What you guys are failing to see is that no matter how insane you pretend I am or accuse me of being, I'm not a lone voice on this. The mere fact that I am saying this means that there are many others who are thinking it, many of which wouldn't say these things on forums because of people like Tanaria, and co, who would swamp them with criticism and b/s arguments in order to protect their precious elves on the horde faction that don't fit them at all. They'd just leave, and not say anything meanwhile it would seem that the community agrees with Tanaria and co, when actually it doesn't, they've just created their own echo chamber and driven others out with their aggressive dogma. And if blizzard can't see through that, they'd continue to make erroneous decisions because they can't ascertain what the fans really care about. Only the loud mouths.
So fine, let me be the one that takes all your ire, I can handle it, i neither care to be reputable with you nor amicable, I care for the truth, and I will state things how I perceive it.
Elves on the horde is bad for the game, elves better on the horde than the alliance should not be the case, build the elves mainly on the alliance and diminish them on the horde, replacing what they lose with boosts to core horde races will help faction numbers, will fix horde identity issues and crisis, and will make a happier and better community.
The horde elf fan base are the only ones that would cry hard about this, half of them will switch tot he alliance, which is what you want anyway, as it will boost he alliance numbers, the other s would be a tiny minority, they will still have access to blood elves and Nightborne, and really only have their reason to brag or feel superior removed form them. It's a small price to pay.. most of the horde will appreciate the trolls and orcs made more prominent to make up for the diminishing of the elves, it will feel like the horde again, and the alliance would also be happy because the elves they've loved so much and desired are now been shown brightly on their faction.
The majority of the warcraft players especially the older ones and the new ones, the fantasy ones drawn to the game for it's similarities to LotR will all love this better, the themes and direction of the factions will feel more distinct and separate with the elves promoted on the alliance entirely.
it will solve a lot of issues and distortion that the theme, faction and races as well as the game are facing. And you will never see topics like this arise.
I have brought the human problem up, and why it is a problem, and there isn't just one issue to what's wrong with the alliance but they're all connected.
No one is much interested in dwarves , draenei, gnomes and worgen, well a few people are, the interesting races for the bulk of alliance fans are humans and elves, but with the elves mainly and better promoted on the horde, that leaves only the humans worth any traction on the alliance, making them even more boring, and hence why people complain, about too uch human stuff.. What do you think they want to replace human focus with? Dwarves and Gnomes? (well some do) but most want High elves and Night elves - yes, Quel'thalas, highborne, Moonguard, Kaldorei sentinels and wardens, the fantasy of all of hte Kaldorei and all of the Thalassians - whether nature or arcane night wielders under the stars, or the glorious sun kingdom of the high home. They are more interested in that than space goats and dwarves, though some are really into that too, so we mustn't entirely ignore those either.
It should be quite clear by all the high elf topics on every wow forum and night elf topics constantly on about the injustice of the Nightborne going horde that ALliance fans deeply care for high elves and night elves a lot more than they care for Draenei, Dwarves, Gnomes, Worgen or Pandas, and to deny that is just blinding yourself from the truth and will do you know good to pretend it isn't the case.
Use the truth to understand what is wrong, and fix the problem. I repeat:
Elves on the horde is bad for the game, elves better on the horde than the alliance should not be the case, build the elves mainly on the alliance and diminish them on the horde, replacing what they lose with boosts to core horde races will help faction numbers, will fix horde identity issues and crisis, and will make a happier and better community.
The horde elf fan base are the only ones that would cry hard about this, half of them will switch tot he alliance, which is what you want anyway, as it will boost he alliance numbers, the other s would be a tiny minority, they will still have access to blood elves and Nightborne, and really only have their reason to brag or feel superior removed form them. It's a small price to pay.. most of the horde will appreciate the trolls and orcs made more prominent to make up for the diminishing of the elves, it will feel like the horde again, and the alliance would also be happy because the elves they've loved so much and desired are now been shown brightly on their faction.
The majority of the warcraft players especially the older ones and the new ones, the fantasy ones drawn to the game for it's similarities to LotR will all love this better, the themes and direction of the factions will feel more distinct and separate with the elves promoted on the alliance entirely.
it will solve a lot of issues and distortion that the theme, faction and races as well as the game are facing. And you will never see topics like this arise.
i repeat
You say you want to ruin the elf content of the horde to increase the numbers of the alliance, but in general the numbers of players of the horde and the alliance are even. the disparity is found in mythics and competitive players prefer racials to aesthetics, if you want the numbers of players in the alliance to increase in endgame you have to give the alliance racials that are better than those of the horde.
you only resent that the horde have things you want, that is to be envious and greedy
I don't buy into small people on forums, being jealous of the Horde's Elves. I especially don't care for you, since you've quit and won't be coming back. And I'm thankful that Blizzard will NEVER give you want you want.
You can have your precious High Elves and Night Elves...your just not getting Silvermoon or Suramar. You can have a district in Stormwind with your Human overlords, whilst the Sin'dorei and Shal'dorei continue living in their cities, that rightfully belong to them.
Whatever, yeh yeh, cry i have no proof of this as some sort of evidence that none of this is true or credible. If blizzard actually think so, they're kidding themselves just as you are, and falling victim to promoting their own preferences over what is better and more desired for their fans and their faction theme and game balance.
but hey, if they have the numbers, and filter out the horde elf fan zealots, they'd probably quickly find out far many more different alliance fans from all sources have commented and asked for the same thing, and will also observe guys like you have driven them away by your badgering and bullying, making them feel like their opinions aren't valid and are far from the truth with your opinions that have no proof either.
but if blizzard don't want to see what's really going on with their own game to improve it and make it better, then that's on them, they will continue to put off people with their bad lore and imbalanced factions, and their game will be unpleasant a lot on one faction, it might boost a few faction transfers, but it will actually just kill the game for many fans like myself.
You don't have to be into the lore to feel the diminishing quality of playing on the alliance because the numbers and interest isn't there, whether you're into elves or not, it becomes sour and eventually you'd likely leave than dish out money to faction change, and even if you do, faction change, it would be one more annoyance at the company for failing to rectify the issue and forcing you to change just to play the game. The repercussions go well beyond lore. It also affects theme. The horde theme is muddled, what are they? they use to be clearly defined in WC3 and classic, no t so after the blood elves joined and became a major elven bastion..on the horde...
Fine the horde needed the numbers, but they got them, and continued to grow, and yet they gave them more alliance elf race stuff, including the kaldorei and the distortion just keeps growing, alliance forced to largely humans, because the best changes for the kaldorei are crippled with the ancient home and world on the broken isle going horde, and the Thalassians are instead given void elves a sub-par version of what the alliance really wanted. And you wonder why alliance is bleeding numbers, and people continue to write in topics like this and tell blizzard this is not fair or good.
Yet you feel you just grandly stepping in telling them it's fine and it's good for the horde to have elven alliance stuff better on it, is just fine and the alliance should be happy with whatever they got so that the horde doesn't lose elven stuff it doesn't need and doesn't belong there.. yeh..right.
Blood Elves and Nightborne were never Alliance. You'd know that if you'd follow the lore and not their models.
You don't know the lore and you are nothing short of a small child, having a massive temper tantrum in the shop because mummy told you "no, you can't have those sweets."
For fecks say stop engaging him; do yoy know how many threads this guy has ruined?
Aww thank you for allowing me to have high elves and night elves oh decider and purveyor of all things elven, or please would you permit me to have Silvermoon and Suramar too...please? I know that i can't have these without your express permission and blessing, so I beseech you or elf decider and creator
Yes, I'm completely alone in this, a small minded man who's the only one wanting this, I single handedly masterminded and drove a 1148 page forum topic with over 22,900 responses, and did the same on every other warcraft forum online. because I'm the only one that wants the horde stuff and I'm just greedy for things that don't belong to the alliance, but tot he horde... /end sarcasm
You deny what's right infront of you, you are told out right that elves are not horde races, and most alliance fans do not view them as such, you may have decided to accept them as such, but most have not, and most see they do not fit the horde.
what do Elves, blood or Nightborne have in common with orcs, Trolls, Tauren, goblins, Pandas? I mean seriously.. ANYONE can see this, but you choose to deny it and claim they are horde races that belong there, and wonder why you have tens of thousands to 100,000s of response all over the internet on the topic that disagree and feel otherwise, including this very one we are on.
Yet I'm the one that's small and isolated. I don't really care what you think of me, but it's sounding a little bit ridiculous you denying how alliance fans feel and what it appears to them and what it actually appears to anyone - Elves fit the alliance, not the horde.
Blizz should fix the imbalance by quit promoting them on the horde and return to doing so on the alliance.
- - - Updated - - -
Your powers waning or great one? Surprised not liking or agreeing with what someone says is not a bannable offence? Ah, so if you can't win in an argument or drown out voices you don't agree with by bullying like you've done to many others, you try to get them banned, all to snuff out voices you don't agree with.
Believe it or not Warcraft actually had some novel concepts in the world and storytelling, Like Orc's not being inherently evil monster fodder, other monster races being misunderstood and outcasts. Blood Elves (the high elf archetype of WoW) being aligned with typical monster races was another somewhat strange and new concept that in the context of the universe and the story told made sense, just because you can't see beyond the superfical aspects (that the blood elves are pretty) doesn't mean they don't fit the Horde.
The Night elves aren't even the High Elf archetype of WoW, they're a combination of Wood Elves (in general culture) and Drow/Dark Elves (appearance, gender dynamics and devotion to a singular goddess) i'm not sure how you can look at Suramar an urban city where nature isn't allowed to grow freely and think "ah yes this city definitely fits the Night Elves".
The Void Elves are also exiled outcasts transformed by dark otherworldly powers how does a bright shining city like Silvermoon fit them at all?
Because I don't couldn't care less for minority of selfish and greedy Alliance fans, who act like Gollum. You don't deserve to have current Horde things. That includes, Blood Elves, Nightborne, Silvermoon and Suramar.
Don't bother replying, as I'm blocking you. As far as I'm now concerned, you have been silenced and I will preach about how grand Suramar and Silvermoon are and how they are still on the Horde. Lok'tar - for the Horde!
I'll say it one more time, the population numbers of the horde and the alliance are generally even. Only mythics exists difference, if what you want is to increase the population of the alliance in mythics what you have to do is to give better racials to the alliance.
But in reality you are not interested in increasing the endgame population of the alliance, it only bothers you that the horde has content that you want.
I predicted Nightborne going to the Horde way before Allied Race were a thing, they have a very dark elf feel without having to be sadistic and cruel, they actually are a very good fit for the faction even more than modern Blood Elves are.
The same could be said for Alleria's return and "her" high elves, noone could see the Void twist coming though and, to be honest, that turned out better than expected despite their horrible out of the blue introduction.
Suramar being Horde is actually a good thing, the only thing the Alliance should feel cheated on is how they were basically forced to help them for an entire expansion just to receive a slap in the face in the end but that's on Blizzard and not the Horde.
They clearly tried to do a reverse situation with Mechagon but eh, not on the same level and nobody really care for Mechagnomes anyway, I barely see any around.
I agree that the Alliance is losing some pieces for no good reason but Suramar and Silvermoon aren't what anyone should focus on.
Dalaran flipflopping is irritating for all for example, it was a human kingdom and should have been left as such.
Dalaran being the Legion capital for the Alliance and Suramar being the one for the Horde would have worked so much better, without leaving any bad feeling in the end for one side.
The Silver Hand, the NE-Cenarion Circle, heroes like Khadgar going neutral are what shouldn't happen but alas, it keeps happening again and again with the Alliance and I can understand that's not very fun but well, our Horde heroes tend to go crazy and need to be put down every odd expansion so eh, maybe it's not that bad in the end.
Blood Elves were indeed forced into the Horde for marketing reasons but the ship has long sailed, leave Silvermoon alone and hope it becomes a way less boring place in the future, like it was back in TBC when BE actually had that whole "survival at all cost" theme which is what most Horde races have going for them.
Focus on reclaiming the fang and claws of the NE without blaming humans or other things for the their neutering, focus on Alliance High Elves transitioning into Void Elves and them building a stronger identity because the potential is there.
And let's be honest, would the Alliance really want Silvermoon and the BE back?
They are probably the most hypocrite of all the elves, blaming human for the action of a single individual which had nothing to do with Stormwind, some badly made quests in their starting zone (to this day we still don't know what the night elves were doing there and who sent them) and sweeping under the rug the fact that the Alliance saves them every other day of the week, even restoring their precious Sunwell, when they were enemies, for nothing in return.
All of this while supporting multiple genocidal regimes in the Horde and partecipating in one atrocity after another while still whining about Arthas and Sylvanas and the Scourge, Teldrassil being the most recent elephant in the room.
Nah, leave them be I say, focus on your elves and fight for better races in the future, those guys are stuck with us.
Well, while I agree with you that his claims that Horde elves should be merged into the Alliance are extreme and will never happen (and it is not even necessary), I can't take you seriously on most matter either. You accuse him of bias (rightfully so), painting it as such a bad thing, yet you are also heavily biased and you even proudly display your bias. It is not bad to have favorites, everybody does... but don't be a hypocrite and don't blame others from what you are doing yourself.
I'm not sure if you are just trying to provoke Ravenmoon by intentional cherrypicking, or if you are failing the lore yourself too. You know, highlighting only certain parts of the story without larger context can be used on the Horde too.Your a meme because the lore is explained to you, but all you care about is the elf models.
And you are greedy, nasty, selfish and unfair. You really are. These races, those cities - they belong on the Horde. That is where they are and that is where they will be staying. Blizzard will not have these cities be lost to the Alliance...especially not to weak races like nelfs and helfs. Nelfs couldn't even take Azshara and that was before Sylvanas burned the tree.
Blood elves are so weak race. They can't even reclaim their homeland, which is still scourge infested as seen in Three Sisters, so pretty loooooong after Lich King was defeated and Scourge severly weakened. During Amani crisis, they were so weak they had to invite other weaklings to help them.
Nightborne are such a weak race. We raided them and crushed them to dust even when they were empowered by Nightwell. They can't even stand on their own without the help from the Horde. What a failure.
See? Your horde elves are pretty much the same weakling as you claim alliance elves to be.
Ravenmoon have a point that aesteticaly, they are actually closer to the Alliance. Horde elves break Horde's aestetic integrity by bringing high culture to the faction defined mostly by their tribal themes and more rugged assets. It can be good or bad thing, it just depends on your point of view. I actually don't really like it, so most of my Horde characters are not elves, since I don't really feel I fit in the faction. I will not deny others may feel different about it, and it is ok.Suramar and Silvermoon are remaining on the Horde and all those Troll places...they belong to Trolls who aren't even part of the Horde. Nightborne and Blood elves, with their cities, are fully fledged Horde members and the Alliance has failed in the lore, to win these cities and their populations, round.
Well, for gameplay reasons, they will certainly remain Horde. For lore reasons, blood elves have no solid reason to stick with the Horde anymore. Given their history of leaving factions the minute they outlived their need for them, I wonder what special Horde has to offer to the Quel'thalas. Thalassians always put their nation above all others. We have not seen any real contribution from the Horde to well-being of Quel'thalas since... TBC? Even then, it was mostly provided by Sylvanas and the Forsaken. On the other hand, Horde dragged blood elves into numerous conflicts, resulting in further loses on sin'dorei population, yet they did not bother even send reinforcements to Ghostlands in times of Amani Crisis, or did not help blood elves reclaim Ghostlands. So I'm actually pretty interested what make your elf characters so happy about the Horde?
It seems to me that the best thing blood elves could do is to officialy leave Horde and remain neutral (which means not joining the Alliance), invite all high elves back to Quel'thalas to let them help their nation and gave them opportunity to deal with problems in their homeland, after decades they were contributing to either Alliance or Horde efforts... but as I said, gameplay reasons make this impossible.
I mean, Blood elves being mana-hungry, extremely pragmatic, and commanding the Light instead of having faith in it is definitely Horde-like.
Also, once again Blood Elves aren't Horde because of Garithos; he wasn't even brought up in WoW. The reason is because the Alliance ignored their pleas for help for 5 years and it was the Forsaken (who are part of Horde) who helped them.
The Alliance gets the Horde's most popular race. The Horde should get the Alliance's most popular race in return. Alteraci Humans for the Horde!
I make Warcraft 3 Reforged HD custom models and I'm also an HD model reviewer.