[Spoilers] Saurfang character butchered

[Solitare-sp]

People are misundersting what honour is. It's not about dying the right way, it's about living the right way.

Slyvannas is all about getting the job done, the best way for her people. War is a lot easier when you don't have to worry about morals and committing dubious/evil acts. That's what Saurfang objects to.

There's nothing wrong with deciding that Slyvannas is right. Just don't try to claim the moral high ground at the same time.

[nothingsjim]

Um how? In the pictures theres a killed NE in a bed, a dead inkeeper and others.

Have all of their corpses been removed?

Apparently, the Horde Scenario and Alliance Scenario are different, so different that Ian Bates, aka The Red Shirt Guy tweeted about it.

https://twitter.com/TheRedShirtGuy/s...35151854657537

"In Darkshore, the Horde duels the furbolg chieftains in honorable combat to peacefully go through Darkshore without killing furbolgs. Alliance side the Horde has enslaved the furbolgs, put their chieftains in cages, and is forcing them to attack the Alliance."

"In Astranaar, the Horde only attacks night elf combatants and takes great pains to ensure no civilians are harmed. Alliance side the Horde has rounded up all the civilians in the center of the town and mass executed them, with forsaken assassins and blight everywhere."

[Syegfryed]

Apparently, the Horde Scenario and Alliance Scenario are different, so different that Ian Bates, aka The Red Shirt Guy tweeted about it.

https://twitter.com/TheRedShirtGuy/s...35151854657537

"In Darkshore, the Horde duels the furbolg chieftains in honorable combat to peacefully go through Darkshore without killing furbolgs. Alliance side the Horde has enslaved the furbolgs, put their chieftains in cages, and is forcing them to attack the Alliance."

"In Astranaar, the Horde only attacks night elf combatants and takes great pains to ensure no civilians are harmed. Alliance side the Horde has rounded up all the civilians in the center of the town and mass executed them, with forsaken assassins and blight everywhere."

this is a fucking dick move from blizzard, what will be canon? both?

they are so desperate trying to give a reason to a faction war who already have plenty of reason with artificial and plastic things like this

it is their response about morally gray? one side see black and the other white? LUL

[Super Dickmann]

Apparently, the Horde Scenario and Alliance Scenario are different, so different that Ian Bates, aka The Red Shirt Guy tweeted about it.

https://twitter.com/TheRedShirtGuy/s...35151854657537

"In Darkshore, the Horde duels the furbolg chieftains in honorable combat to peacefully go through Darkshore without killing furbolgs. Alliance side the Horde has enslaved the furbolgs, put their chieftains in cages, and is forcing them to attack the Alliance."

"In Astranaar, the Horde only attacks night elf combatants and takes great pains to ensure no civilians are harmed. Alliance side the Horde has rounded up all the civilians in the center of the town and mass executed them, with forsaken assassins and blight everywhere."

Reposting, because it's relevant here. Red Shirt Guy is really exaggerating this stuff.

There's a special dialogue that pops up if you kill civvies with Lorash and from the Alliance version we know some Forsaken were involved in it as well and it wasn't just the PC, so we can assume that canonically the rogues killed the civilians before the army showed up and then stayed around to wait for Alliance reinforcements to show up to slow them down. As for fighting the furbolg leaders honorably, that's not really the case, Sylvanas sends you in to make them submit to the will of the Horde (i.e beat up the chieftains and kill enough of their dudes that they surrender). There's also no furbolg in cages in the Alliance version (from the wowhead video at least). The elders are just tied up and you can easily fly in and rescue them and they're the only ones held like this. For the other furbolgs some look to have been sent out and complied with the Horde others are still being oppressed. None of this is impossible to reconcile.

[Zulkhan]

People are misundersting what honour is.

There's little to misunderstand since literally everyone bends the word to their personal conception of the word; this applies to fictional and real-life characters alike.

[Verdugo]

There's little to misunderstand since literally everyone bends the word to their personal conception of the word; this applies to fictional and real-life characters alike.

http://warhammerfantasy.wikia.com/wi...aracterization

This is Egil. Egil is a man of honor. Egil routinely butchers unarmed civilians to prove that.

[steelballfc]

honor is just something commanders blather about to get their soldiers to fight regardless of race.

true
/10 char

[Verdugo]

Threads like like always seems to end up about salty sylvanas bois who hate the alliance or salty sylvanas bois who hate Saurfang for some reason, and people think she isn't the most toxic character for this game

Since when are "salty sylvanas bois" character in this game.

[Chromu]

... Saurfang was butched a long time ago... people forget what caused his son death?

By standing in the Horde, after seeing Garrosh expanding the use of blight, seeing a forsaken rise as Warchief, he should have left the horde long ago.

As for the Astranaar stuff, cannon will be like:
1) army occupied not harming the civilians;
2) the vanguard moves on (so does Saurfang);
3) forsaken occupation forces starts the killing (alliances sees that);
4) words of it spread like rumours (we won't see that in game);
5) Saurfang doesn't believe at first (weird loyalty);
6) then sees firsthand blight fucking everyone up (rumours were true);
7) he wants to die (since he believe he can´t do shit about it);
8) gets caught and learns new stuff (Anduin talk);
9) gives a fuck for the Forsaken Horde and leave it.


This is the main arc for Saurfang at the begin of BfA. But Blizzard is too lazy and stupid to make it without fucking it up.

[TheFirstOnes]

Saurfang's somewhat hypocritical.

Sylvanas is Pure Evil.

Man, fuck the Horde this Expansion. I hope Thrall comes back, and gets every ones shit back together (On the Horde, at least). We need him as Warchief again...

BUT, SADLY, METZEN'S GONE...so...

- - - Updated - - -

(Not against Metzen leaving, I just really hate BFA's Horde that much).

[Super Dickmann]

Surely this will be the end for Sylvanas, says increasingly nervous poster for seventh time this week.

[Shadowspire]

Saurfang's somewhat hypocritical.

Sylvanas is Pure Evil.

Man, fuck the Horde this Expansion. I hope Thrall comes back, and gets every ones shit back together (On the Horde, at least). We need him as Warchief again...

BUT, SADLY, METZEN'S GONE...so...

- - - Updated - - -

(Not against Metzen leaving, I just really hate BFA's Horde that much).

Thrall doesn't need to reclaim the mantle, but he clearly needs to have a family meeting.

[TheFirstOnes]

Thrall doesn't need to reclaim the mantle, but he clearly needs to have a family meeting.

This would also work.

[OIS]

http://warhammerfantasy.wikia.com/wi...aracterization

This is Egil. Egil is a man of honor. Egil routinely butchers unarmed civilians to prove that.

That's Warhammer though. Warcraft is a bit watered down compared to that universe.

[Zulkhan]

That's Warhammer though. Warcraft is a bit watered down compared to that universe.

Yeah but the idea remains the same. Fucking Garrosh shouted "HONOURDURDERP" until the very end.

[Gref]

it is ridiculously retarded that you guys fighting here like these are real people. He could have done that she should have chosen this...

are you guys serious?

there are writers you know, that writes these stuff. Not real characters making their own choices. Fuck sake. You should be criticizing the writers. Not saurfang.

Seriously you guys say: "Saurfang could have done that".

Mother of god...

[OIS]

Yeah but the idea remains the same. Fucking Garrosh shouted "HONOURDURDERP" until the very end.

General consensus in-universe was that Garrosh acted dishonorably and shamed the Horde, however. Nobody on Azeroth misses that guy. In Warcraft, those who killed defenseless folks either ended up regretting those actions(Saurfang, Drek'thar etc.) or descended into full-blown villainy.

[Nzo]

Its good to see the blizzard team is realllly pushing the whole "Horde bad, Alliance good" narrative to the ground, how about they just kill the entire horde faction already and be done with it and we can have a Anduin happy game for the remainder of the games lifespan.

[Feanoro]

it is ridiculously retarded that you guys fighting here like these are real people. He could have done that she should have chosen this...

are you guys serious?

there are writers you know, that writes these stuff. Not real characters making their own choices. Fuck sake. You should be criticizing the writers. Not saurfang.

Seriously you guys say: "Saurfang could have done that".

Mother of god...

Shhh, it's best that they stay here in their containment forum where they can't hurt anyone...

[Melsiren]

Stonetalon Peak was already admitted as a mistake from Blizzard's part. Garrosh had no problems in killing civilians.

Small correction, Dave Kosack retconned it and made it about wasting the bomb and dubbed it a mistake.

Alex Afrasiabi tells you a different story. When he was lead narrative Stonetalon was supposed to be the turning point for the character.

The point is at the time Garrosh was not going in the direction he ended at.

It's why the confusion will never go away unless they remake Stonetalon.

Obviously when it comes to the lore we deal with the retcons as always.