Battle for Azeroth Alpha/Beta General Discussion

[Deleted]

oooh i get if you are just a jerk trolling, gotcha

come back when you have decent prot paladin experience in legion, fyi i tanked every mythic boss in the exp, doubt you have even half xp

[tristannarutofan]

if anyone INTELLIGENT wants to talk about it. then we could discuss how part of "tanking with strategy" involved knowing which abilities you have can be cast any time and which need preparation (and its not that hard to prepare 1.5 seconds ahead of time).

its ACTIVE mitigation. part of fighting effectively is using your abilities effectively. If ,my shield of the righteous is off gcd but my heal isnt then i strategize around that.

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come back when you have decent prot paladin experience in legion, fyi i tanked every mythic boss in the exp, doubt you have even half xp

if that claim were true you'd be a good player and know that you can work with anything.

back in bc Druids barely had any mitigation they took the most dmg and that was only mitigated by having 50% more health than others. ppl adapted.

these changes wont affect anything and will change to something different next expansion and change again and again.

[Deleted]

[QUOTE=Stijne;49074539]Danath Trollbane looking like a proper king now!


Hi mate cause im new to forums i cannot PM you back. what is your battle tag ? or you can add mine soulbandit#2660

[Seramore]

oooh i get if you are just a jerk trolling, gotcha

You clearly don't know anything about the impact of these changes, so why are you defending it and saying it doesn't feel bad? (Spoiler: it does)

[Jastall]

if anyone INTELLIGENT wants to talk about it. then we could discuss how part of "tanking with strategy" involved knowing which abilities you have can be cast any time and which need preparation (and its not that hard to prepare 1.5 seconds ahead of time).

its ACTIVE mitigation. part of fighting effectively is using your abilities effectively. If ,my shield of the righteous is off gcd but my heal isnt then i strategize around that.

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if that claim were true you'd be a good player and know that you can work with anything.

back in bc Druids barely had any mitigation they took the most dmg and that was only mitigated by having 50% more health than others. ppl adapted.

these changes wont affect anything and will change to something different next expansion and change again and again.

Translation: everyone will be glued to their DBM timers because that's the only way to ''predict'' anything in an actual fight.

And us being able to adapt doesn't mean it's a good change. It's rather adapt to something that increases my fun, not decreases it.

[Chickat]

Really loving the Horde Tabards...

Those tabards are really high quality.

[Steampunkette]

Ways to slow down combat within WoW:

1) Reduce the amount of powers that can be activated simultaneously. This has the added benefit of reducing the effectiveness of ability-stacking, creating big burst windows, and encourages more spread out CD use. It has the side benefit of making the game more accessible for players with physical or mental issues that make no-window-button-juggling difficult.

2) Reduce resource generation/recovery to have people "Flag Out" of their resources. While this slows down gameplay, it is often a frustrating option players try to find ways around. Doesn't address the issue of stacking cooldowns for burst phases and leaving the player with no CDs for later.

3) Increase the number of windows where cooldowns are desirable. This could encourage players to spread out their CD usage, but is just as likely to be treated as a series of "Burst" phases for DPS and "Heal Checks" for healers, while tanks throw their cooldowns at whatever they feel appropriate. DPS Burst will happen on the first opportunity, and stacking of CDs will continue as normal, negating any slowdown and increasing relative difficulty for everyone, pushing more people out of the high end bubble.

There are other solutions, of course, but those are the first three that jumped to my mind. And of them? Adding the GCD has the greatest relative benefit to the game itself, even if it "Robs" 1% of the playerbase.

[Seramore]

Ways to slow down combat within WoW:

1) You don't, because combat doesn't need to be slowed down.

[tristannarutofan]

Yeah prot paladin plays like hot garbage with heal on gcd


The thing i dont understand with all this is the following: To me, its obvious what they are trying to do with this, they want to slow shit down. Which btw. i am in favor of, i dont think tab targeting mmos should have evolved this way where you playing fucking piano.

However if thats their goal, if someone like it or dont, why are they going the way of adding gcd to almost everything? You dont need to be a game desginer to understand that there are more elegant ways to this

thats because thats not what they are doing

they want you to make more choices on a micro level.

right now if a hunter wants to avoid an aoe they can do disengage WHILE doing their rotation. its 'faced paced" and you can see the appeal to that. however there is no real strategy in it. you are just doing your rotation while using your second hand attention to maintain positioning

with this (for example) that if you realize that you might be targeted by an aoe in the next few seconds you might use the Maintain version of your rotation so that you are ready do use your GCD to disengage out of an aoe and THEN do your burst. With alternative strategy being Being ready to move with instant cast abilities,.

its the same with tanking abilities. Your instant heal is instant but its still on the gcd so that means you cant afford to Almost die and then instantly heal yourself for 40% of your missing health. you are going to want to use your active mitigation shield of righteousness to PREVENT that from happening and either use your heal when as filler while you wait, or to heal the dmg that got through your mitigation.

its part of like they said in their last big interview about it. making a choice, on a case by case basis, if what you are going to do. Do i want to spend this second casting an instant heal? or use it to cast my damage buff? or an offensive ability.

it remains to be seen if this will be good design as that will require the Main player base playing with it.

However you CANT critique something unless you understand it . And as they said ThAT is their intent. not to 'slow things down" and not to screw over players for no reason like certain alleged mythic paladin raiders would like to claim. to make the spells you cast be a Choice.

Just like in all fantasy games. Final fantasy, D&D "i can cast Haste but that means i dont get to attack this turn. should i try to kill them instead of casting it? if i roll low damage then they might not die and it would have been better to cast Haste". "it would be better to use Friaga this turn to take advantage of Yuna's buff. but if LuLu gets attacked i'll have TWO party members KOed and need to wast e2 turns using phoenix downs.."

and of course...its not THAT much of a disadvantage. boss fights are 5 to 8 minutes long. having to wait .5 seconds to use shield slam after you charge back into melee range isnt going to have THAT much of an effect.

and regardless with how right or accurate i am THATS how you discuss things intelligently. not doing your best impression of Johnny Awesome.

[Aeluron Lightsong]

#2 sounds horrible and shouldn't be suggested at all(Punkette I know you're trying to help but I'm just sayin)

#1 Might be good but really it depends on what's separated and that's probably the hard part.


I don't really see slowing down combat as necessary. I mean leveling has gotten *harder* in recent years(Level scaling). Slowing combat down doesn't really make it fun.

i mean...turn based games are extremely popular and WoW came from Warcraft which resulted in spending half the game minin resources and waiting for units to be trained.

Not saying WoW needs to be 'slower" but 'slow' doesnt mean 'bad' In the game industry

Oh for fucks sake. Design in an RTS is MASSIVELY DIFFERENT then in a action based MMORPG. Yeah Warcraft started out as RTS but that means nothing when designing a MMORPG via the combat.

[tristannarutofan]

Ways to slow down combat within WoW:

1) You don't, because combat doesn't need to be slowed down.

i mean...turn based games are extremely popular and WoW came from Warcraft which resulted in spending half the game minin resources and waiting for units to be trained.

Not saying WoW needs to be 'slower" but 'slow' doesnt mean 'bad' In the game industry

[Deleted]

you are entirely missing the point if you think putting a % health heal is gonna make just make it slower, you are just not gonna use it and just mitigate and hope for healers heals, you cant risk being out of sotr cause you need to heal for a pitiful amount

[tristannarutofan]

Yeah its like some next level iq 200 logic from this guy something along of the lines of saying "well people adopted to living in shitholes and socialy unhabitat places, stop complaining about it".

this is how you show ppl you are completely unreasonable and your opinions and 'feedback' are invalid


we are all used to almost all our abilities being on the GCD anyways. and they just changed a few

comparing that to someone saying that people will adapt to living in dirt holes is ludicrous bordering on the insane

[Seramore]

i mean...turn based games are extremely popular and WoW came from Warcraft which resulted in spending half the game minin resources and waiting for units to be trained.

Not saying WoW needs to be 'slower" but 'slow' doesnt mean 'bad' In the game industry

And yet this method of slowing down gameplay is bad.

If the pace of certain specs are a problem, then Blizzard should re-work those specs, not change the entire way cooldowns work for literally every spec. Fury is so fast paced because they went from everything costing rage to most of your abilities building rage (or not having a rage cost) and only using one ability as a rage dump. In other words, we're not being slowed down by anything and are encouraged to be a GCD capped spec by design. The way to change that is to re-work the spec, not put meaningless halts into our rotation by using CDs and just making the spec feel bad in the process.

[Varicose]

Seems they finally fixed male Nightborne shoulders and their ridiculous size. Curious when we'll see this on live.

[-aiko-]

Gameplay doesn't need to be slowed down but whatever.
If their goal is to prevent cooldown stacking then a better solution is to have cooldowns use a separate GCD.

[Jastall]

Ways to slow down combat within WoW:

1) You don't, because combat doesn't need to be slowed down.

Can't quote this enough. There are styles of games where slow gameplay is better; a super realistic FPS, for example, or a turn-based game, or a grand strategy title ala Paradox games. In a real-time combat system like WoW's, however, slow doesn't mean better, and when it is done in such a ham-fistedly stupid way it makes gameplay a good deal worse.

I play slow games. I'm binging through XCOM 2 now which is slow as slow gets, being 100% turn-based. But it does it very well so it's really fun. WoW combat works best when it is fast-paced and full of moment-to-moment decisions. Looking at GCD timers tick down is the antithesis of fun especially if it puts you in trouble or kills you.

[rcshaggy]

If anyone wants to watch the Battle for Azeroth Battle for Lordaeron Scenario.

[Cosmic Janitor]

Has the castle above UC ever been refered to as Lordaeron Keep before? It kinda feels like Blizz downgraded the obviously poor ingame representation, to a measly keep..

[Gurmech]

If anyone wants to watch the Battle for Azeroth Battle for Lordaeron Scenario.

I will never understand why people love facecam so much.