What's the scolding horde players get at the start of the Ardenweald's covenant?

[Syegfryed]

It was far too close to being the same for comfort, and after they got their asses kicked the Draenor Orcs still drank the Fel kool-aid anyway, sans like two clans and exiles from a third.

only a few then did, and some of then were forced anyway.

Just like the Draenei who also drank the fel kool-aid anyway there and became sargerei, i know its funny to just point at the orcs but try to look the whole picture.

Everyone's capable of slaughter, but nobody is as eager as the Orcs among the playable factions.

Of course humans are, thye slaughtr the whole easter kingdoms, draeneis are, mind you, 2/3 of their race joined feely the legion and slaughter countless planets

[Jastall]

only a few then did, and some of then were forced anyway.

Just like the Draenei who also drank the fel kool-aid anyway there and became sargerei, i know its funny to just point at the orcs but try to look the whole picture.



Of course humans are, thye slaughtr the whole easter kingdoms, draeneis are, mind you, 2/3 of their race joined feely the legion and slaughter countless planets

A few? Most of the Orcs you fight in Tanaan and all those in HFC are Fel Orcs, and they're the places that happen post Grommash getting captured. What's your source for them being a few.

Slaughter the Eastern Kingdoms? Whu? The only kingdom we know the humans punted were the Amani's, that's that, literal thousands of years ago. Sure, they killed a lot of Gnolls and Murlocs and such as well, but they're no more relevant than the Centaurs or Quilboars that even the nicer Horde murdered and displaced to colonize their lands.

The playable Draenei/Eredar might as well be another race to the Legion-aligned Man'ari. 25 000 years separate us from the rift and the Draenei are pacifists to a fault, even the Lightforged ones who are fanatics on paper but are best chums with Void knife-ears in practice, and they were the Legion's most outstanding enemy. Much like the Forsaken were once Scourge but broke off and opposed the other faction so much it becomes impossible to associate their crimes.

[Syegfryed]

A few? Most of the Orcs you fight in Tanaan and all those in HFC are Fel Orcs, and they're the places that happen post Grommash getting captured. What's your source for them being a few.

it was an almost defeated iron horde scattered around draenor, Gul'dan invoke the fel river and fucked up tanaan, anything there, winlingly or not would be corrupted anyway.

Slaughter the Eastern Kingdoms? Whu? The only kingdom we know the humans punted were the Amani's, that's that, literal thousands of years ago. Sure, they killed a lot of Gnolls and Murlocs and such as well, but they're no more relevant than the Centaurs or Quilboars that even the nicer Horde murdered and displaced to colonize their lands.

they slaughter the continent, killed dozen of other races and take their land, Horde killed and are not hypocrite to hide

The playable Draenei/Eredar might as well be another race to the Legion-aligned Man'ari.

they are the same race of eredar, most of their wicked race joined the Legion, freely, unlike orcs who were deceived, so lets not pretend only orcs did shit in this game.

[Mehrunes]

Slaughter the Eastern Kingdoms? Whu? The only kingdom we know the humans punted were the Amani's, that's that, literal thousands of years ago. Sure, they killed a lot of Gnolls and Murlocs and such as well, but they're no more relevant than the Centaurs or Quilboars that even the nicer Horde murdered and displaced to colonize their lands.

I kinda doubt the Gurrubashi just gave all the parts of their territory that now belongs to Stormwinds (so, most of their territory) to the humans out of respect of their potential.

[Zyky]

What atrocity?

Just to name a couple: Orc internment camps and the racism towards the High Elves of Quel'thalas treating them like slaves after Arthas destroyed their home. A couple more recent examples: Starting a faction conflict during the Legion invasion in Stormheim and Alliance rogues killing non-combatant miners in Silithus.

[Jastall]

I kinda doubt the Gurrubashi just gave all the parts of their territory that now belongs to Stormwinds (so, most of their territory) to the humans out of respect of their potential.

One guesses there's that, too, but did the Gurubashi even live in Westfal's fields or Elwynn's forests? There's no Troll ruins or tribes there whatsoever, whereas Amani ruins and remnants dot places like Hillsbrad, the now-Plaguelands or Arathi which the humans took from them. That Stormwind, or its, precursors warred on the Gurubashi is no secret and they likely took shit from them, but it seems doubtful they pushed into their heartlands in Stranglethorn or were intent on total conquest like the various Hordes were.

Regardless, that doesn't even equal what the Orcs did on OG Draenor, let alone if one adds Azeroth to the equation. Plus the point is the thread is why the Horde would get a light scolding, and I'd say we kind of earned it considering we fucked the shit of the race most closely tied to Wild Gods and destroyed a World Tree that Ysera blessed.

[Feanoro]

Oh no, the Alliance imprisoned the bloodthirsty monsters that slaughtered and burned their way up a whole continent! What a terrible crime!

No matter how many times I read Horde posters whining about the camps, I still can't believe anyone can claim the camps were an atrocity with a straight face. Then again, these are the same sick minds that insist the Legion's victims are to blame for not allowing themselves to be killed.

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Plus the point is the thread is why the Horde would get a light scolding, and I'd say we kind of earned it considering we fucked the shit of the race most closely tied to Wild Gods and destroyed a World Tree that Ysera blessed.

A light scolding? A LIGHT SCOLDING?! HOW DARE THEY?! LOKTAR OR RETREAT! DESTROY ARDENWEALD! FER DA HERD!

[alt-ithist]

Just to name a couple: Orc internment camps and the racism towards the High Elves of Quel'thalas treating them like slaves after Arthas destroyed their home. A couple more recent examples: Starting a faction conflict during the Legion invasion in Stormheim and Alliance rogues killing non-combatant miners in Silithus.

The camps were not an atrocity but and act of mercy. Racism towards the elf were from the people of Lorderan aka the forsaken so a horde issue. The faction conflict was already on the way since Varian died and if you say that Gen doesn’t have very good reason to want Sylvanas dead then you are stupid. The goblins in Silithis weren’t none combatant, Galywix stormed the site and killed all the alliance people there to set up camp to claim the Azerite.

[Zyky]

The camps were not an atrocity but and act of mercy. Racism towards the elf were from the people of Lorderan aka the forsaken so a horde issue. The faction conflict was already on the way since Varian died and if you say that Gen doesn’t have very good reason to want Sylvanas dead then you are stupid. The goblins in Silithis weren’t none combatant, Galywix stormed the site and killed all the alliance people there to set up camp to claim the Azerite.

Sure, you're not going to change your factually incorrect opinions, so I'm not going to bother with you.

[Feanoro]

Sure, you're not going to change your factually incorrect opinions, so I'm not going to bother with you.

It must be frustrating dealing with us infidels who refuse to reject canon for Horde fanfiction.

[Zyky]

It must be frustrating dealing with us infidels who refuse to reject canon for Horde fanfiction.

By not accepting the facts, you are rejecting canon. Canon proves EVERYTHING I stated and nothing he tried to claim.

[Lorgar Aurelian]

By not accepting the facts, you are rejecting canon. Canon proves EVERYTHING I stated and nothing he tried to claim.

But the canon kinda doesn’t prove every thing you said right.

The canon says it was kill the orcs or camp them with camping them being the merciful option. One that even hurt the people of the alliance but the king stuck to it any way.

The canon also only shows the people of lorderon being racist or trying to enslave the elfs. The only statement we have On the other people of the alliance is that they sent support not knowing what was going on.

The cannon also doesn’t support the killing of non combatant miners it paints a picture of the explorers league going to see the site and being killed by said miners there is never anh mention of any non combatants being killed before that or even if there were ever any non combatants there in the first place.

[Musta]

You deserve worse.

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Everyone who decided to "play genocide" deserves to be put down like the rabid animals they actually are :P

Infracted.

[Lolites]

IYou are alliance fanatics are the worst. You are the most toxic community in the game.

you call people fanatics bcs they point out truth (that both sides did shit and both are excused for it) instead of biased onsided point of view, and its THEM who is toxic... sure...

[Ardenaso]

What atrocity?

Graft and corruption against the Stonemasons
Genocide of the Stonespire Tribe and desecration of their ancestral heritage lands
Espionage and sabotaging of the Blood Elves' three moon crystal vaults and their mana crystals
Massacre of Goblins in a certain ship
Camp meme
Shooting down Horde surrenderees
Purge of Dalaran
Massacre of civilians in Dazar'alor

(though you could justify them as "they were acting alone and Varian/Anduin would never sponsor it" or "it was a response")

or if we're counting the Alliance of Lordaeron

Tiannanmen Massacre at Tyr's Hand
Total desolation and eventual neglect of Alterac
Attempted genocide at the Darkspears, twice, in just Warcraft 3 alone
Betrayal of Ice Trolls and Northrend's locals
Kirin Tor's neglect of the Blood Elves during the Garithos

[Theoris]

While the Legion has destroyed multiple worlds I was mostly talking about who did the most damage in Azeroth.

Unlike the Legion, the Horde never caused a cataclysm on Azeroth that split its landmass into several continents.

The Scourge comparison I get (especially with BfA), but even without the Sundering, the Legion has the Horde beat by miles.

The Horde has done more damage than Legion or the Scourge at this point and of course they have Draenor their own world to the list of destroyed worlds.

As opposed to the Legion's millenniums-long genocide campaign across the universe, where they enslaved or annihilated countless civilizations and worlds along the way. But the Horde has done more damage than them because they wrecked one planet?

You're reaching.

edit:
By the way, "they did more damage to Azeroth because Draenor". What?

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I understand that many horde players are also annoyed by it, but fact is, that the horde did greater damage to the alliance than the scourge, the burning legion and N'zoth together. And not in a grey area, I am only talking about the times when they were clearly acting evil.

I am talking about Garroshs Horde, Sylvanas Horde, partly Thralls Horde (see Warsong assaults) and every Horde before.

Repeating myself a bit here: comparing the damage the Horde has done [to Azeroth] to the Scourge's toll I get. But the Scourge, the Legion and N'Zoth combined?

Seriously, what's with the blatant dishonesty?

[SoundOfGuns]

While the Legion has destroyed multiple worlds I was mostly talking about who did the most damage in Azeroth. The Horde has done more damage than Legion or the Scourge at this point and of course they have Draenor their own world to the list of destroyed worlds.

So the Horde with the burning of Teldrassil and the war...

...caused more damage in your eyes than the sundering that split the continent apart, than the scourge when turning all of the northern Kingdoms into the living dead or into Worgen, the old gods that basically are responsible for every other bad thing ever, ... What the fuck.

And horde still blames Muh Camps, Muh Eredar, Muh Azshara summoning dem Demons and Muh Garithos on Alliance. So what?

Yea, thing is tho, 'bruh' that these things did happen, and nobody claimed that was worse than what the big bads of the lore ever did, but sure... I know Fanboys got a real issue with perception, but come on.

Also again: WWC3 Horde is not the same Horde that was on Draenor that was commanded by the Legion... Especially that Bronie probably should go back reading.

Not saying the Horde behaved as it should have post Thrall, but conflating entirely different entities here just to proof your point is a bit... ya know... 2016.

[Kalisandra]

Garrosh's invasions of Ashenvale was at least partially justified. After WC3 the orcs and night elves made a deal. The Horde gather lumber with the druid's supervision so they don't hurt the forest and trade food to the orcs which they need cause they live in a desert. The orcs in turn trade them other goods. The night elves unilaterally broke this treaty after Wrathgate even after it was proven the Horde was not at fault. How many governments in real life can unilaterially break a treaty and expect no retaliation?

Crank up WoW Classic and go for a ride around Ashenvale, including the areas the Horde are exploiting. What do we see? A whole bunch of Horde, including ones with names like 'Horde Deforester'. No Night Elf Druids in sight. These Horde are all hostile to Alliance and shoot on sight. The Warsong Lumber Camp and surrounds isn't an area where sustainable forestry is being practised at all, and it is in fact outright clear-felling with no replanting or soil conservation being performed.

As I recall, there are some Alliance quests to go in there and do some replanting, and when you do this you're attacked by every horde mob around.

The guards at the tower outside Splintertree will attack Alliance who are on the road, in their own territory (according to the treaty). You claim that the Night Elfs broke that treaty? The Horde are ignoring it long before Cataclysm, before Garrosh is Warchief.

And when a country breaks a trade treaty, you break it right back, and maybe don't pay any outstanding bills for good received. You don't go and invade their territory, strip mine and clear fell everything, put everyone you meet in cages (as the Horde did to the Firbolg, who's homes they were cutting down), and burn all the towns you find.

Besides that, Theramore was used as a staging group for attacked into Horde territories who were completely uninvolved in the Ashenvale campaign. Every Horde member killed and Horde town attacked through Dustwallow, all of the Barrens, and Mulgore who had nothing to do with Garrosh. Imagine the US attacks Canada so England lands troops in Panana and cuts a bloody swath through all of Central America to get at the US.

No, this is like the US invading and razing eastern Canada, and Canada then invading the US north-west.

[Darth-Piekus]

So the Horde with the burning of Teldrassil and the war...

...caused more damage in your eyes than the sundering that split the continent apart, than the scourge when turning all of the northern Kingdoms into the living dead or into Worgen, the old gods that basically are responsible for every other bad thing ever, ... What the fuck.



Yea, thing is tho, 'bruh' that these things did happen, and nobody claimed that was worse than what the big bads of the lore ever did, but sure... I know Fanboys got a real issue with perception, but come on.

Also again: WWC3 Horde is not the same Horde that was on Draenor that was commanded by the Legion... Especially that Bronie probably should go back reading.

Not saying the Horde behaved as it should have post Thrall, but conflating entirely different entities here just to proof your point is a bit... ya know... 2016.

Technically the well collapsed upon itself when Malfurion intervened with the Dragon Soul to stop the connection between the Highborne and the Legion and caused the Sundering. A similar event was avoided when the Alliance Expedition closed the Dark Portal when Nerzhul started opening portals to various worlds which would have started a chain reaction from Draenor to Azeroth but instead destroyed only Draenor. Another second event Thrall feared would have happened if Garrosh was not stopped. You see he was tampering with the elements using his Dark Shaman. Need to mention Garrosh's vision? And it's not only the World Tree. Theramore, Southshore, Andorhal, Gilneas. The Horde has destroyed what the Legion couldn't in 3 attacks in Azeroth and could have destroyed more. These are cold hard facts from a brony and I think you should go back and read the lore again.

[Syegfryed]

Crank up WoW Classic and go for a ride around Ashenvale, including the areas the Horde are exploiting. What do we see? A whole bunch of Horde, including ones with names like 'Horde Deforester'. No Night Elf Druids in sight. These Horde are all hostile to Alliance and shoot on sight. The Warsong Lumber Camp and surrounds isn't an area where sustainable forestry is being practised at all, and it is in fact outright clear-felling with no replanting or soil conservation being performed.

yes and? the alliance was also attacking an killing the orcs who were already there., you think the night elves wee not hostile and shoot on sight too? hell the very beginning of the fight in ashenvale start because the night elves shoot on sight first.

The guards at the tower outside Splintertree will attack Alliance who are on the road, in their own territory (according to the treaty). You claim that the Night Elfs broke that treaty? The Horde are ignoring it long before Cataclysm, before Garrosh is Warchief.

The night elves broke first, attacking the warsong in ashenvale trying to drive then out, since they were neutral after the legion, they could not drive then out alone and thas why they joined the alliance in the first place

And when a country breaks a trade treaty, you break it right back, and maybe don't pay any outstanding bills for good received

you think this is some sort of real world shenanigans? people were starving and dying without the resources of ashenvale, not just the wood, they refuse to help and trade and Garrosh did what was necessary for his people survival, every other leader would the same, the conflict only escalated that much because night elves refused by any mens found a common ground before, and now no dog want to give up the bone.