Dragonflight Alpha/Beta General Discussion

[Makorus]

Man, two insufferable extremists of certain ideas arguing.

How boring.

Anyway, don't overanalyze the stupid whelpling. The only thing ever worth analyzing are store mounts, and while there was the Steamscale Incinerator, it was obviously there to tie in with the Mechagnomes, because it came out shortly after or before 8.3, if I remember correctly. Blizzcon/Anniversary stuff never had a deeper meaning.

[Log Cabin]

Cool. At least your opinions are consistent.



Hasn't pretty much every WoW expansion dealt with the light and the void in some fashion? We've even dealt with the Light and the Void in Shadowlands.

That's a rather ambiguous statement.

They really, really seem to want to do a " hey guys the light might not be so good" twist. They see that boring done to death writers trope as super compelling writing.

[Varodoc]

They really, really seem to want to do a " hey guys the light might not be so good" twist. They see that boring done to death writers trope as super compelling writing.

Scarlet Crusade: Hello.

Twilight Vindicator: Hello too.

The problem is just that they decided to turn Yrel into a villain specifically when her hatred against the orcs is 100% justified.

[Kiivar86]

I'd rather "hey the Light isn't as good as you think" than "hey the light is boring good."

[Log Cabin]

Scarlet Crusade: Hello.

Twilight Vindicator: Hello too.

The problem is just that they decided to turn Yrel into a villain specifically when her hatred against the orcs is 100% justified.

HEY DIDN"T YOU SEE HOW SAD HELLSCREAM WAS WHEN THE DEMONS TURNED ON HIM?!?

I try to forget most blizzard story telling exists... freeing hellscream rather then slitting his throat made absolutely no fucking zero sense as an alliance player in WoD. The guy started a interdimensional war for the sole reason being an absolute stranger to him told him they could fuck some place up.

Edit: I can't write to good without my coffee.

[Varodoc]

HEY DIDN"T YOU SEE HOW SAD HELLSCREAM WAS WHEN THE DEMONS TURNED ON HIM?!?

I try to forget most blizzard story telling exists... freeing hellscream rather then slitting his throat made absolutely no fucking zero sense as an alliance player in WoD. The guy started a interdimensional war for the sole reason an absolute stranger to him told him they could fuck some place up.

Edit: I can't write to good without my coffee.

That is the problem with the Lightbound storyline.

It's not the "twist" that the Light can be tyrannical, because that's been in the game since Classic (Scarlet Crusade), what is stupid about that storyline is how Yrel is treated as the villain and the orcs are white-washed, almost as if their attempted genocides against the Draenei in WoD never happened.

But then again Blizzard has always, a l w a y s, had a bias for white-washing orcs

[Log Cabin]

That is the problem with the Lightbound storyline.

It's not the "twist" that the Light can be tyrannical, because that's been in the game since Classic (Scarlet Crusade), what is stupid about that storyline is how Yrel is treated as the villain and the orcs are white-washed, almost as if their attempted genocides against the Draenei in WoD never happened.

But then again Blizzard has always, a l w a y s, had a bias for white-washing orcs

I think warhammer did or at least before age of sigmar ( I haven't played it since then) "holy" magic better. It didn't really care about morality but rather relied on the intent combined with the belief of the wielder and was seen as perfectly explainable by the other races as just another form of magic that required rituals and incantations. Introducing the naaru never seemed like a good idea to me.

[Teriz]

Oh so the Light and Void are rooted in Classic Warcraft after all?

As basic concepts where magic comes from; yes.

The more recent concepts like the Void Lords that were only created because we've beaten the Old Gods and needed to up the ante in terms of power levels is not rooted in classic Warcraft. Hence the problem; We're upping the ante on power levels because of these cosmic expansions. I mean, in this expansion we're on the verge of defeating death. Upping the power levels on this scale is not good for the long running health of a MMO.

- - - Updated - - -

They really, really seem to want to do a " hey guys the light might not be so good" twist. They see that boring done to death writers trope as super compelling writing.

Yeah, I can see that on the horizon as well. I could definitely see an expansion where we are invaded by Yrel's Lightbound army and Turlyon betraying Stormwind and joining her. That could be an interesting little twist supported by the fact that Anduin is corrupted by Shadow magic and that corruption could sow mistrust within the Alliance.

That concept is far more interesting than us going into some new realm where we're fighting "the Void" for an entire expansion.

[Nyel]

They have promised an expansion that won't end like WoD. And pretty much anyone seems to be in agreement that this means the expansion will not end on 9.2 or 9.2.5.

Factually that's not correct though. Even Ion said after the release of 9.1 this game won't be another WoD scenario because 9.2 is coming. 9.2 already makes Shadowlands not another WoD. That some players won't or don't understand this might be problematic, but neither 9.2.5 nor 9.3 are required to make this statement true.

- - - Updated - - -

Okay then if you're only looking at patch numbers MoP was the expansion with the most content ever.

Which is true overall, depending on how you count. MoP added one massive new zone and two smaller ones. Throne of Thunder and Siege of Orgrimmar were massive raids and the expansion basically launched with three initial raids (none of them was a 1-boss-encounter). You could debate Legion did add as much, but MoP is definitely Top 2.

[Log Cabin]

As basic concepts where magic comes from; yes.

The more recent concepts like the Void Lords that were only created because we've beaten the Old Gods and needed to up the ante in terms of power levels is not rooted in classic Warcraft. Hence the problem; We're upping the ante on power levels because of these cosmic expansions. I mean, in this expansion we're on the verge of defeating death. Upping the power levels on this scale is not good for the long running health of a MMO.

- - - Updated - - -



Yeah, I can see that on the horizon as well. I could definitely see an expansion where we are invaded by Yrel's Lightbound army and Turlyon betraying Stormwind and joining her. That could be an interesting little twist supported by the fact that Anduin is corrupted by Shadow magic and that corruption could sow mistrust within the Alliance.

That concept is far more interesting than us going into some new realm where we're fighting "the Void" for an entire expansion.

Why would anyone trust anduin with anything in general? Pre shadowlands he didn't do anything but cry and get magically disguised as a stable boy to visit common citizens he looked down upon while weirdly envying at the same time according to the poorly written novel and in game I don't think he has accomplished anything beyond being a powerful healer.

It never really felt right that he held any power in a leadership positon.

[Teriz]

Why would anyone trust anduin with anything in general? Pre shadowlands he didn't do anything but cry and get magically disguised as a stable boy to visit common citizens he looked down upon while weirdly envying at the same time according to the poorly written novel and in game I don't think he has accomplished anything beyond being a powerful healer.

It never really felt right that he held any power in a leadership positon.

Which simply adds to the potential of such an expansion; There are some in the Alliance who view Anduin as weak from jump, so Turalyon defecting to Yrel could cause a seismic rift within the Alliance and open up several interesting story possibilities. Also Yrel simply being a soldier for the light and being supported by the Naaru could have some very devastating effects within the Draenei faction as well.

I'm just saying; If you're going to go on the "Light can be evil" twist, go that route.

[Log Cabin]

Which simply adds to the potential of such an expansion; There are some in the Alliance who view Anduin as weak from jump, so Turalyon defecting to Yrel could cause a seismic rift within the Alliance and open up several interesting story possibilities. Also Yrel simply being a soldier for the light and being supported by the Naaru could have some very devastating effects within the Draenei faction as well.

I just don't think blizzard has the chops to write a story like that. I still remember how butchered garrosh was. He didn't even feel like a real or consistent character until WoD just in time for him to die. That said he is still the best written war chief since thrall

[Teriz]

I just don't think blizzard has the chops to write a story like that. I still remember how butchered garrosh was. He didn't even feel like a real or consistent character until WoD just in time for him to die. That said he is still the best written war chief since thrall

Well the set up is there; Turalyon is currently the leader of Stormwind, we had that Naaru do some questionable things in 9.0, Yrel was hinted at earlier in this expansion by Blizzard, Anduin is corrupted and has done some "bad" things, and there's that Old God prophesy that appears to hint at Turalyon going turncoat at some point.

We'll see what happens. Like I said, I have my fingers crossed that if they want to go with "Evil Light" they go that route.

[Dracullus]

The only thing ever worth analyzing are store mounts, and while there was the Steamscale Incinerator, it was obviously there to tie in with the Mechagnomes, because it came out shortly after or before 8.3, if I remember correctly. Blizzcon/Anniversary stuff never had a deeper meaning.

Steamscale Incinerator wasn't mount hinting new expansion, it was released mid 2020 way later than all BfA patches. Sylverian Dreamer year earlier was hint for SL.

Blizzcon rarely has mount and pets are usually another Murloc. But we had Horde/Alliance warship that hinted BfA back in 2017.

[Alanar]

Cool. At least your opinions are consistent.



Hasn't pretty much every WoW expansion dealt with the light and the void in some fashion? We've even dealt with the Light and the Void in Shadowlands.

That's a rather ambiguous statement.

If blizzard really want to lose even more players a light vs void cosmic war expansion is the perfect idea.
They will have atleast 1 person playing.

[hipolnalrt]

Just dropping the thread in my signature again....

I really think the hints are piling up for a time based expansion for better or worse.

[Varodoc]

Just dropping the thread in my signature again....

I really think the hints are piling up for a time based expansion for better or worse.

Infinite Dragons, like Naga, are too much of a niche in Blizzard's mindset to carry an expansion.

But they might have a content patch in the Light and Void expansion, since they are creatures affiliated with the Void.

[Teriz]

If blizzard really want to lose even more players a light vs void cosmic war expansion is the perfect idea.
They will have atleast 1 person playing.

I agree. I believe part of the reason people are lukewarm on Shadowlands is because it's so disconnected from Azeroth and in-game logic. I don't think that the community wants yet another expansion where we're off-world fighting literal gods and cosmic forces we really have no business fighting.

[Soikona]

Which simply adds to the potential of such an expansion; There are some in the Alliance who view Anduin as weak from jump, so Turalyon defecting to Yrel could cause a seismic rift within the Alliance and open up several interesting story possibilities. Also Yrel simply being a soldier for the light and being supported by the Naaru could have some very devastating effects within the Draenei faction as well.

I'm just saying; If you're going to go on the "Light can be evil" twist, go that route.

Which is the only route to take and is part of the predictable element. I’m not sure what you were trying to say.

- - - Updated - - -

Just dropping the thread in my signature again....

I really think the hints are piling up for a time based expansion for better or worse.

Jesus that sounds horrid. Anything time related tends to do it horribly, and the ones that can do it, are a lot smarter than the team we currently have.

[hipolnalrt]

Just dropping the thread in my signature again....

I really think the hints are piling up for a time based expansion for better or worse.

Also - the Infinite symbol keeps appearing: