Mega-Thread: Trump Focused Discussion

[Paranoid Android]

So only Michaelangelo the Teenage Mutant Ninja Turtle showed up? So is there a political rift between Leonardo, Donatello, Raphael? Are these 3 Biden supporters? Never Trumpers? I have to know.

Says the Michaelangelo was a Time Square performer. Costume looked alright. The crowd was what I expected. Gawd that would be torture to be at that party.

[Edge-]

Good on Vanilla Ice for still finding paying gigs, I hope he actually gets paid for his performance.

[Kaleredar]

So only Michaelangelo the Teenage Mutant Ninja Turtle showed up? So is there a political rift between Leonardo, Donatello, Raphael? Are these 3 Biden supporters? Never Trumpers? I have to know.

Says the Michaelangelo was a Time Square performer. Costume looked alright. The crowd was what I expected. Gawd that would be torture to be at that party.

Mikey definitely gives me “grew up to be a Joe Rogan bro” vibes, so kinda makes sense.

[Breccia]

Good on Vanilla Ice for still finding paying gigs, I hope he actually gets paid for his performance.

You might hope, but you have doubts.

One, it's Trump.

Two, Vanilla Ice is desperate for publicity.

Three, he's been to these before -- I think he shows up as a guest and just ends up onstage.

And four, it's Trump.

[Dontrike]

Trump's defense strategy goes beyond stalling as we see what new stupidity his lawyers have in store for us while they hope to their various gods that Trump pays them and that he wins the election.

"Much of Donald Trump’s legal strategy in his federal 2020 election interference case has, so far, centered around trying to delay the start of his March trial until after the November presidential election.

But in recent court filings, and according to sources familiar with the Trump team’s approach, other defense strategies have emerged – namely of absolving Trump, the front-runner for the GOP nomination, of responsibility for the US Capitol attack and positioning him as a victim of disinformation and overzealous government investigators.

Two under-the-radar court filings from Trump’s team in late November offered the clearest glimpse yet into what the former president’s lawyers may try to argue before a jury in the historic case. The filings say that his lawyers hope during the trial to point to people in the federal government he suspects are biased toward him, to foreign influence, and to election disinformation that led him to believe the 2020 contest was stolen.

The foreign interference defense

Trump’s team has already asked a judge to allow him access to more government documents, including classified information from his administration, that he believes would back up his argument that the election result couldn’t be trusted.

Prosecutors “cannot blame President Trump for public discord and distrust of the 2020 election results while refusing to turn over evidence that foreign actors stoked the very same flames,” his lawyers wrote in court in late November.

“Evidence of covert foreign disinformation campaigns relating to the 2020 election supports the defense argument that President Trump and others acted in good faith even if certain reports were ultimately determined to be inaccurate.”

One of the foreign actions they’ve pointed to came from Russia’s foreign intelligence service and a hack of the SolarWinds software that compromised data at several federal agencies in December 2020. Trump’s legal team wrote that attack meant “there were reasonable concerns about the integrity of the election and the possibility of technical penetrations of election infrastructure.”

Trump’s recent court filings also seek access to intelligence about Iran and China attempting to interfere in US politics. The Justice Department has argued that allowing evidence into the case regarding possible false claims by foreign actors could confuse a jury and is not relevant to Trump’s state of mind when he pushed false claims of election fraud publicly.

Trump team looks to special counsel investigators

Trump’s team is also trying to unearth how other investigative agencies in the federal government looked at his actions after the 2020 election – as a way of trying to highlight that he wasn’t charged until a special counsel was appointed by Attorney General Merrick Garland in November 2022. Undermining the prosecution by pointing to politics could be an opportunity to help Trump before a jury, sources familiar with the strategy told CNN.

The special counsel’s office is asking Judge Tanya Chutkan to block any attempts Trump makes to nullify his jury, which his lawyers could do by trying to inject politics into the evidence presented. Nullifying means convincing at least one juror to vote to acquit him even if prosecutors prove the case against him beyond a reasonable doubt.

Central to this strategy are the prosecutors on the case against Trump now. They had sought to look at false allegations of fraud and the fake electors scheme in 2020 and 2021 for the Justice Department and Michael Sherwin, the former acting DC US Attorney who spoke to “60 Minutes” about the possibility of sedition charges related to the Capitol attack.

Trump’s team has asked the court to expand the legal definition of the prosecution team to include other agencies, including the US attorney’s office in DC, so prosecutors would be prompted to turn over extensive documents from them to Trump’s defense team for review. That could slow down the case, some of the sources told CNN.

“Based on public statements from attorneys on behalf of the USAO-DC that are inconsistent with the Special Counsel’s theory of January 6, it is a virtual certainty that there are similar nonpublic documents and private communications relating to this issue,” Trump’s team wrote to the court in late November.

Pointing to ‘political bias’ against Trump

Trump’s team also said members of the intelligence community and law enforcement who may become trial witnesses may have “political bias” against him. Even so, several of Trump’s former Cabinet members – such as then-Attorney General Bill Barr, then-Vice President Mike Pence and several top intelligence officials – could be called to testify against him at the trial. Many were vocal after the election that there was no widespread fraud and have in recent months criticized Trump.

Trump’s team has also noted that it may be tested at trial whether he believed he would have won the 2020 presidential election had it not been for widespread voter fraud. But the prosecution’s charges against Trump signal they’ve gathered significant evidence of top advisers in both his campaign and administration telling him the results meant he could not win, and that he ignored the facts to rally his supporters to violence.

Prosecutors from special counsel Jack Smith’s office within the Justice Department are trying to eliminate before the trial many of these defenses – highlighting them to Chutkan in a recent filing.

It will be up to Chutkan to determine if the tactics Trump’s team has hinted at can be used at trial, and what exactly the lawyers are able to present to the jury through witnesses and evidence.

“The Court should not permit the defendant to turn the courtroom into a forum in which he propagates irrelevant disinformation, and should reject his attempt to inject politics into this proceeding,” the prosecutors wrote in a filing days after Christmas. “Evidence is not relevant upon a party’s mere say-so; it must be connected to the charges in the indictment or to a legitimate defense supported by sufficient evidence.”

Trump doesn’t have a deadline at this time to respond to the DOJ’s filings in court, and Chutkan doesn’t have the ability to set parameters for the trial and evidence-gathering while part of Trump’s case is being appealed.

A question of timing

Trump’s trial is currently scheduled for March 4 in Washington, DC’s federal court – the day before the Super Tuesday nominating contests. But that date could move, as Trump continues to pursue appeals. And delays in the appellate courts’ decisions could quickly push the schedule back months.

The most likely delay may come from the DC Circuit Court of Appeals, which is hearing arguments January 9 on whether Trump has immunity from being tried as a criminal defendant because of his role as president and the impeachment trial where he was acquitted by the US Senate following the January 6 attack.

The Supreme Court is also likely to be asked to look at those issues before Trump’s trial can begin.

Trump also continues to pursue appeals over a gag order Chutkan placed on him in October, which was recently refined by the DC Circuit.

The former president has argued the unfairness of that order should prompt the delay of his trial date until after the election, but that argument has gained no traction in the courts."

The "there's bias because we don't have access to every file 'cause Trump took them and we don't have clearance" is certainly a defense. Not a good one, but it certainly is a defense that will buy them three days.

[Gorsameth]

The immediate and obvious question is why he comes with this now and why was none of this evidence of foreign interference shown at any of the hundred cases where he tried to fight the result of the election while he was still in office and had direct access to this supposedly classified intelligence information.

(obv the answer is because it doesn't exist)

[gondrin]

Oh Donald, you sure talk alot. I guess you talked about immunity before but in a different context.

https://www.msn.com/en-us/news/polit...98bc9d25&ei=11

Donald Trump Skewered by Past Remarks About Presidential Immunity

Donald Trump previously claimed in court that a president can be prosecuted once they leave the White House, special counsel Jack Smith's latest filing to an appeal court said.

Smith's filing suggests that Trump has been caught by his own words as he seeks complete immunity from his upcoming election interference trial.

In a filing at the weekend, Smith noted a submission in Trump v. Vance, in which then-President Trump sought to avoid a grand jury subpoena issued by then-Manhattan District Attorney Cy Vance.

Vance led a three-year investigation into Donald Trump's finances that did not result in any indictment.

In the Vance case, Trump's attorney submitted a legal document arguing that Trump sought only temporary immunity that "'would expire when the President leaves office' and therefore would not place the President 'above the law,'" Smith's court of appeals filing said.

"Indeed, the Executive Branch and multiple Presidents, including the defendant, have consistently acknowledged that any criminal immunity ends once a President leaves office," Smith added.

Trump was indicted on four counts of allegedly working to overturn the results of the 2020 election in the run-up to the January 6, 2021, riot at the U.S. Capitol. A jury will be selected in Washington, D.C., in February with a trial date set for March 4. He has pleaded not guilty to the charges.

It is one of four criminal cases that Trump is facing while he campaigns as the frontrunner for the 2024 Republican presidential nomination. He has also pleaded not guilty to charges in the three other cases and has repeatedly said that they form part of a political witch hunt.

Newsweek reached out to Trump's attorney via email for comment on Tuesday.

The filing was submitted ahead of oral arguments scheduled for January 9.

In December, Tanya Chutkan, the judge in Trump's election interference trial, refused his application for presidential immunity. Trump is now appealing that refusal to the Washington, D.C. Court of Appeals. All pre-trial motions in Chutkan's court have been halted while the Court of Appeals decides on Trump's presidential immunity. Trump's lawyers are refusing to handle any trial documents sent to them by Smith's office, including a proposed trial schedule.

In his submission, Smith said that Trump is looking for a "license" to commit crimes to stay in office.

"Rather than vindicating our constitutional framework, the defendant's sweeping immunity claim threatens to license presidents to commit crimes to remain in office. The founders did not intend and would never have countenanced such a result," Smith wrote.

Former federal prosecutor Joyce Vance wrote in her Civil Discourse blog on Monday that Smith's brief "tags Trump with an inconsistency between this position and the argument he made in an earlier case to avoid the reach of the law."

"The tone is gentle, but the argument is strong," she wrote.

- - - Updated - - -

So, I guess Florida is going to pay for DJT's legal bills since he won't.

https://www.msn.com/en-us/news/polit...b98946aa&ei=10

Florida’s CFO Proposes Plan for Taxpayers to Foot Trump’s Legal Bills

Florida’s chief financial officer, Jimmy Patronis, has caused controversy with a proposal to establish a legal defense fund using taxpayer dollars to cover the legal fees of any Florida presidential candidate facing prosecution.

The suggestion, presented at the Florida Republican Party’s Freedom Summit, was specifically framed to address what Patronis called a “double standard of justice” faced by former President Donald Trump.

Patronis outlined the idea during his speech at the summit, telling the crowd, “Imagine if we could fix the double standard of justice that doesn’t lock up a Hunter Biden but does everything possible to prosecute a President Donald Trump.”
The proposed legal defense fund would be available for any Florida presidential candidate encountering legal issues from prosecutors associated with the Department of Justice, who he perceives as “politically motivated prosecutors.” Trump, currently a frontrunner for the 2024 Republican presidential nomination, is facing 91 felony counts across federal and state courts.

Patronis argued that since Florida is currently experiencing its “best fiscal health,” the allocation of funds to cover legal fees for presidential candidates would be possible, emphasizing the importance of protecting those willing to run for office.

He said to the crowd, “When these men and women are brave enough to put their name on the ballot, we should protect them. ” He then suggested naming the fund the “Defending Florida Fighters Fund.”

Patronis has since shared clips of his speech to X, sparking a wave of criticism in response, particularly focused on the inappropriate misuse of taxpayer dollars. As discussions unfold, the question of whether a legal defense fund is a justifiable use of surplus funds is a real point of contention.

[Edge-]

So, I guess Florida is going to pay for DJT's legal bills since he won't.

https://www.msn.com/en-us/news/polit...b98946aa&ei=10

Finally, a tax that Republicans can rally behind!

I swear, the genuflecting towards Dear Orange is fucking pathetic.

"Freedom Summit" fucking rofl.

[Lenonis]

So, I guess Florida is going to pay for DJT's legal bills since he won't.

Oooh. This will be an interesting case study. If there is one fundamental principle behind GOP's philosophy other than hatred of minorities and the "radical left" it's hatred of taxes.

Will that hatred outweigh the cult devotion? Or will the cult say "we love you Trump, have our babies, but pay your own legal bills"?

Or, most likely, this is yet more performative politics and this plan won't actually go anywhere.

[Edge-]

https://www.thedailybeast.com/trump-...-cohen-in-2020

Former President Donald Trump won’t face repercussions over the way he appears to have used federal prison guards to intimidate his former lawyer, Michael Cohen, jailing and silencing him in 2020 ahead of his tell-all memoir about the billionaire’s mob-like behavior.

On Tuesday, the Second Circuit Court of Appeals in New York affirmed a federal judge’s decision to dismiss the case, which dealt with a particularly authoritarian episode in the final year of Trump’s presidency. The three-judge panel wouldn’t let Cohen use a legal remedy that allows someone who’s been abused by federal agents to seek justice for the misconduct.

However, the panel tacitly acknowledged that something unfair clearly happened. The judges noted how the then-president’s archenemy was thrown back in prison on flimsy reasoning, and how the case was only resolved through some extraordinary intervention by a judge who eventually ordered that Cohen should be released.

Ironically, the judges ruled it was that very intervention that now prevents Cohen from holding Trump and certain government agents accountable, citing a 1971 Supreme Court case called Bivens v. Six Unknown Named Agents.

“While this relief may not have made Cohen whole, ‘when alternative methods of relief are available, a Bivens remedy usually is not,’” they wrote on Tuesday.

Sweet, so Donald has already gotten away with literally jailing political opponents and will face on consequences.

Fucking sweet. Fucking awesome. I hate everything. Fuck Cohen, but god damnit at some point there has to be some kind of fucking consequences.

[Paranoid Android]

So, I guess Florida is going to pay for DJT's legal bills since he won't.

https://www.msn.com/en-us/news/polit...b98946aa&ei=10

This is the most ass lick, suck off proposal ever. My goodness what they would say and do for this guy.

I feel horrible for people of Florida. Dems really effed up that state but maybe it was inevitable. Now enough broken brain, conservatives moved in from Covid and they have a strangle hold on the State government. Oh I would bet anything that this tax would not effect the millionaire plus people. Make the scrubs pay for this PoS legal bills.

[Benggaul]

Oh Donald, you sure talk alot. I guess you talked about immunity before but in a different context.

https://www.msn.com/en-us/news/polit...98bc9d25&ei=11



- - - Updated - - -

So, I guess Florida is going to pay for DJT's legal bills since he won't.

https://www.msn.com/en-us/news/polit...b98946aa&ei=10

Get fucked, Florida.

[Edge-]

https://themessenger.com/politics/tr...total-immunity

Former President Donald Trump on Tuesday took to social media to share a report that, according to him, shows "fully verified" election fraud in the 2020 election, claiming that when he was pointing out ballot issues he was not campaigning and thus should be granted presidential immunity in special counsel Jack Smith's investigation into him.

The report shared by Trump is titled "Summary of Election Fraud in the 2020 Presidential Election in the Swing States," and is divided in sections dedicated to Georgia, Wisconsin, Pennsylvania, Arizona and Michigan.

"I am pleased to share a Report that is fully verified, most of the information was gotten from Government Sources, Tapes, and other Public Records, and compiled by the most highly qualified Election Experts in the Country," Trump wrote on Truth Social without providing evidence of who verified the documents.

According to the former president, the report shows "hundreds of thousands of votes per swing state" that would be more than enough for him to win.

Wow, he's got proof that he won 2020?! Why didn't he share it back in 2020?! Or 2021? Or 2022? Or 2023? Why wait until 2024 to share it?

"Therefore I am entitled to Total Immunity, because that is exactly what I was doing, Taking Care of our Country, and Guarding it from Rigged and Stolen Elections."

You can't just declare bankruptcy because you say so, dude. Repeating that you have "Total Immunity" doesn't make it true.

[Benggaul]

You can't just declare bankruptcy because you say so, dude. Repeating that you have "Total Immunity" doesn't make it true.

Is it just me or has the random capitalization gotten worse? It read like someone trying to shoehorn movie titles into a conversation.

[Elder Millennial]

Finally, a tax that Republicans can rally behind!

I swear, the genuflecting towards Dear Orange is fucking pathetic.

"Freedom Summit" fucking rofl.

I'm losing my fucking mind about how these fucking boot lickers are so pathetic that not only they gargle Trump's cum and ball sweat, but they even try to adopt his butchery of the English language.

Patronis outlined the idea during his speech at the summit, telling the crowd, “Imagine if we could fix the double standard of justice that doesn’t lock up a Hunter Biden but does everything possible to prosecute a President Donald Trump.”

"a President Donald Trump" - What is this fucking sentence? Is "President Donald Trump" one of several different "Presidents Donald Trump"? What is that fucking article doing there? Like with Hunter Biden the article refers to a type of person...but how the fuck does that work with "a President Donald Trump". Also the obsession with endlessly referring to him as "president".

Who the fuck speaks like this? What does this even fucking mean? AAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAARRRRRRGHHHHHHHHHH!

[Slirith]

I'm losing my fucking mind about how these fucking boot lickers are so pathetic that not only they gargle Trump's cum and ball sweat, but they even try to adopt his butchery of the English language.



"a President Donald Trump" - What is this fucking sentence? Is "President Donald Trump" one of several different "Presidents Donald Trump"? What is that fucking article doing there? Like with Hunter Biden the article refers to a type of person...but how the fuck does that work with "a President Donald Trump". Also the obsession with endlessly referring to him as "president".

Who the fuck speaks like this? What does this even fucking mean? AAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAARRRRRRGHHHHHHHHHH!

Well, the idiot did say he loves the uneducated.

[Breccia]

FOX News follows Hannity and will host a Trump town hall while CNN has a GOP debate.

Once again, the Trump cowardice is on full display, and FOX News is just rolling over for him. While the FOX and CNN points offset, I still feel like...

(checks page count)

Who'd we lose this time?

[DarkTZeratul]

Who'd we lose this time?

I assume the guy who said he was deleting his account in the Russia thread, but then kept responding because apparently he just had to have the last word despite saying goodbye at least three times, actually did so.

[Evil Midnight Bomber]

So only Michaelangelo the Teenage Mutant Ninja Turtle showed up? So is there a political rift between Leonardo, Donatello, Raphael? Are these 3 Biden supporters? Never Trumpers? I have to know.

Well, Donatello is a scientist. So the Trump cult wouldn't have accepted him there anyway.

[Ivanstone]

FOX News follows Hannity and will host a Trump town hall while CNN has a GOP debate.

Once again, the Trump cowardice is on full display, and FOX News is just rolling over for him. While the FOX and CNN points offset, I still feel like...

(checks page count)

Who'd we lose this time?

Looks like Chonogo.