Mega-Thread: Gun Control Thread

[misterpuk]

Dude, when I was 3 I was afraid I was going to get eaten by the garbage man. You don't need to explain shit like this to a 3 year old. They will be afraid of things.

You say "There, there" and hug the little kiddo.

[Antiganon]

Dude, when I was 3 I was afraid I was going to get eaten by the garbage man. You don't need to explain shit like this to a 3 year old. They will be afraid of things.

You say "There, there" and hug the little kiddo.

That might make him feel better for a few minutes, but it doesn't make him less afraid to go to school.

[AeneasBK]

my point is that basically everyone doesn't understand concepts like "statistically insignificant".

ftfy

[baskev]

Florida could have been prevented. They just needed to act and not ignore. The kids could have not bullied and ostracize him.

What other solutions do you propose without restricting freedoms or outright denying rights?

First a thing that most people forget:
Rights are not absolute.
You have a right to drive. But you need to earn and proof that you can drive.
And that right can be taken away.


What things can be done to prevent ( or atleast lower shootings).

Licenses: Just like with cars. More complex guns need a other licenses. 1 for handguns, 1 for hunting rifles etc. And some should be harder to get. ( bigger back ground check etc). But also you need to show to a ( a instructor) that you can handle , clean the gun. Know the laws etc. Just like with cars a theory and practical exam.

Background: If a person has a certain type of crime, rage, instability problems he or she should not get guns.

Taking guns away: If a person does something unlawful or is no longer capable ( aka has committed a crime, has become unstable etc). Government should be able to take away the guns. Even if he or she has not done anything yet. Just like with cars. If you get to many/big DUI.

All gun type's should be able to be owned: But certain guns, a person should always store it somewhere save. ( if you have enough money to buy 2 or 4 guns. You have enough money for a gun save). Breaking it is guns away.

Open carry laws: Its bull shit insane. If you are walking you should not be able to carry a gun if you are in a residential zone. So hunting is okay. But open carrying is just showing your dick.

Ammo: standard ammo should only be sold to private gun owners. Special ammo should only be sold to certified gun ranges. So people can shoot them there.

Weapon additions: Anything that changes ( upgrades) the fire power, speed etc of a gun should be banned or only allowed if the gun is stored in a save at a certified gun range.

Time to get guns: Guns should be sold with a time period of 2 weeks. ( i know it is in most cases like this.) but it should be in all cases. And background check should be done before you get the gun. ( a recheck)

Country wide system: There should be a system where gun sellers register guns sales to persons. So if you buy a gun at wall mart and then 1 day later you buy one at ( insert hunting store). It should give a ping in that system. If a person who is on a watch list because of ( insert problem) it should give a ping. And this data base should be linked to all agency's.


america's emotional problem; where do these shootings come from. There are other shootings all around the world and other country's with guns. But america seems to be the best by a larger margin in the western world.

[Deleted]

If they are afraid, then that's your own damn fault for not talking to them...or perhaps you did just that and expressed your own shitty ignorant fears.

Oh, look at that; High school rifle team gets big donation after NRA grant rejected

The long and short of it, the school board played politics and rejected the grant, local businesses said "f-u" and ponied up the money...and then some for the team.

The NRA is such a goody 2 shoes company. Oh yeah, for sure.

It's hard to cite a definitive number about how many school shootings American had. You know why?
Because the federal government does not study gun violence in the United States and the National Rifle Association (NRA) has opposed any measure to fund research or accounting of America's gun epidemic.

[petej0]

That might make him feel better for a few minutes, but it doesn't make him less afraid to go to school.

Why is he afraid of getting shot at school? How is a 3 year old even aware of such a situation unless they are being fed this information to invoke terror.

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The NRA is such a goody 2 shoes company. Oh yeah, for sure.

It's hard to cite a definitive number about how many school shootings American had. You know why?
Because the federal government does not study gun violence in the United States and the National Rifle Association (NRA) has opposed any measure to fund research or accounting of America's gun epidemic.

You dont need a fucking study to cite statistics ugh....wtf seriously?

[Antiganon]

Why is he afraid of getting shot at school? How is a 3 year old even aware of such a situation unless they are being fed this information to invoke terror.

Because they do active shooter drills.

To be clear, he isn't even afraid of being shot. I don't think he even understands what being shot is - I certainly haven't talked to him about it yet.

He is afraid because the drills are to hide so they are safe from bad people that might want to hurt them.

Like I said earlier - he was initially scared by fire drills as well, but fire is a tangible thing that we can explain to him in a safe way, and there are active safety measures to prevent him from being hurt by the fire all over the place, including at home.

There is no analog for active shooter drills.

[petej0]

Because they do active shooter drills.

At that age they dont have to call them that. They can call them "Code Red Drills", unless of course the purpose is to invoke fear so parents have to deal with their kids being afraid of guns and having them contact their politicians to ban guns so that their kids wouldnt be in fear. You know the whole operate out of emotions crap.

Still, even if they did call them "Active Shooter Drills" there is no real reason they should be more afraid of it over a "Bomb scare" drill or a normal "fire" drill. They dont fully understand the danger and for them at that age it is all the same.

[Dystemper]

They are afraid because the teachers are conducting drills where they need to hide because somebody could be coming through the school to shoot them.

To be clear, my son is not yet 3.

Try explaining concepts like statistical insignificance at that age.

He was terrified of fire drills the first time they had one as well, but that was much easier - there are firefighters that come into his school to talk about fire safety, smoke detectors that tell him when a fire is nearby, sprinklers that can put the fire out, and he can run away from the fire to get outside to safety.

We were able to reinforce those truths at home by testing the smoke detectors, purposely burning some food in the oven so he knew how the smoke detectors worked with a real fire, he knows that candles and other sources of fire are hot and he shouldn't touch them, and we went to my brother in law's house, where there is a big fire pit, to show him how even if it is a big fire, you can still put it out with water. We went to a local fair where he met some of the firefighters, got to see their gear and the big trucks, and now he feels much safer. He knows that fire is dangerous, but there are things and people that can help keep him safe.

None of those things apply to active shooters. There may or may not be police officers to talk about safety when there is an active shooter (not, in his school). There are no "active shooter alarms". There are no automated turrets to shoot an active shooter before they kill anyone. He can't run from an active shooter, he has to hide, back against the wall, crouched low on the floor, until the teacher tells him it's safe.

It is a fucking terrifying situation for small children, and for you to act like that is a parenting failure on my part is the height of ignorance. Were he in middle school or high school, yeah, that's on me for not explaining. But what am I supposed to say to a 2 1/2 year old?

We conducted Tornado drills, earth quake drills and atomic bomb drills. Others drill for terrorist attacks. Preparing kids for emergencies in school has always been a thing

[petej0]

We conducted Tornado drills, earth quake drills and atomic bomb drills. Others drill for terrorist attacks. Preparing kids for emergencies in school has always been a thing

Yeah, but this one is super scary!!

[Dystemper]

First a thing that most people forget:
Rights are not absolute.
You have a right to drive. But you need to earn and proof that you can drive.
And that right can be taken away.


What things can be done to prevent ( or atleast lower shootings).

Licenses: Just like with cars. More complex guns need a other licenses. 1 for handguns, 1 for hunting rifles etc. And some should be harder to get. ( bigger back ground check etc). But also you need to show to a ( a instructor) that you can handle , clean the gun. Know the laws etc. Just like with cars a theory and practical exam.

Background: If a person has a certain type of crime, rage, instability problems he or she should not get guns.

Taking guns away: If a person does something unlawful or is no longer capable ( aka has committed a crime, has become unstable etc). Government should be able to take away the guns. Even if he or she has not done anything yet. Just like with cars. If you get to many/big DUI.

All gun type's should be able to be owned: But certain guns, a person should always store it somewhere save. ( if you have enough money to buy 2 or 4 guns. You have enough money for a gun save). Breaking it is guns away.

Open carry laws: Its bull shit insane. If you are walking you should not be able to carry a gun if you are in a residential zone. So hunting is okay. But open carrying is just showing your dick.

Ammo: standard ammo should only be sold to private gun owners. Special ammo should only be sold to certified gun ranges. So people can shoot them there.

Weapon additions: Anything that changes ( upgrades) the fire power, speed etc of a gun should be banned or only allowed if the gun is stored in a save at a certified gun range.

Time to get guns: Guns should be sold with a time period of 2 weeks. ( i know it is in most cases like this.) but it should be in all cases. And background check should be done before you get the gun. ( a recheck)

Country wide system: There should be a system where gun sellers register guns sales to persons. So if you buy a gun at wall mart and then 1 day later you buy one at ( insert hunting store). It should give a ping in that system. If a person who is on a watch list because of ( insert problem) it should give a ping. And this data base should be linked to all agency's.


america's emotional problem; where do these shootings come from. There are other shootings all around the world and other country's with guns. But america seems to be the best by a larger margin in the western world.

First of all Driving is not a Right it is a privilege.

[Antiganon]

At that age they dont have to call them that. They can call them "Code Red Drills", unless of course the purpose is to invoke fear so parents have to deal with their kids being afraid of guns and having them contact their politicians to ban guns so that their kids wouldnt be in fear. You know the whole operate out of emotions crap.

You aren't even reading my posts anymore.

There is no point in continuing to discuss this.

My son is put in a situation in school where he has to go hide in a corner, sitting on the wall, be incredibly quiet, with all the lights off, and has no tangible understanding of what is happening or why.

It makes him afraid to be in school.

To not do the drills would be idiocy - children should know how to handle the situation in case something does happen.

But I am not going to lie to my child and tell him that everything will be fine and there are good people to protect him. In his school, there aren't. There are teachers, most between 19 and 25, all of whom would be just as terrified in an active shooter situation. None of them armed.

So excuse me if I get a little pissed off at the right spouting bullshit like "Well it's statistically insignificant and nothing works anyway so why bother trying?".

[Dystemper]

Yeah, but this one is super scary!!

When i was in kindergarten and elementary school , we were told all the time that at any minute Russia could launch nuclear missiles at us and wipe out every one in the world. That Nuclear war was going to destroy everything we loved.

- - - Updated - - -

You aren't even reading my posts anymore.

There is no point in continuing to discuss this.

My son is put in a situation in school where he has to go hide in a corner, sitting on the wall, be incredibly quiet, with all the lights off, and has no tangible understanding of what is happening or why.

It makes him afraid to be in school.

To not do the drills would be idiocy - children should know how to handle the situation in case something does happen.

But I am not going to lie to my child and tell him that everything will be fine and there are good people to protect him. In his school, there aren't. There are teachers, most between 19 and 25, all of whom would be just as terrified in an active shooter situation. None of them armed.

So excuse me if I get a little pissed off at the right spouting bullshit like "Well it's statistically insignificant and nothing works anyway so why bother trying?".

I had to hhide under my desk with my arms over my head as soon as we heard the sirens knowing that nothing was going to safe us from being vaporized at the worst or if we were really lucky, die a slow agonizing death from Radiation sickness.

[Antiganon]

We conducted Tornado drills, earth quake drills and atomic bomb drills. Others drill for terrorist attacks. Preparing kids for emergencies in school has always been a thing

Tornados are big storms. They can break trees and buildings. Storms happen on a regular basis. My son has been in hurricanes and horrible blizzards before, and he understands that when shit is falling out of the sky on top of your head, you go to a safe place in the building where nothing is going to fall on you. Same for earthquakes (though I live in CT so earthquakes are rarely a thing here, and low impact when they do happen). There is a designated tornado/earthquake shelter in a stairwell with multiple reinforced walls at his school, so he knows that is the safe place to be when the weather is scary outside.

I mentioned fire drills as well - there is a clear plan of action, he knows where to go, what to do, how to get help. It makes sense, and we can make it tangible at home with very little effort.

Active shooter drills have no real world analog that doesn't involve you being shot at. Thus it is terrifying for small children, who have a very difficult time grasping abstract concepts. All he knows is that he has to be very quiet, make himself very small, and hide in a dark room until people tell him it is safe to come out. If you can't understand why that would scare a 3 year old, you have never met a 3 year old.

I imagine terrorist and atomic bomb drills were similarly terrifying for small children.

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When i was in kindergarten and elementary school , we were told all the time that at any minute Russia could launch nuclear missiles at us and wipe out every one in the world. That Nuclear war was going to destroy everything we loved.

This is different.

This is a bad person coming into your school just to hurt you and your friends, for no reason.

These are fucking preschoolers.

[Dystemper]

Tornados are big storms. They can break trees and buildings. Storms happen on a regular basis. My son has been in hurricanes and horrible blizzards before, and he understands that when shit is falling out of the sky on top of your head, you go to a safe place in the building where nothing is going to fall on you. Same for earthquakes (though I live in CT so earthquakes are rarely a thing here, and low impact when they do happen). There is a designated tornado/earthquake shelter in a stairwell with multiple reinforced walls at his school, so he knows that is the safe place to be when the weather is scary outside.

I mentioned fire drills as well - there is a clear plan of action, he knows where to go, what to do, how to get help. It makes sense, and we can make it tangible at home with very little effort.

Active shooter drills have no real world analog that doesn't involve you being shot at. Thus it is terrifying for small children, who have a very difficult time grasping abstract concepts. All he knows is that he has to be very quiet, make himself very small, and hide in a dark room until people tell him it is safe to come out. If you can't understand why that would scare a 3 year old, you have never met a 3 year old.

I imagine terrorist and atomic bomb drills were similarly terrifying for small children.

- - - Updated - - -

This is different.

This is a bad person coming into your school just to hurt you and your friends, for no reason.

These are fucking preschoolers.

Have you taught your kid that strangers could snatch them up off the street and hurt them for no reason? Or that if they get away from you in a store a stranger could take them and hurt them for no reason?

[petej0]

Active shooter drills have no real world analog that doesn't involve you being shot at. Thus it is terrifying for small children, who have a very difficult time grasping abstract concepts. All he knows is that he has to be very quiet, make himself very small, and hide in a dark room until people tell him it is safe to come out. If you can't understand why that would scare a 3 year old, you have never met a 3 year old.

I have, they call this hide & seek. If that terrifies your child then there are other concerns.

This is different.

This is a bad person coming into your school just to hurt you and your friends, for no reason.

These are fucking preschoolers.

Different? As opposed to a bad country lofting a nuke at your school for no reason or someone detonating a bomb at your school for no reason?

[Deleted]

You dont need a fucking study to cite statistics ugh....wtf seriously?

But its strange, no?
Neither the government study the situation and the NRA refuses to help.
So we only have data by Washington Post and other outside sources...

Really strange, seems like there isnt even a problem to study.

[petej0]

But its strange, no?
Neither the government study the situation and the NRA refuses to help.
So we only have data by Washington Post and other outside sources...

Really strange, seems like there isnt even a problem to study.

Its only strange if you think the CDC has some magical power that they can deduce different stats from the currently provided stats. The data is easy to find, The FBI (and others like homeland security I am sure) have the stats, the local police have the stats. You dont need another government agency to collect the data to tell us the same thing the FBI already can.

[Svifnymr]

But its strange, no?
Neither the government study the situation and the NRA refuses to help.
So we only have data by Washington Post and other outside sources...

Really strange, seems like there isnt even a problem to study.

You understand that the NRA backed measure penalized studies about very specific things, not "gun violence" or whatnot? I know it's common to mischaracterise what happened and try to make it a broad ban. Not that it matters, since the NIJ does such studies among others, it was just aimed at the CDC anti-gun studies.

[Antiganon]

Have you taught your kid that strangers could snatch them up off the street and hurt them for no reason? Or that if they get away from you in a store a stranger could take them and hurt them for no reason?

Yes. They need to stay with mommy and daddy when we are out at a store, or wherever. Strangers could try to hurt them, and they should not talk to strangers. If a stranger tries to talk to them or touch them, they need to scream for help as loud as they can.

This is basic shit.