Anima is just Azerite.

[Lei]

Ok so weekly cap like valor with an option to keep going for comsetics. And this is bad because......?

I'm not saying it is bad, depending on how much you have to work for the cap, and exactly what you have to do. it actually can be a cool progression system, which we don't know yet. I'm jsut giving a heads up to people who seem like believing there is nothing to basically continuosly babysit throughout Shadowlands. "AP is gone" means VERY different things for each individuals it seems like. Not even touching the tower topic here. :/

[Teekey]

Ok so weekly cap like valor with an option to keep going for comsetics. And this is bad because......?

Oh, so we're moving the goal posts now. Got it.

I do think it's better, by far. But people were stating unequivocally that it wasn't like AP and wasn't a grind.

It is. It's just a (seemingly) better version of it. We'll see how it ends up panning out.

[Corroc]

Torghast will be Island expedition of Shadowlands but with an actual object and better envinronment. You will most likely have world quests or daily quests that you do in the tower, you can complete them solo or with friends.

[VinceVega]

You sound like an abused spouse.

"They beat us and break their promises...but maybe this time they actually mean it!"



It's a discussion forum. God forbid people discuss things.

There is no discussion. Half of the posts since yesterday is assuming shit or just saying outright what they DID say is a lie without knowing any better. Or whining about stuff without listening to what they said. E.g. the whole sylvanas is to powerful discussion witch is basically the plot of 9.0.

Saying anima is azerit despite them telling us there is no power grind and then just wildly assuming stuff which we cannot know until the beta is just crazy sorry. It is seeing stuff that is not there.

Do i say i won't happen? I don't know. But atleast i wait until we know more before stomping my food on the ground and just don't believe because my hatered of blizzard is so strong after BfA that seemingly nothing they do or say matters. And at that point there is no discussion possible. Because there is simply no way to get you away from your standpoint. It is an absolute.

[Lei]

There is no discussion. Half of the posts since yesterday is assuming shit or just saying outright what they DID say is a lie without knowing any better. Or whining about stuff without listening to what they said. E.g. the whole sylvanas is to powerful discussion witch is basically the plot of 9.0.

Saying anima is azerit despite them telling us there is no power grind and then just wildly assuming stuff which we cannot know until the beta is just crazy sorry. It is seeing stuff that is not there.

Do i say i won't happen? I don't know. But atleast i wait until we know more before stomping my food on the ground and just don't believe because my hatered of blizzard is so strong after BfA that seemingly nothing they do or say matters. And at that point there is no discussion possible. Because there is simply no way to get you away from your standpoint. It is an absolute.

Watch the video!

[VinceVega]

You're the one that sounds like an abused spouse refusing to leave the relationship you obviously detest.

Thank you!

[Teekey]

Saying anima is azerit despite them telling us there is no power grind and then just wildly assuming stuff which we cannot know until the beta is just crazy sorry. It is seeing stuff that is not there.

They've expanded on what Anima is in interviews. It's this expansions form of alternate advancement. In that way, it's exactly like AP.

It's not like Azerite in that it can just be grinded forever with diminishing returns. But there's still a need to collect it every week, which I can understand people calling a grind.

You're the one that sounds like an abused spouse refusing to leave the relationship you obviously detest.

LOL. Some fairly tame criticisms of a game means I "detest" them.

God forbid people have a different opinion and don't just kiss Blizzard's ass. Good lord, you fan boys are too much.

[Vakir]

Oh, so we're moving the goal posts now. Got it.

I do think it's better, by far. But people were stating unequivocally that it wasn't like AP and wasn't a grind.

It is. It's just a (seemingly) better version of it. We'll see how it ends up panning out.

MMOs are defined by doing things in the game world for the purposes of progression. There has already been badges, emblems, there's been points, there's been various kinds of AP. Even in Vanilla, the slow tail was in the form of an extremely low amount of loot relative to a significantly higher amount of people, plus reputations and higher costs of consumables.

Character progression comes in the form of time investment - partly for money, but also partly by nature of being a game about spending a lot of time in a world.

So boiling down a weekly cap for player power to "well it's still kinda like AP" ignores the entire history of the game.

[Corroc]

Oh, so we're moving the goal posts now. Got it.

I do think it's better, by far. But people were stating unequivocally that it wasn't like AP and wasn't a grind.

It is. It's just a (seemingly) better version of it. We'll see how it ends up panning out.

Isn't this moving goal posts? Only thing Ion said was there is no "ap grind". AP grind in essence has always been grind that gives you power but exponentially gets harder after every level you get.

[ZimeUK]

They've expanded on what Anima is in interviews. It's this expansions form of alternate advancement. In that way, it's exactly like AP.

It's not like Azerite in that it can just be grinded forever with diminishing returns. But there's still a need to collect it every week, which I can understand people calling a grind.

In Ion's interview with Preach and Bay (Final Boss TV) he suggested that Anima is actually similar to a Valor Cap from Mists or Cata as this is where the 'power' stops. If you choose to continue gaining anima then you spend that Anima on cosmetics or non-power related rewards. This isn't artifact power where gaining a level increases your stamina or damage or unlocks another passive to improve the power of your character.

EDIT: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=y3Fwh7b37FE

[VinceVega]

And isn't that exactly what everyone wanted the last couple of months? No endless grind.
That you have to play every week...
A few years back you had to do x amount of dungeons.
This time you have to do x amount of any stuff you want.

I am sorry but is still an MMO. You take a break you get behind. That is just they way MMOs work. Otherwise all Progression is mute.
That is NOT an AP System!

[Lei]

In Ion's interview with Preach and Bay (Final Boss TV) he suggested that Anima is actually similar to a Valor Cap from Mists or Cata as this is where the 'power' stops. If you choose to continue gaining anima then you spend that Anima on cosmetics or non-power related rewards. This isn't artifact power where gaining a level increases your stamina or damage or unlocks another passive to improve the power of your character.

EDIT: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=y3Fwh7b37FE

Anima is connected to Soulbinds, which is the max level power progression system of Shadowlands. What do you think you collect anima for? It is a power thing, but it's not spent on a necklace or on a weapon piece.
Azerite was stamina, but Legion AP was the weapon with cool abilities. What Anima will unlock we don't know yet, but the system is very similar.

[ZimeUK]

Even if it isn't Azerite or AP...they will put things in to keep you busy as you kept yourself busy chasing that AP for whatever reasons you thought you "had to" although you hated it.

Just looking at the armour rewards from the Covenants? Since you can only chose 1 Covenant...but might like all four rewards? Here you are...doing it on 4 characters. Now...you better hope if you unlock an armour set reward, it unlocks all specialisations...or you will be doing it on 16 characters ...

Just wait..it will either be "I have nothing to do" or "This too much shit...."

It will undoubtedly be the latter since they want to give you options. The thing is with cosmetics is that you don't NEED to get those items. You WANT to. The difference is extremely important. If the grind was mandatory to raid or for high-end PvP or whatever, then there would be an issue. When the 'extra' grind is purely cosmetic then it's a player choice.

[Teekey]

Isn't this moving goal posts? Only thing Ion said was there is no "ap grind". AP grind in essence has always been grind that gives you power but exponentially gets harder after every level you get.

I like the changes, personally.

I just understand why some people think it is still an "AP grind".

[Vakir]

Anima is connected to Soulbinds, which is the max level power progression system of Shadowlands. What do you think you collect anima for? It is a power thing, but it's not spent on a necklace or on a weapon piece.
Azerite was stamina, but Legion AP was the weapon with cool abilities. What Anima will unlock we don't know yet, but the system is very similar.

Right, but there's a weekly cap. So it's more like Valor. Comparing it to AP feels very Legion/BFA-baby rather than having a functioning idea of the game's history. Currencies or time investment to reward is a thing in MMOs.

[ZimeUK]

Anima is connected to Soulbinds, which is the max level power progression system of Shadowlands. What do you think you collect anima for? It is a power thing, but it's not spent on a necklace or on a weapon piece.
Azerite was stamina, but Legion AP was the weapon with cool abilities. What Anima will unlock we don't know yet, but the system is very similar.

He specifically said that there will be a cap for what provides your character power. My point is that there is an ENDLESS grind for Artifact Power and Azerite. This system is not that. It's a weekly cap to power followed by a choice to earn some cool rewards afterwards.

[Delever]

Oh, so we're moving the goal posts now. Got it.

I do think it's better, by far. But people were stating unequivocally that it wasn't like AP and wasn't a grind.

It is. It's just a (seemingly) better version of it. We'll see how it ends up panning out.

But it isnt. Did you see the interview? He specifically said that every week there will be a minimal requirement akin to a weekly valor cap *Or even less*. Everything after is a personal choice and goes into utility and cosmetic stuff. People wanted to go back to a currency system and this is as close as it gets.

[Lei]

It will undoubtedly be the latter since they want to give you options. The thing is with cosmetics is that you don't NEED to get those items. You WANT to. The difference is extremely important. If the grind was mandatory to raid or for high-end PvP or whatever, then there would be an issue. When the 'extra' grind is purely cosmetic then it's a player choice.

Depends on the player I guess. In real life raiding is working 8-4, and if you're a youtuber or streamer, you're a lazy bastard in your family's eyes probably. In wow, if you're a collector, same applies to you, while you're the hard worker breadwinner if you're a raider. Oh, it's just cosmetics *shrug*. Tell you what. cosmetics are and have been the new hot topic in wow in the past 4-6 years. Allied races? heritage armour? island + mounts? Good morning. While you think only raids and power progression matters, there are a lot of people who emphasize on cosmetics. That's what sells. And with that, that's not really a choice. or jsut as much as AP grind for serious raiders.

[Dismayxz]

*Sigh*

Like I said, you guys DON'T want to believe it. but you'll SEE in 4-5 months that Anima IS just Azerite.

Trust me, we all want to have some hope that Blizzard wouldn't just turn Anima into this expansions Azerite Grind, but it's something that's going to happen no matter how much you guys don't want it or deny it.

Believe me on this one. I'm sorry guys.

As somebody else already posted, anyone keeping in the loop with the flow of information already knows it's Azerite as of the FinalBoss interview.

That still doesn't really do anything for your argument, considering the 'forced' grind was what most people have been raking on and seemed tired of.

If they get rid of that it's fine. People wanted Valor back. At the end of the day, a currency is a currency, whether it's called Azerite, Anima or Valor doesn't matter. They want to weekly cap the portion of it that offers you player power, while the 'infinite' or 'grind' portion moves away from that into cosmetics, which is optional.

Does that mean people won't complain? No. People will still make it out to be 'mandatory to grind' if they -want- said cosmetics (considering cosmetics hold big value to players, as the cheers on customization prove). There's a clear difference inbetween something being mandatory to beat certain content or meet certain thresholds the community itself deems mandatory and something quite simply being a method to attain a clear reward that does not offer you numbers or player power. If the infinite grind stays, but is purely about cosmetic rewards, there's no such thing as lawyer speak behind the statements he's made on Anima so far. People wanted a weekly cap back, a clear goal to reach, not a grind treadmill, when it comes to player power. Done, that's it, argument over unless they don't hold up their end of that bargain. And yes, Anima coming from everywhere (supposedly) will still mean that there are certainly going to be 'more efficient ways' to attain your weekly cap. People in the 9.0 Thread have the expectation (likely from something said in the interview), that it will be easier to cap than Valor was on a weekly basis. Either way, that again falls back into the good old trap of blaming blizzard unironically over nothing vs player agency. If it's easy to cap and comes from everywhere, you very clearly have a certain choice in what content you want to do to cap it, as much as is realistically possible.

It's peoples own decisions to only do the most efficient portions of content to reach said goal, it's literally never going to change in a way where you get the best of both worlds, not when everybody (even those who arguably don't even need to) is already putting themselves into the victim role of being "forced" into efficiency, whilst others are getting by perfectly fine, because they lack the ability to have agency over their own Gameplay, when a choice is given.

[Teekey]

You calling somebody a battered wife isn't ''having a different opinion''

Grow up.

If the shoe fits...You just can't stand people criticizing or having any different opinion.

I think it's you that needs to grow up.