Mega-Thread: Coronavirus Pandemic

[Forogil]

1 dead person from vacine reported here. (older person)
Seems like 5% risk is quite real.

Which vaccine, it seems that every country has developed their own? And dead for what reason?

For Pfizer/BioNTech the risk of severe immediate reactions (no deaths as far as I know) more seems like 0.002%; but they are still investigating longer-term effects. Obviously risks that are as low as 0.002% are likely to be missed in the phase 3 studies.

However, it still looks favorably to the disease which has an IFR for middle-age people around 0.02%. (Obviously these numbers are fairly inaccurate, and depend on other factors as well.)

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So the same chance to die from Covid as the vaccine?

The risk of dying from covid isn't 5% in general (but only for people above a certain age, somewhere around 70-80 years old).

Somewhere 0.2 to 1% seems reasonable on country levels, but it depends on a lot of factors - including demographics of the country.

[Yunru]

Which vaccine, it seems that every country has developed their own? And dead for what reason?

For Pfizer/BioNTech the risk of severe immediate reactions (no deaths as far as I know) more seems like 0.002%; but they are still investigating longer-term effects. Obviously risks that are as low as 0.002% are likely to be missed in the phase 3 studies.

However, it still looks favorably to the disease which has an IFR for middle-age people around 0.02%. (Obviously these numbers are fairly inaccurate, and depend on other factors as well.)

- - - Updated - - -


The risk of dying from covid isn't 5% in general (but only for people above a certain age, somewhere around 70-80 years old).

Somewhere 0.2 to 1% seems reasonable on country levels, but it depends on a lot of factors - including demographics of the country.

Its probaly a reaction from a medicine that the person was using.


Anyway, here is another reported death:
https://www.vecer.com/slovenija/po-c...-smrt-10231716
(use gogle translate)
A person who had a heart attack, got another one after getting it after a while.

[Pann]

Wow, Israel's vaccination program is seriously impressive!

"Daily COVID-19 vaccine doses administered per million people (7-day average):

Israel 13,993
United States 1,051
Denmark 1,007
United Kingdom 639
Russia 466
Germany 413
Argentina 346
Italy 315
Canada 247
Mexico 29"

https://twitter.com/MaxCRoser/status...77093646901251

[Forogil]

Wow, Israel's vaccination program is seriously impressive!

"Daily COVID-19 vaccine doses administered per million people (7-day average):

Israel 13,993
United States 1,051
Denmark 1,007
United Kingdom 639
Russia 466
Germany 413
Argentina 346
Italy 315
Canada 247
Mexico 29"

https://twitter.com/MaxCRoser/status...77093646901251

Yes, Israel seems to have done good with that. We will see how it develops when the larger trading blocks are ramping up their efforts. It may also be that Israel paid a premium for early access - something that larger countries cannot easily do.

Obviously people will use that to show that their views are the correct ones: the military helping out with vaccination, multiple (4) private health-care provides, etc

But strange that he skipped Bahrain, when the source has them at 2nd place with 3,620 at the moment - and also China which seems head-to-head with Italy. (Yes, Bahrain is a small country - but the population isn't an order of magnitude below countries such as Israel or Denmark. And it seems that Bahrain's program includes everyone living in Bahrain. China is obviously not a small country. There is some uncertainty of the Chinese vaccine - but there are similar concerns about the Russian one used in Russia and possibly elsewhere such as Argentina.)

[Logwyn]

Which vaccine, it seems that every country has developed their own? And dead for what reason?

For Pfizer/BioNTech the risk of severe immediate reactions (no deaths as far as I know) more seems like 0.002%; but they are still investigating longer-term effects. Obviously risks that are as low as 0.002% are likely to be missed in the phase 3 studies.

However, it still looks favorably to the disease which has an IFR for middle-age people around 0.02%. (Obviously these numbers are fairly inaccurate, and depend on other factors as well.)

- - - Updated - - -


The risk of dying from covid isn't 5% in general (but only for people above a certain age, somewhere around 70-80 years old).

Somewhere 0.2 to 1% seems reasonable on country levels, but it depends on a lot of factors - including demographics of the country.

Then getting the vaccine you have a higher chance of dying than getting the disease?

[Forogil]

Then getting the vaccine you have a higher chance of dying than getting the disease?

No, you misunderstand me: the risk of dying was if you didn't get the vaccine and got the disease.

If you get the vaccine you have substantially reduced risk of getting the disease.

If you still get the disease it is a bit unclear, the indication is that you are less likely to die even if you get the disease while vaccinated (so the vaccine gives some benefit even in that case). However, that is less clear. The ongoing phase 3 trials will investigate how likely you are to get a severe disease (and have listed deaths in statements) - but I didn't see deaths as a measure (the numbers are likely to be so small that we don't get good significance; especially if we want to see risk of death if infected).

[Fuiking]

Wow, Israel's vaccination program is seriously impressive!

"Daily COVID-19 vaccine doses administered per million people (7-day average):

Israel 13,993
United States 1,051
Denmark 1,007
United Kingdom 639
Russia 466
Germany 413
Argentina 346
Italy 315
Canada 247
Mexico 29"

https://twitter.com/MaxCRoser/status...77093646901251

Netherlands: 0.

[Easo]

Netherlands: 0.

Wait, what? You haven't started?

[Fuiking]

Wait, what? You haven't started?

Nope. 6th first vaccines. Reason by goverment: ''gotta wait it out abit''. Real reasons: IT systems not in place yet.

So yeah, really bad mark on a first world country and one of the leading countries in the EU. You'd expect better.

Goverment has been running after the facts. They're like 2 strides behind at every turn.

[Orby]

My sister is a nurse at our local hospital and told me that none of the nurses there have been given the vaccine despite them being on the front lines, meanwhile office and management who are nowhere near the patients or even within the hospitals, have all revived the COVID vaccinations.. Fucking sucks.

[Poopymonster]

My sister is a nurse at our local hospital and told me that none of the nurses there have been given the vaccine despite them being on the front lines, meanwhile office and management who are nowhere near the patients or even within the hospitals, have all revived the COVID vaccinations.. Fucking sucks.

RHIP.

/10rankshavetheirprivileges

[Omega10]

In the US, there is talk of people only getting one of the shots to get more people vaccinated.

https://www.yahoo.com/news/rep-kay-g...195714620.html

Title: Rep. Kay Granger tests positive for COVID-19 after receiving 1st vaccine dose

The title says it all.

Bad news? She may have spread it to others.

Granger was apparently tested when she arrived in Washington, D.C., for the start of the 117th Congress on Sunday, where she was on the House floor mingling with her colleagues and later voted in the House speaker election. It was only afterwards that she found out about her result, her spokesperson said in the statement. She is now quarantining.

Good news? She is asymptomatic. This is being attributed to at least having the first shot under her belt.

Granger did receive a COVID-19 vaccine in December. It's not clear how long ago exactly that occurred, though she was scheduled to receive her second dose later this week. Still, her office suggested that getting vaccinated was beneficial. "Having received the vaccine in December, she is asymptomatic and feeling great," the statement reads.

The fact that she got the virus after one shot seems to confirm what has been stated many times - both shots are needed. Since she is 77 years old, it is a bit of evidence that the first shot may have at least mitigated the severity of the virus for her.

It probably would not stop her from spreading it to others though.

[Zantos]

In the US, there is talk of people only getting one of the shots to get more people vaccinated.


The fact that she got the virus after one shot seems to confirm what has been stated many times - both shots are needed. Since she is 77 years old, it is a bit of evidence that the first shot may have at least mitigated the severity of the virus for her.

It probably would not stop her from spreading it to others though.

Of course the US would mess this up. Our government has been completely incompetent this entire time. Why would anyone think they wouldn't find a way to mess up the vaccine? Now we have a new strain that spreads more easily. Them doing a half hearted job wont work.

[Gaidax]

In the US, there is talk of people only getting one of the shots to get more people vaccinated.

https://www.yahoo.com/news/rep-kay-g...195714620.html

Title: Rep. Kay Granger tests positive for COVID-19 after receiving 1st vaccine dose

The title says it all.

Bad news? She may have spread it to others.

First shot does already cover you somewhat, it takes 7-10 days to have effect and last I checked it's 60% efficiency by itself. 2nd shot is done to get that 95%.

It is definitely a thing people catching the thing between the shots, but I wonder how severe that one is - it might actually be a much lighter form with body already somewhat prepared for that.


I hear a lot of governmental health bodies in Europe consider one shot or delaying second one to instead cover more population with at least partial immunity. It's not that dumb of an idea. Sure ideally everyone needs to take 2 with 21 days in between, but vaccines are in VERY short supply now and that's a thing.

[Poopymonster]

Of course the US would mess this up. Our government has been completely incompetent this entire time. Why would anyone think they wouldn't find a way to mess up the vaccine? Now we have a new strain that spreads more easily. Them doing a half hearted job wont work.

Anyone want to place bets on the next "privatize everything" example?

Of course we should let the private sector handle it. Look how bad the government handled the Covid pandemic and initial vaccine roll out.
"You mean the government YOU were in charge of?"
Now is not the time to point fingers...

[Zan15]

Anyone want to place bets on the next "privatize everything" example?

Of course we should let the private sector handle it. Look how bad the government handled the Covid pandemic and initial vaccine roll out.
"You mean the government YOU were in charge of?"
Now is not the time to point fingers...

wait i am confused. Isn't the state govt mostly using the private sector to do the shots? Hospitals, Pharma, Nursing homes?

[Edge-]

wait i am confused. Isn't the state govt mostly using the private sector to do the shots? Hospitals, Pharma, Nursing homes?

If they're talking about the US...it's a bit of a shitshow. And it has nothing to do with public vs. private, it has to do with the fact that "Operation Warp Speed" is faceplanting pretty hard when it's coming to delivery.

And that state and local governments are broke as fuck and don't have any money to fund health departments ramping up vaccination sites and logistics. It would have been nice if Republicans hadn't fought tooth and nail to prevent federal dollars from going to state and local health departments to provide the funding necessary for a national vaccination program.

[Omega10]

First shot does already cover you somewhat, it takes 7-10 days to have effect and last I checked it's 60% efficiency by itself. 2nd shot is done to get that 95%.

It is definitely a thing people catching the thing between the shots, but I wonder how severe that one is - it might actually be a much lighter form with body already somewhat prepared for that.


I hear a lot of governmental health bodies in Europe consider one shot or delaying second one to instead cover more population with at least partial immunity. It's not that dumb of an idea. Sure ideally everyone needs to take 2 with 21 days in between, but vaccines are in VERY short supply now and that's a thing.

Pure mathematics here:

200 people with virus.

Group A: 1 half vaccine, 60% efficiency, all 200 people
Group B: 1 full vaccine, 95% efficiency, 100 people

Group A: 80 people have the virus, 80 people had both the vaccine and the virus, meaning they are candidates for a mutation that defies the vaccine
Group B: 105 people have the virus, 5 people had both the vaccine and the virus, meaning they are candidates for a mutation that defies the vaccine

The 80 people with the virus in Group A are likely to think they are "safe" and will have a less severe reaction to the virus. Many will be asymptomatic.

In a country where the virus is taken seriously, I could see the half vaccines as not being too bad.

In the US???

Well here is how WE deal with a pandemic:

https://www.yahoo.com/news/pro-trump...225940112.html

Title: Pro-Trump rally speaker encourages attendees to hug and create ‘mass spreader event’

Excerpts:

Supporters of President Donald Trump have gathered in Washington DC for multiple rallies just one day before Congress is expected to officially certify the presidential election results.

One speaker for a Tuesday rally, which was held in Freedom Plaza, encouraged attendees to all hug each other – a suggestion that went against current coronavirus guidelines.

“Turn to the person next to you and give them a hug, someone you don’t know. Go hug somebody. Go ahead and spread it out, mass spreader,” he said, before chanting “mass-spreader event” multiple times to the crowd.

Attendees, many of whom were not wearing masks, were seen hugging each other while the speaker continued to chant “mass-spreader event”.

At this point, I suppose it does not really matter whether we do full vaccines or half vaccines for twice as many people. The half vaccine plan, though, is a threat to the world as it substantially increases the speed at which a virus mutation that defies the vaccine occurs.

For countries that deal appropriately to the vaccine, I could see the half vaccine as being better than the full vaccine. Or at least as good.

[Edge-]

Well here is how WE deal with a pandemic:

https://www.yahoo.com/news/pro-trump...225940112.html

Title: Pro-Trump rally speaker encourages attendees to hug and create ‘mass spreader event’

Excerpts:



At this point, I suppose it does not really matter whether we do full vaccines or half vaccines for twice as many people. The half vaccine plan, though, is a threat to the world as it substantially increases the speed at which a virus mutation that defies the vaccine occurs.

For countries that deal appropriately to the vaccine, I could see the half vaccine as being better than the full vaccine. Or at least as good.

Was just coming here to post this.

The Republican party is homicidal and suicidal, and I long for a reality in which individuals can be held legally responsible for willfully engaging in behavior like this that directly puts the health, and lives, of others at risk.

[Omega10]

Was just coming here to post this.

The Republican party is homicidal and suicidal, and I long for a reality in which individuals can be held legally responsible for willfully engaging in behavior like this that directly puts the health, and lives, of others at risk.

And, to drive home your point, a second republican Representative that did not abide by social distancing rules got the virus after getting the first shot.

https://www.msn.com/en-us/news/polit...tAo?li=BBnb7Kz

Title: GOP Rep. Kevin Brady tests positive for COVID-19

Excerpts:

Brady said the House physician told him Tuesday night that he contracted the coronavirus and that he must now in quarantine. He added that he received the first dose of the Pfizer vaccine on Dec. 18 and last tested negative for the coronavirus on Jan. 1.

Data has shown that the Pfizer-BioNTech vaccine provides some protection against COVID-19 about 10 days after receiving the first dose, but recipients get a more significant boost after receiving their second dose three weeks later.

Pfizer has conceded that its vaccine's efficacy sits around 52 percent after just the first dose but jumps to 95 percent after the full regimen is complete.

Lawmakers have been advised to get tested for the coronavirus when coming back to Washington but are allowed to perform their duties while they wait for the results if they are asymptomatic or have not come into contact with someone who knows they have the virus.

It was not immediately clear where Brady contracted the virus, but lawmakers were seen crowding on the House floor Sunday during an unexpected floor vote. That development sparked a stern rebuke from Speaker Nancy Pelosi (D-Calif.), who sent a letter to lawmakers reminding them of social distancing guidelines.

52% not 60%, so the numbers I ran would be 96 people with the virus, and be candidates for a vaccine defying the virus, in the half vaccine scenario.