side at the same time, because there are some pretty simple UI modifications that could be added to the PC that would make the experience way better (essentially, just keyword searches in both your stash, inventory, paragon and your talent tree).

Other than that I just hope they continue to actually add to the game. Helltide and world bosses being on a timer felt like it was going to be way worse than it actually was. In reality those events happen often enough, or the materials that they provide aren't possibly going to be the limiting factor for crafting or targeting gear at the moment. Nightmare dungeons are actually really cool, and the world element of the game seems fine to me as well.

I'll be interested to see how they approach renown when a season comes out. I know they said something akin to the bonuses of the statues being a one time thing, but realistically speaking I think having to get the fifth renown track each and every season is going to be fairly painful. If they swapped the fourth track with the fifth one I'd think it would be way more reasonable (max gambling rewards as opposed to 4 paragon points).

[Nymrohd]

I'll be interested to see how they approach renown when a season comes out. I know they said something akin to the bonuses of the statues being a one time thing, but realistically speaking I think having to get the fifth renown track each and every season is going to be fairly painful. If they swapped the fourth track with the fifth one I'd think it would be way more reasonable (max gambling rewards as opposed to 4 paragon points).

I'm guessing that people might just level by doing dungeons and clearing the strongholds. That should be enough to get the renown track completed without having to do exploration/altars

[Biomega]

I'm guessing that people might just level by doing dungeons and clearing the strongholds. That should be enough to get the renown track completed without having to do exploration/altars

Renown is a lot easier than people think. You'll get a ton of exploration naturally. The altars are a one-time thing. And if you skip the campaign on new seasonal characters (which I think is how it'll work?) you can just spam lots of side quests, strongholds, and dungeons while leveling up and basically gain a ton of renown fairly automatically. I don't foresee this being a big hurdle for seasonal play.

[Nymrohd]

Renown is a lot easier than people think. You'll get a ton of exploration naturally. The altars are a one-time thing. And if you skip the campaign on new seasonal characters (which I think is how it'll work?) you can just spam lots of side quests, strongholds, and dungeons while leveling up and basically gain a ton of renown fairly automatically. I don't foresee this being a big hurdle for seasonal play.

The way I read it, the stats you get from Altars are automatic. The Renown is not. If you want the Renown from them, you have to find them. Strongholds are a given since they are both easy to do and worth massive renown. Certain side quests probably will be the standard ones to do; some are super fast while others just require you to clear a dungeon. Then beyond that you will get exploration just by walking around to find the dungeons and the rest of the Renown will come from clearing dungeons with useful aspects, dungeons that have sidequests and dungeons targeted by Whispers. Altars you will only pick if they are right on your way.

[Biomega]

The way I read it, the stats you get from Altars are automatic. The Renown is not.

That'd be super annoying then, and perhaps something they could fix. It's really not an activity you want to repeat every few months, even if it's "just" for renown. Perfect opportunity for Blizzard to just intervene and go "fuck it, here you go".

[Puupi]

The way I read it, the stats you get from Altars are automatic. The Renown is not. If you want the Renown from them, you have to find them. Strongholds are a given since they are both easy to do and worth massive renown. Certain side quests probably will be the standard ones to do; some are super fast while others just require you to clear a dungeon. Then beyond that you will get exploration just by walking around to find the dungeons and the rest of the Renown will come from clearing dungeons with useful aspects, dungeons that have sidequests and dungeons targeted by Whispers. Altars you will only pick if they are right on your way.

You don't need the altars to get max renown. About 80% completion of the zone is enough. Doing it right now on my first "alt" aka new main. The game is much more fun and clearer with the second playthrough as you haven't messed up the map by adventuring all over while doing the campaign. Now I can systematically go through places and complete side quests etc.

A big annoyance is that you can't see those blue exclamation marks on the map unless you are near them. That makes doing them tedious on the first character if you traveled throughout the world while finishing the campaign and skipping most of the blue quests.

[Nymrohd]

You don't need the altars to get max renown. About 80% completion of the zone is enough. Doing it right now on my first "alt" aka new main. The game is much more fun and clearer with the second playthrough as you haven't messed up the map by adventuring all over while doing the campaign. Now I can systematically go through places and complete side quests etc.

A big annoyance is that you can't see those blue exclamation marks on the map unless you are near them. That makes doing them tedious on the first character if you traveled throughout the world while finishing the campaign and skipping most of the blue quests.

And you could not pick them ahead of time cause there is a cap on side quests. And yeah as I said, I think you will be far more likely to just level by doing the dungeons and getting the renown as a bonus.

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I have to say, even though it is much improved from the first beta, every time I get a "slay all mobs" phase in a dungeon I just want to leave. ALso I keep getting the same three uniques again and again for some reason.

[Donald Hellscream]

As flawed designwise as the druid is, I do feel an immense sense of satisfaction playing a pulverize build, yes the combat boils down to mauling till spirit capped, then pulverizing, repeat, while throwing up earthen bulwark, using debilitating roar, trample for the luls or to get out of danger, and grizzly rage for big dam.
But man is it satisfying to smash down legions of mobs with pulverize, especially with the shockwave aspect and Ursine Horror, also just the sound design, I never get tired of hearing the thunderous boom whenever I use pulverize.

Right now I am just praying for Vasily's prayer to drop, so that I can swap out maul and replace it with earth spike, as of right now the biggest flaw of my build is the need to be within melee range to generate spirit, so Vasily's prayer turning earth skills into werebear skills would eliminate that issue entirely.

[Nymrohd]

As flawed designwise as the druid is, I do feel an immense sense of satisfaction playing a pulverize build, yes the combat boils down to mauling till spirit capped, then pulverizing, repeat, while throwing up earthen bulwark, using debilitating roar, trample for the luls or to get out of danger, and grizzly rage for big dam.
But man is it satisfying to smash down legions of mobs with pulverize, especially with the shockwave aspect and Ursine Horror, also just the sound design, I never get tired of hearing the thunderous boom whenever I use pulverize.

Right now I am just praying for Vasily's prayer to drop, so that I can swap out maul and replace it with earth spike, as of right now the biggest flaw of my build is the need to be within melee range to generate spirit, so Vasily's prayer turning earth skills into werebear skills would eliminate that issue entirely.

My issue with Druid moreso than with the other two classes I've tried (Rogue and Sorceress) is that the Uniques and legendaries are very clear on what builts are supposed to be viable. I hope that after a year or so, a lot more builds will be possible than now.

[LemonDemonGirl]

Man, this game's starting to make me hate Iron Maidens. Especially after seeing what they did to Vigo.

The band is ok though.

[Nymrohd]

Man, this game's starting to make me hate Iron Maidens. Especially after seeing what they did to Vigo.

And later it seems Prava is using that design liberally. I do hope we get to kill her. Or even better, that Tyrael eventually shows up and disbands the Cathedral of Light in pure disgust telling them that nothing that they do has anything to do with the will of the Light.

[Donald Hellscream]

My issue with Druid moreso than with the other two classes I've tried (Rogue and Sorceress) is that the Uniques and legendaries are very clear on what builts are supposed to be viable. I hope that after a year or so, a lot more builds will be possible than now.

Yeah, I did the campaign at world tier 2 with an entirely homebrew build, without looking up guides or anything, beating Lilith took me, idk atleast half an hour on the daughter of hatred phase on the attempt that I killed her ( died 2 times previously because I obviously had to learn the fight and her attack patterns ) and the last boss of the capstone dungeon absolutely dumpstered me, so I had to swallow my pride or whatever you wanna call it and look up viable endgame builds, thankfully I really enjoy the pulverize build, but generally speaking you do feel pidgeonholed for sure.

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And later it seems Prava is using that design liberally. I do hope we get to kill her. Or even better, that Tyrael eventually shows up and disbands the Cathedral of Light in pure disgust telling them that nothing that they do has anything to do with the will of the Light.

I have a feeling dealing with her and her "merry" army of fanatics is gonna be relegated to expansion content, as it feels like something that would be an extension of the main plot, but hopefully I am wrong and dealing the cathedral will be relegated to seasonal content so that we can get to kill her sooner rather than later.

[gondrin]

Honestly, my biggest gripe right now is not having the ability to be able to see what side quests you've completed. This game really needs in especially since they have quests that randomly drop from things. Oh, and up the drop rate of Crushed Beast Bones. Drop rate is completely disproportionately low from the rest of the items that drop.

[Aucald]

Honestly, my biggest gripe right now is not having the ability to be able to see what side quests you've completed. This game really needs in especially since they have quests that randomly drop from things. Oh, and up the drop rate of Crushed Beast Bones. Drop rate is completely disproportionately low from the rest of the items that drop.

I hear you on the Crushed Beast Bones, man. I've been slaughtering quill rats and thorn beasts in Scosglen for days now, and I'm at like 3/5 required for the next potion tier upgrade. I might actually have to farm them at some point, I suppose.

[gondrin]

I hear you on the Crushed Beast Bones, man. I've been slaughtering quill rats and thorn beasts in Scosglen for days now, and I'm at like 3/5 required for the next potion tier upgrade. I might actually have to farm them at some point, I suppose.

There is a rare boss that actually drops 5 each time but he doesn't spawn often. Gaspar Stilbian in The Scar subarea of Scosglen. Funny thing, as far as potions go, it is only the level 30 one that needs it.

[Aucald]

There is a rare boss that actually drops 5 each time but he doesn't spawn often. Gaspar Stilbian in The Scar subarea of Scosglen. Funny thing, as far as potions go, it is only the level 30 one that needs it.

I'll be on the lookout for him, too. I hope nothing else important needs these crushed bones.

[Kumorii]

I hear you on the Crushed Beast Bones, man. I've been slaughtering quill rats and thorn beasts in Scosglen for days now, and I'm at like 3/5 required for the next potion tier upgrade. I might actually have to farm them at some point, I suppose.

Huh... I've always had an abundance of these resources for potions.
Are you guys crafting elixirs and what not?

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I'll be on the lookout for him, too. I hope nothing else important needs these crushed bones.

It's for elixirs and incense, but I count elixirs and incense late end-game.
Or if you struggle with something they can help push you through a particular boss. But usually gearing is enough until you only get marginal increases from gear.

[gondrin]

I'll be on the lookout for him, too. I hope nothing else important needs these crushed bones.

Only thing I've seen so far is incenses. Loos to be Diablo's version of raid feasts in WoW.

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Huh... I've always had an abundance of these resources for potions.
Are you guys crafting elixirs and what not?

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It's for elixirs and incense, but I count elixirs and incense late end-game.
Or if you struggle with something they can help push you through a particular boss. But usually gearing is enough until you only get marginal increases from gear.

No, not really. I just have had really bad luck with those drops.