So i dont get why Diablo 3 "failed"

[Redblade]

To be blunt, if you have some proof that Blizzard is lying about it, by all means show that proof. Otherwise I'd rather have a discussion based on the current reality than butting heads with someone who's defense against information they don't agree with is to simply say, "Well, it might not be true."

Never said they where lying, I said they are creative with the numbers, for obvious reasons, it's good PR. What I do claim is that the numbers hold no significant value based on the source and lack of parameter information regarding said numbers, a source that are obligated towards their shareholders to present such numbers in the most positive light they can to keep their stock price up.

[icedwarrior]

So I was browsing Imgur's random page, and found this:



It's been a while since I've played D3, let alone D2, but isn't this accurate? I don't remember much choice in D2.

[Redblade]

It's been a while since I've played D3, let alone D2, but isn't this accurate? I don't remember much choice in D2.

Well if you are to count every rune in D3 as a individual skill shouldn't each talent point in D2 be counted as an individual skill as well then?

Just sayin'

[icedwarrior]

Well if you are to count every rune in D3 as a individual skill shouldn't each talen point in D2 be counted as an individual skill as well then?

Just sayin'

The difference is a majority of the talents within D2 I recall being +X% damage, whilst a majority of D3 is "Fire 3 missles that deal 56% damage instead", chance to pierce, +4 Arcane Power on hit, tracks enemy, etc. It's a bit different.

D2 Talent Calculator
D3 Talent Calculator

[Redblade]

The difference is a majority of the talents within D2 I recall being +X% damage, whilst a majority of D3 is "Fire 3 missles that deal 56% damage instead", chance to pierce, +4 Arcane Power on hit, tracks enemy, etc. It's a bit different.

D2 Talent Calculator
D3 Talent Calculator

Even so, remove the rune variations of that picture and you got a more comparable base, the skill is the same with a different twist after all, it also doesn't take in to account the fact that you could assign your own attributes and that attributes actually served a purpose in D2.

The maker of the picture is clearly biased in he's comparison.

Edit: would be interesting to see a similar comparison for PoE that has 85 skills with 52 support gems. :P

[araine]

The reason it "failed" yeah any title that sells this many million copies is a hit for all gaming houses around. Is totally unreasonable expectations of what the game was going to give you. If you aim for pluto and only have your arrow land on the moon it is feeling like you failed when infacto just getting to the moon is good if you grasp the concept.

Major reason it failed was how flaws and bugs where allowed to be abused ad nauseum and that meant for some players that if they didnt get in the run of it right at the get go they where permanently poor. good luck making 250 million gold from ilvl 61 stuff. when some where able to abuse game mechanics and basically 1 shooting loot pinatas dropping ilvl 63 gear. This is probably what "failed" in the game the initial economy got destroyed very quickly when you need to get ilvl 63 gear to be able to sell it for any decent profit. And only 2 classes had the ability early on to solo farm those "exploits" like the mini bosses in Act4 at the start of a few of the levels there.

[icedwarrior]

Even so, remove the rune variations of that picture and you got a more comparable base, the skill is the same with a different twist after all

Isn't that kind of the point? That you can "customize" your character a bit more in D3 than D2? If I wanted to snare my opponents with an arcane attack, I could, or I could instead deal 15% damage at the cost of taking 10% extra damage, etc. You can even customize what your attacks could do: do you want to track an enemy that runs away a lot? Do you want to deal damage to X amount of enemies, while dealing less damage to your primary target?

The only way you could do this, iirc, in D2 is picking what skill you were using at the given time.

it also doesn't take in to account the fact that you could assign your own attributes and that attributes actually served a purpose in D2.

I suppose, but I don't find "+X health" to be a real interesting choice; I would rather choose between being able to teleport, being able to absorb X damage, etc. That's more of a choice, in my eyes.

The maker of the picture is clearly biased in he's comparison.

Why is he biased? Because he's making a comparison? He's not saying "Diablo 2's 'choice' vs. Diablo 3's real choices", nor is he drawing any conclusion. If you're inferring he's biased by making the point, we're all biased in one way or another.

Edit: would be interesting to see a similar comparison for PoE that has 85 skills with 52 support gems. :P

I can't make that comparison, seeing as I've never played PoE.

[Pendulous]

You can't really compare the two systems because they work in different ways.

[icedwarrior]

You can't really compare the two systems because they work in different ways.

But we can compare the entirety of the games?

[Zaqwert]

D3 was streamlined and simplified to death.

Blame the console or blame Blizzard catering to casuals or whatever.

They simplified, dumb down, streamlined, and neutered every single aspect of an already simple game. I mean Diablo 2 wasn't exactly complicated and they found a way to dumb it down by a factor of 1000.

D3 is easily the worst Blizzard game.

D3 is to Blizzard what Cars 2 is to Pixar, an turd money grab not up to their usual standards.

[Socialhealer]

So I was browsing Imgur's random page, and found this:

[IMG]ht

It's been a while since I've played D3, let alone D2, but isn't this accurate? I don't remember much choice in D2.

biggest load of shit ever, i had more keybinds on diablo 2 than diablo 3, unless you're going to change the runes non stop and delete the NV stack constantly.

my amazon had 8 keybinds i'd use often and a potion belt with no cooldown, image looks good and all but anyone who really played d2 knows skills were far better than d3. it's actually the reason i can't be bothered to play d3, pick a rune and thats the level of build/customization you get....rather have 100+ talent points any day.

[Resentful]

D3 was streamlined and simplified to death.

Blame the console or blame Blizzard catering to casuals or whatever.

They simplified, dumb down, streamlined, and neutered every single aspect of an already simple game. I mean Diablo 2 wasn't exactly complicated and they found a way to dumb it down by a factor of 1000.

D3 is easily the worst Blizzard game.

D3 is to Blizzard what Cars 2 is to Pixar, an turd money grab not up to their usual standards.

I'm still blaming Jay Wilson like literally the guy thought he could make a better game hence the change of the system in terms of the game.

[Redblade]

Isn't that kind of the point? That you can "customize" your character a bit more in D3 than D2? If I wanted to snare my opponents with an arcane attack, I could, or I could instead deal 15% damage at the cost of taking 10% extra damage, etc. You can even customize what your attacks could do: do you want to track an enemy that runs away a lot? Do you want to deal damage to X amount of enemies, while dealing less damage to your primary target?

The only way you could do this, iirc, in D2 is picking what skill you were using at the given time.

The problem is that due to how D3 skill system work and how it interacts with NV you can't just swap to fit the need of the moment, this resulting in figuring out what it "best" and sticking to that, much like the old skill trees, only with much less re-playability.

I suppose, but I don't find "+X health" to be a real interesting choice; I would rather choose between being able to teleport, being able to absorb X damage, etc. That's more of a choice, in my eyes.

I was more thinking about +str to be able to wear gear piece Y for example.

Why is he biased? Because he's making a comparison? He's not saying "Diablo 2's 'choice' vs. Diablo 3's real choices", nor is he drawing any conclusion. If you're inferring he's biased by making the point, we're all biased in one way or another.

It's biased because it doesn't try to make the comparison on equal terms, it's very different designs and as such to compare them we would have to compare more than just amount of skills in variants (runes) as D3 wins that comparison by default, and I'm quite sure the guy making the picture knew...

I can't make that comparison, seeing as I've never played PoE.

Each skill can be linked (modified) to some or all of the support gems up to 5 supports, lets just say the picture would be quite a bit larger.

[Deleted]

Some people on this forum believe that because they aren't playing the game that it must have failed.

On the whole is may have been somewhat a disaster but it still satisfies many. It hasn't failed. We all bought it in the beginning, didn't we?

[Redblade]

We all bought it in the beginning, didn't we?

Which isn't a measure of a games success for the players, it's only a measure of success for the publisher. Yes there is a difference.

[Legion]

Correction. Diablo sold 12 million from May 15 to Dec 31 2012.

As since it is STILL in most top 20 sales charts (such like Amazon.de), it probably is already around 13 million copies sold.

AND we now know around 3 million UNIQUE players log in per month... after 10 months.

Which are ALL impressive figures.

I play HC mode and playing like this the game is fabulous.

Is it...is it really you? The BenBoske? Uber famous Blizzard forum troll BenBoske? I...I'm speecheless. You honor us with your presence, great sir. I know this is offtopic, but my words are sincere. You are the most dedicated troll I have ever seen in my life. This is not sarcasm. This is not irony. I shit you not, I have never seen someone so dedicated to the cause of trolling.

[Haven]

D3 has a silly DRM and RMAH. Two things that kind of kill the pleasure with marketing. Otherwise the mechanics are good if not genius - I really loved the variations of skills provided by runes and the ability to respec and try out different combinations freely.

[steveyboy]

Which isn't a measure of a games success for the players, it's only a measure of success for the publisher. Yes there is a difference.

You are clearly going to bash the game regardless of what proof you are given that it is not a failure.

Most games have replayability, doesn't mean a person is going to play the same game day in day out for 8 months.

Give me an example of a game that sold well and still has over 2 million people still playing it 8 months on excluding mmos.

[Szemere]

You are clearly going to bash the game regardless of what proof you are given that it is not a failure.

Most games have replayability, doesn't mean a person is going to play the same game day in day out for 8 months.

Give me an example of a game that sold well and still has over 2 million people still playing it 8 months on excluding mmos.

The average CoD/Battlefield franchise game.

[Redblade]

You are clearly going to bash the game regardless of what proof you are given that it is not a failure.

Most games have replayability, doesn't mean a person is going to play the same game day in day out for 8 months.

Give me an example of a game that sold well and still has over 2 million people still playing it 8 months on excluding mmos.

The average CoD/Battlefield franchise game.

What he said, also Minecraft comes to mind, perhaps not as much anymore but Counter-Strike a few years back, probably has more than 2 million still. I'm sure there are many more that doesn't come to mind here and now.


And btw, I'm not bashing the game, this is a thread about Diablo 3's success or lack there of hence I'm discussing it. If I where bashing it I'd make posts similar to BenBos just from the opposite state of mind.