Balance Changes - Build 26707

[Argenon]

So, with the new balance changes hitting Beta today, I thought we should start a new thread.

A lot of testing going on right now I'm sure. I really like the empowerment proc from SW/LS for the other, seems very fluid at the moment.



Things seem to look quite optomistic.

Only thing I don't like is it looks like we could be respeccing for every AoE/ST fight again, which Blizz said they didn't like...

[-aiko-]

My only gripe is that it's kind of odd to have two different aoe talents on the same tier (Twin Moon/SotF). I dunno which one to take ><

Edit: Then again, I glanced over that starfall costs and SotF have both changed so

[Deleted]

I just want to log on... Ion pls

[huth]

My only gripe is that it's kind of odd to have two different aoe talents on the same tier (Twin Moon/SotF). I dunno which one to take ><

Edit: Then again, I glanced over that starfall costs and SotF have both changed so

Well, that was kind of the point of that change, was it not?

Though it seems they changed how SotF works with empowerments.

I like that New NB is available as early as 15. Should help a great deal during leveling.


After a preliminary look at the new gameplay, i think we should be fine for BfA. Eclipse gives us something to look out for and talents compete in a vastly more sensible manner now.
Note that SotF is a 1.3x multiplier to empowerments, rather than just a 30% additive bonus.

[-aiko-]

Well, that was kind of the point of that change, was it not?

I...guess? Just seems like it will just end up being one over the other once we theorycraft it.

Twin Moons is such good QoL that I'm salty I can't have it and SotF Such is life

[huth]

I...guess? Just seems like it will just end up being one over the other once we theorycraft it.

Twin Moons is such good QoL that I'm salty I can't have it and SotF Such is life

They're good in different situations. SotF will still beat Twin Moons in mass AoE, and is probably better for sustained single target.

[Lucavian]

Is it just me, or does this make boomkin weaker than before on single target? Solar Wrath empowerment does 10% of it's damage as aoe instead of doing +20% damage. It's mastery scaling was cut in half. Mastery scaling for starsurge, starfall, and fury of elune was reduced by 12%. Fury of elune base damage nerfed by over 50%. Astral Power generation during celestial alignment was nerfed, not to mention the damage boost nerfed. The dps of lunar strike was nerfed as well, but only by about 3%. Hopefully it's good I guess. Numbers can be tweaked later, but they were specifically tweaked down for this build for some reason.

[-aiko-]

Anywho, didn't mean to appear negative. So far really liking the changes. AP regeneration seems really smooth with Nature's Balance and New Moon for ST, and even in AoE with Nature's Balance and Shooting Stars. I seem to get a really good amount of empowerment procs as well so I gotta keep on my toes not to waste them.

[huth]

Is it just me, or does this make boomkin weaker than before on single target? Solar Wrath empowerment does 10% of it's damage as aoe instead of doing +20% damage. It's mastery scaling was cut in half. Mastery scaling for starsurge, starfall, and fury of elune was reduced by 12%. Fury of elune base damage nerfed by over 50%. Astral Power generation during celestial alignment was nerfed, not to mention the damage boost nerfed. The dps of lunar strike was nerfed as well, but only by about 3%. Hopefully it's good I guess. Numbers can be tweaked later, but they were specifically tweaked down for this build for some reason.

Fury of Elune now also generates 40 AP rather than costing 80 and has a shorter CD.
Lunar Strike has a shorter cast time as well. Edith: The damage reduction and cast time reduction actually work out to identical DPCT.
Seph alrady told us why CA and Inc had their AP bonus replaced. Starfall and Starsurge had their base damage increased, so the nerf isn't quite as big as it seems. Besides, Moonkin was far from weak before. Just boring.

Numbers are just ballpark right now. Tuning won't really happen before August at the earliest.

[Lucavian]

Yeah. Got to play around a little now and it feels okay.

[naeblis495]

numbers aside , i really like the fact that we can spec heavly on dots with twin moon , stelar flare (wich has proper scaling now) and shooting star

warrior of elune now allow a starfall or a starsurge to be cast right after the 3 instant , thanks to the 40% increased asp wich is really nice for movement

there are real choices wich are hard to make now in the talent tree , wich is really good

i'm pretty much sold on boomkin now

[Beace]

I really hope we won't have to switch talents around constantly to be effective at both single target and aoe. This has been one of my major issues with how things worked out in Legion for most classes. A talent row shouldn't have choices that scream "pick this for single target" and "pick this for aoe".

[Ifritlol]

I always wondered how legendary shoulders work (now Twin moon). Is it a ''smart'' DoT? Like if you have 4 targets and you Moonfire once it hit 2 and if you pick a target with no moonfire on it ans cast again will it choose escond target with no DoT too or is it random?

[Seradi]

I always wondered how legendary shoulders work (now Twin moon). Is it a ''smart'' DoT? Like if you have 4 targets and you Moonfire once it hit 2 and if you pick a target with no moonfire on it ans cast again will it choose escond target with no DoT too or is it random?

It will just apply Moonfire to whatever is in range and doesn't have Moonfire yet.

Twin Moons doesn't seem to be applying a 2nd Moonfire on beta though.

[-aiko-]

Hmm? Twin Moon seems to be working fine for me on beta. It is working exactly like Lady and the Child.

[Vanos27]

So now that the changes are on the beta, how are you all liking Stelar Flare now?

I honestly just think it should be axed personally but would like to hear what you guys have to say.

Also the astral power generation that was added to force of nature might as well not be there.

[turlockmike]

So now that the changes are on the beta, how are you all liking Stelar Flare now?

I honestly just think it should be axed personally but would like to hear what you guys have to say.

Also the astral power generation that was added to force of nature might as well not be there.

Hopefully it will be good enough on 2-4 target fights. We could become council fight gods again if it works out.

[cujoe]

The changes are really good. The only thing I don't like is having to choose between Twin Moons and SotF. I guess the latter will be used for spread AoE mostly where MF doesn't hit two targets, like on council type fights. It's probably even a strong single target talent now that Incarn is really not that much better then celestial (10 secs longer duration and 5% added damage bonus is not that much imo).

Shooting Stars is also in a weird spot. You get 9 procs over 90 secs from both DoTs combined, which on the template druid in Beta is around 2000 dmg and 18 AsP. Fury of Elune generates 40 AsP over the same duration and does around 3300 dmg per target hit. That means you need around 4-5 targets sustained AoE for ShS to be superior to Fury because you generate enough AsP to get an additional Starfall (around 1800 damage) off over the 90 secs. That doesn't take into account that FoE can be stacked with CDs/trinkets/pots to increase its value a lot. ShS seems only worth it in spread AoE situations, much like SotF.

The burst potential for FoE / Twin Moon build seems really great, though. You start the fight with 50 AsP from NB talent, you pop CDs/trinkets/pot, cast FoE, DoT everything up and you can cast two Starfalls back to back for some really good and easy to set up burst AoE. I feared that with the lack of legendaries and artifact talents we will again suck for the first months of the new expansion in m+ like we did in Legion. But now not anymore.

Also the astral power generation that was added to force of nature might as well not be there.

FoN is actually superior to NB on single target. The treants hit 6 times for around 150 dmg each (which can crit) on the template druid in Beta. thats 900 per treant or 2700 dmg total per minute. NB only gives 25 more AsP per minute than FoN which is around 60% of a SS or around 1600 dmg on template druid.

[Polarthief]

I feel honored to have my shittily-cropped picture in the OP.

My only gripe is that it's kind of odd to have two different aoe talents on the same tier (Twin Moon/SotF). I dunno which one to take ><

Edit: Then again, I glanced over that starfall costs and SotF have both changed so

Yep, that was my same gripe, but with only 10 AsP reduction, it's not AS bad.

[Deleted]

Still not the same fun spec it was years ago