How bad the legendary shoulders are ?

[Deleted]

Hello !

Just making a new thread about the legendary shoulders (And i'm already sorry if there is another one still up. My bad)

Anyway i was wondering if you guys know how good/bad the legendary shoulders are ? I just got them yesterday and runned some sims about it...

The result is something hilarious, i had the set from the mythic dungeon in suramar (the Inferno chest and frozen pendulum shoulders; Bonus set : 3k Versatility ) , both 855.

So i swapped the Suramar shoulders with my Frozen pendulum one and guess what ? For a range of 40ilvl apart i only gain 4K Dps . Yeah you read me 4k dps between a 855 shoulders and the legendary one.

Plus this legendary is pretty cancer to play. You have to delay some cd and stuff to optimize the passive from the shoulders which is really really bad in my opinion.... Any idea if those shoulders would get back to their former glory somehow ? Or at least reworked ?

Another point : It seems that the shoulders from the nighthold in NORMAL ( which is 875 ) are better than the legendary shoulders at the moment..... All this wait for those terrible shoulders DDD At least the skin is not that bad with my Transmog..... Kappa.

EDIT : My thought are that if i drop a Set from arcway and CoS I could just not wear my legendary shoulders. I'll need a set with and average ilvl of 875 tho.

Thanks Blizzard for giving me a Legendary that i can easly swap with some MM+ gear this tier

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Bumppperino

[Deleted]

Hello !

Just making a new thread about the legendary shoulders (And i'm already sorry if there is another one still up. My bad)

Anyway i was wondering if you guys know how good/bad the legendary shoulders are ? I just got them yesterday and runned some sims about it...

The result is something hilarious, i had the set from the mythic dungeon in suramar (the Inferno chest and frozen pendulum shoulders; Bonus set : 3k Versatility ) , both 855.

So i swapped the Suramar shoulders with my Frozen pendulum one and guess what ? For a range of 40ilvl apart i only gain 4K Dps . Yeah you read me 4k dps between a 855 shoulders and the legendary one.

Plus this legendary is pretty cancer to play. You have to delay some cd and stuff to optimize the passive from the shoulders which is really really bad in my opinion.... Any idea if those shoulders would get back to their former glory somehow ? Or at least reworked ?

Another point : It seems that the shoulders from the nighthold in NORMAL ( which is 875 ) are better than the legendary shoulders at the moment..... All this wait for those terrible shoulders DDD At least the skin is not that bad with my Transmog..... Kappa.

EDIT : My thought are that if i drop a Set from arcway and CoS I could just not wear my legendary shoulders. I'll need a set with and average ilvl of 875 tho.

Thanks Blizzard for giving me a Legendary that i can easly swap with some MM+ gear this tier

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Bumppperino

The shoulders change your playstyle and talent setup for that matter.
I´m not sure that the sim is actually adjusting the APL when the shoulders are equipped, so you cannot trust those sims in that case.

That being said, the shoulders are not really that great. Bracers, Belt and Ring all seem to be better options.

[Deleted]

Hey, Thanks for answering !

Well I know that the shoulders change the playstyle but it's really ridiculous... For exemple I have to wait sometimes 20s for my gargoyle to be up and then cast DA. Have to wait for my Apo/SR Combo to cast DA. So much things delayed that's absurd.... . For the talent setup i'm not really quite sure . Still running the same setup as always ( do you have any idea of a talent setup ? ) .

For the APL I can clearly see the damage boost on my AoTD and gargoyle in the sims... Even though it's really really low for the gargoyle and AoTD (Anyway the Aotd just hit like papper punch so w/e)...

[Deleted]

Hey, Thanks for answering !

Well I know that the shoulders change the playstyle but it's really ridiculous... For exemple I have to wait sometimes 20s for my gargoyle to be up and then cast DA. Have to wait for my Apo/SR Combo to cast DA. So much things delayed that's absurd.... . For the talent setup i'm not really quite sure . Still running the same setup as always ( do you have any idea of a talent setup ? ) .

For the APL I can clearly see the damage boost on my AoTD and gargoyle in the sims... Even though it's really really low for the gargoyle and AoTD (Anyway the Aotd just hit like papper punch so w/e)...

If you are using Shadow Infusion and have 20s left on your gargoyle, just go ahead and transform your ghoul anyways. The Gargoyle lasts 40s, the shoulder buff 10s (correct me if im wrong) - so you will buff your gargoyle with the next transformation towards the end of the gargoyle duration.

[Deleted]

Hey,

my idea would be to change Shadow Infusion with Infected Claws. Because that way all CDs line up perfectly if you dont mess up your rotation.

Pull would probably go like this:

AotD->Pot->Gargoyle->DT->Normal Rotation.
The only thing i dont know is if ghouls summoned by apocalypse are buffed eve though DT is already running. Then you probably delay DT until you cast Apocalypse.
With IC talented, you can always use DT together with Apocalypse and Gargoyle.

Rekkles

[Deleted]

If you are using Shadow Infusion and have 20s left on your gargoyle, just go ahead and transform your ghoul anyways. The Gargoyle lasts 40s, the shoulder buff 10s (correct me if im wrong) - so you will buff your gargoyle with the next transformation towards the end of the gargoyle duration.

Yeah this scenario is not a problem for me. I was talking about waiting to cast DT because the gargoyle was on CD / Waiting to have Apoc/SR Combo to cast DT . The shoulder buff last 20s not 10 =) .

Rekkles
Hey,

my idea would be to change Shadow Infusion with Infected Claws. Because that way all CDs line up perfectly if you dont mess up your rotation.

Pull would probably go like this:

AotD->Pot->Gargoyle->DT->Normal Rotation.
The only thing i dont know is if ghouls summoned by apocalypse are buffed eve though DT is already running. Then you probably delay DT until you cast Apocalypse.
With IC talented, you can always use DT together with Apocalypse and Gargoyle.

Rekkles

Hey Rekkles,

About the Apoc Goule you have to buff them with DT (Summon them then Dark transformation) so the pull would look like this : AOTD -> Pot > Outbreak > Gargoyle > FS (till 8 FW) -> SR -> Apoc -> DT

I was thinking about switching SI with IC but the problem is it will not line up with Apoc (Correct me if i'm wrong) Apoc is a 1.5min CD , DT is 1min .You'll still have 30s delayed with IC and that, all the times. It will scale with gargoyle tho but eh...

[Deleted]

True, sorry totally thought that DT had 45 sec cd. Then you just should test if its worth to delay or not.

[Deleted]

True, sorry totally thought that DT had 45 sec cd. Then you just should test if its worth to delay or not.

Playing with IC give me an average of 200dps boost. Almost 300 tho... Kappa

I don't get it. Why is this leg that sh***y ? I'd gladly trade it for the legendary boots or the utility ring Sepuzu ....

[0verdose]

Playing with IC give me an average of 200dps boost. Almost 300 tho... Kappa

I don't get it. Why is this leg that sh***y ? I'd gladly trade it for the legendary boots or the utility ring Sepuzu ....

I was pissed off when I got sephuz's secret but I'm actually glad I didn't get the shoulders. It seems like it's not very good and I've grown to like the rings ms boost + haste proc it has. It can proc on bosses every time our ghoul stun is up so like every 1 and a half. It provides decent utility I guess. Not great but not as bad as the neck!

[Deleted]

Yeah....

Those shoulders are very bad and I'm very intrigued by the fact no one else talked about it in the forum.. Am I using those like an idiot or are they really bad ?

[Deleted]

Yeah....

Those shoulders are very bad and I'm very intrigued by the fact no one else talked about it in the forum.. Am I using those like an idiot or are they really bad ?

Honestly, they're a two-edge sword. They're great in the form of stats if you have nothing comparable, but awful in the sense that they make you switch the way you play, your talents, your cooldown lineups, basically everything, just to take advantage of a lackluster bonus effect to boost the damage of lackluster pets. So in the end, you're changing up everything just to get a bit more damage out of stuff that doesn't really do that much damage to begin with.

I personally have those shoulders too, and I'll be honest here. I swapped them out for Sephuz ring. Yea, you read that right, Sephuz. I had 870 shoulders with good stats, compared to the legendary's low haste/high mastery (trash), while Sephuz has huge crit, haste, and a socket, which replaced my 840 Melandrus ring (10% AA damage passive ring).
In terms of sims, it's a very slight DPS loss (under 1k difference), but on the other hand, I don't have to play a clunky talent spec, using talents I don't like (like SI, for example), having to deal with delaying cooldowns, etc. From the little time I played with the shoulders, I noticed myself running out of resources (runes, RP) much more often than without, just because of my talent choice and trying to line up cooldowns properly. Sure, my damage increased with them, but it also made gameplay much worse and less intuitive.

(PS: my other equipped legendary is the belt, fyi)

[Deleted]

Honestly, they're a two-edge sword. They're great in the form of stats if you have nothing comparable, but awful in the sense that they make you switch the way you play, your talents, your cooldown lineups, basically everything, just to take advantage of a lackluster bonus effect to boost the damage of lackluster pets. So in the end, you're changing up everything just to get a bit more damage out of stuff that doesn't really do that much damage to begin with.

I personally have those shoulders too, and I'll be honest here. I swapped them out for Sephuz ring. Yea, you read that right, Sephuz. I had 870 shoulders with good stats, compared to the legendary's low haste/high mastery (trash), while Sephuz has huge crit, haste, and a socket, which replaced my 840 Melandrus ring (10% AA damage passive ring).
In terms of sims, it's a very slight DPS loss (under 1k difference), but on the other hand, I don't have to play a clunky talent spec, using talents I don't like (like SI, for example), having to deal with delaying cooldowns, etc. From the little time I played with the shoulders, I noticed myself running out of resources (runes, RP) much more often than without, just because of my talent choice and trying to line up cooldowns properly. Sure, my damage increased with them, but it also made gameplay much worse and less intuitive.

(PS: my other equipped legendary is the belt, fyi)

Lucky you to have 3 leg ! That was my first and had it yesterday . Yeah what a disappointment

[Deleted]

Lucky you to have 3 leg ! That was my first and had it yesterday . Yeah what a disappointment

I did luck out, got my first 2 in 2 straight days, before that whole legendary bug was disclosed, first week in Legion. Got the Sephuz yesterday, in the raid I was test-driving the shoulders in. I was pretty disappointed in the shoulders, so getting Sephuz was sort of a relief, even if it's a small downgrade in theory, it'll play much better and I can change my talents without losing out on much. Besides, dat 35%/20% crit/haste is sexy.

That said, don't stress too much over it. In the end, the shoulders are probably a huge upgrade in stats alone for you, so it'll always be a nice upgrade. If you're not feeling the effect too much, just ignore it entirely. I can see how it sucks to get a legendary and not be able to utilize it to its full potential, but let's be honest, there isn't that much potential in those shoulders to begin with. Maybe if they buff pets in 7.1, but I wouldn't hold my breath, honestly.

[Deleted]

I did luck out, got my first 2 in 2 straight days, before that whole legendary bug was disclosed, first week in Legion. Got the Sephuz yesterday, in the raid I was test-driving the shoulders in. I was pretty disappointed in the shoulders, so getting Sephuz was sort of a relief, even if it's a small downgrade in theory, it'll play much better and I can change my talents without losing out on much. Besides, dat 35%/20% crit/haste is sexy.

That said, don't stress too much over it. In the end, the shoulders are probably a huge upgrade in stats alone for you, so it'll always be a nice upgrade. If you're not feeling the effect too much, just ignore it entirely. I can see how it sucks to get a legendary and not be able to utilize it to its full potential, but let's be honest, there isn't that much potential in those shoulders to begin with. Maybe if they buff pets in 7.1, but I wouldn't hold my breath, honestly.

Yeah I do hope that those shoulders will get the rework Blizz told about some legendary but eh . #Believe.

[jSewell]

Have you tried Dark Arbiter with the shoulders?

[Deleted]

Yeah. Definitly not an option. You just loose 10k dps using DA

[ddsad2212]

I've been running them from the start (not by choice, only other legend to drop is boots). A few things I have noticed, the 30% damage increase isn't worth missing a DT cast on damn near any ability. I would only wait if you have both AP and gargoyle coming up at once. If you only have one I'd honestly just pop DT when it comes off CD (ofc if you can wait and not miss a cast then you do)

The issue with this legendary is that people play around it to much to try and keep hitting it when the buff matters, if you're missing DT cast due to this you'll end up loosing DPS from it. Even more so if you have shadow infusion (which as a side point is probably a required talent with this item).

The item is fine, it's better then anything else in that slot even if they have better stats but don't play around it to much.

[Deleted]

Allright I'll try to use it only on Gargoyle then. But that's really not that much of an increase in that case.

[Coldvibes]

It used to be a fucking great legendary... then they shit all over DA

[Deleted]

It used to be a fucking great legendary... then they shit all over DA

Not over DA over the shoulders themselves . Passed from 200% damaga increased to 100% then 50% and to make sur the shoulders are ded 30%. I don't get all this change since the Beta... Too many ppl whining about the shoulders being too powerful ? Why not making a which buff our summom separatly like "When you use DT your gargoyle have 30% damage increased and our AoTD have 100% damage increased" ? Could have been great. Those shoulder are utter crap...