Is Classic too easy?

[Muxtar]

Classic isn't for hardcore end-game raiding/dps meters/achievements. It's more about the process of travelling, not the end point. It is slow and steady and relaxing, and punishing while leveling (you can't pull whole location at level 40 and clear it in 5 sec like in retail). That is the core of Classic, not the end-game content, which is much easier than its retail counterpart.
So people who love Classic went there not for the end-game challenge, but for the fun of leveling, communication between players, and actually living in that world, and not jumping from hub to hub like in retail.

[Big Thanks]

Yes but that's not really difficulty. I spend the rest of my free time watching movies and tv shows, it takes up a lot of my time but I wouldn't call it difficult just because of that.

Its absolutely difficult.

Its just..."difficult" in a 100% boring way

Like the rank 14 PvP grind...
Is it not "difficult" for people with jobs?
Yes...its actually IMPOSSIBLE!
Something "impossible" cannot be "easy".

Its just in a boring way.
(not to say a rank 14 person will not feel acomplished and happy in the end...they probably will...but man, the grind was real)

[Kaver]

People still don’t realize this, but Classic/Vanilla is and was a very casual MMO. Sure there are some hardcore grinds like the rank 14 pvp but as a whole the game is/was very casual friendly.

[Domixux]

Classic may or not be challenging for you, so what? I don't know why people actively need to defend their opionion if the game is hard or not? Either you enjoy it or not. Stop forcing people into your mentality of "This game is easy, stop having fun!" or "This game is hardcore, you must enjoy it".

[Mosotti]

Well, we only had the very first raids from WoW. I'm pretty sure not everybody will clear Naxx before the first reset, in greens... Obviously it will never compare to current mythic content, BUT on the other hand I think also the game had more soul and had a lot of mechanics that remained in the people's mind for many many years. Now there are a lot of complicated yet forgettable mechanics no one would remember 1-2-10 years from now, but everybody will forever remember the dance or the charge thingy from Naxx...

Its absolutely difficult.

Its just..."difficult" in a 100% boring way

I was reading recently some WoW world first guild expectations from the applicants and one of them was the absolute requirement to maintain AT LEAST 5 GEARED ALTS. Now don't get me wrong, but if this is not fucking boring then nothing is...

[Big Thanks]

I was reading recently some WoW world first guild expectations from the applicants and one of them was the absolute requirement to maintain AT LEAST 5 GEARED ALTS. Now don't get me wrong, but if this is not fucking boring then nothing is...

I cant imagine leveling 5 characters, let alone gearing 5.
That is insane...

[Echo of Soul]

It's a bit of everything, our own memories playing tricks on us and private server experiences leading us to believe the game to be much harder than it actually is. My guild cleared BWL on day one without any consumables or world buffs for the most part and it only took 2-3 hours. Sure it's a bit too easy considering that we're just your run of the mill average guild but for me Classic isn't about challenge or engaging gameplay, it's about clearing Naxx which I didn't have time to do 15 years ago prior to the launch of TBC.

If I want to be challenged and play a character with more than one button to push I always have retail.

[Mirishka]

I mean, maybe, but in neglecting to point out that people had been practicing on private servers for months leading up to the release of bwl, on top of 15 years of experience and knowledge, to nail those times, is misleading, if not entirely disingenuous, in my opinion.

Because I do not believe that 'practice on a private server' is the sole reason these guilds are curbstomping these old raids. And it is not a proven fact that every player in every guild currently wiping the floor with MC and BWL is a private server player.

People have known these fights for a decade and a half, mastered significantly more complex versions of these specs and classes, and have beaten significantly more complex, challenging raids in the expansions since vanilla. I have no idea why some of you take this so personally - it isn't like you guys are ones who designed MC/BWL encounters.

Maybe find another hill to die on - or does your enjoyment of Classic begin and end with the ridiculous notion that it was more difficult than current WoW?

[Troyer]

Yes, with the amount of information we have today classic its easier than retail, its nothing about the game design (15 years old) the players also have much more game knowledge.

Same with the high end PVE-PVP, where to get rank 14 you can only spam BG where skill is not involved and for PVE I clearer MC second week and today BWL just in 4 hours with free raid slots, so nothing to do until next reset.

[Echocho]

Because I do not believe that 'practice on a private server' is the sole reason these guilds are curbstomping these old raids.

It certainly isn't. My guild cleared it our first raid and we have like two players that have ever even tried a private server.

I have asked friends that I've found over the years playing retail and they all have similar stories.

Those that have been practicing on private servers for years clear the raid under 50 minutes, the rest of us maybe get it done in 150 minutes.

Unless you're in a really bad guild of course, I wouldn't presume that everyone in the world can stand still and press two buttons for a few minutes between trash packs.

[PrairieChicken]

It is much easier compared to Retail endgame, but it is not ncessarily a bad thing (unless you are one of the Classic delusionals)

[Drusin]

Fun Fact: Back when WoW was released, back in the age of FF11 and Everquest, it was considered "The casual MMO".

Yeah, didn't the Devs say in an interview way back when that they wanted the game to be less grindy and more forgiving than the current MMO's at the time? I'll see if I can find it.

[Mosotti]

WoW was considered "casual" because it didn't have the severe death penalty other MMOs had, not because it was "easy". It also had enrage mechanics so that retarded 20 hour boss fights would not happen.

[Tekkommo]

What I expected and I'm having great fun.

Still hoping retail improves, but Shadowlands sounds shit so far, so at least I have a version of the game I enjoy.

[Alphatorg]

I mean, maybe, but in neglecting to point out that people had been practicing on private servers for months leading up to the release of bwl, on top of 15 years of experience and knowledge, to nail those times, is misleading, if not entirely disingenuous, in my opinion.



You dont need a cloak for vael.

Where does this delusion come from that practise is this huge factor when it comes to pressing 1 button and defeating bosses with one ability?

[Perudo]

Well it is kinda expected that it would this easy because of several reasons.

- Classic is based on the last patch released for vanilla, 1.12, so it is "complete" so to say.

- Consider that Molten Core was released in patch 1.1, BWL in 1.6, AQ in 1.9 and Naxx in 1.11

- With that in mind, the itemization and strength of classes where totally different in those patches when compared to 1.12

- Would have been interesting to see how popular Classic would have been if it had the natural vanilla patch cycle

- Vanilla/classic have had 15 years of theorycrafting behind it now.

- This was not the case during vanilla, everything was still new and being figured out.

[Alphatorg]

Well it is kinda expected that it would this easy because of several reasons.

- Classic is based on the last patch released for vanilla, 1.12, so it is "complete" so to say.

- Consider that Molten Core was released in patch 1.1, BWL in 1.6, AQ in 1.9 and Naxx in 1.11

- With that in mind, the itemization and strength of classes where totally different in those patches when compared to 1.12

- Would have been interesting to see how popular Classic would have been if it had the natural vanilla patch cycle

- Vanilla/classic have had 15 years of theorycrafting behind it now.

- This was not the case during vanilla, everything was still new and being figured out.

You forgot adding that classes press 1 button and bosses have 1 abilities. Theorycrafting or different game versions have very little to do with the game being easy, when all bosses are tank&spank asde from one ability. Guilds take literally anyone who manages to breathe on their own and stomp the content with them. Unlike on top retail guilds I wouldn't even take it for granted that APES players are actually good at the game.

[Daedius]

Let's not kid ourselves, LFR is way harder than any of the Classic raids and that's a hilarious feat in itself.

The 10 year anniversary of WoW, with LFR Molten Core, was the thing of absolute nightmares for collectors... and is a testament showcasing how stupid people in LFR are.

[Daymanmb]

Because I do not believe that 'practice on a private server' is the sole reason these guilds are curbstomping these old raids. And it is not a proven fact that every player in every guild currently wiping the floor with MC and BWL is a private server player.

Believe what you want. Guilds have had private servers made for them to practise BWL pre-BWL. Im not talking about pre-classic. Im talking about a couple of months ago.

- - - Updated - - -

It certainly isn't. My guild cleared it our first raid and we have like two players that have ever even tried a private server.

I assure you, your guild isnt any where near top 100 in clear time, nvm the 42mins he initially referenced.

[Tekkommo]

Believe what you want. Guilds have had private servers made for them to practise BWL pre-BWL. Im not talking about pre-classic. Im talking about a couple of months ago.

I was baffled at first about this PTR talk lol, then realised they were just talking about a PS to practice BWL on.

Is BWL easy? Yes it is. A lot relies heavily on the tanks, if they mess up situations when they are meant to taunt, or suck at being 2nd on threat to pick up the boss when they are meant to, you'll have a bad time.