Bard Class for Next Utility After Augvoker

[FamousFrank]

So Blizz said, if Augvoker works out, there will be more buffing classes/specs in the future.

My money's on Bard.

What do you think will be the next one?

[Teriz]

There won’t be an entire class based on support. If Augvoker is a success, Blizzard states that they’re going to add specs to existing classes.

If we ever get Bards, it’ll be a 4th spec for Rogues, since like Dark Rangers and Hunters, Bards appeared in the Rogue class hall. Thus, according to Blizzard, Bards are a type of Rogue. I’d put my money on it being a melee healing spec.


Beyond that, Shaman will more than likely get an Earth spec (Tanking), Monks will get a Red Crane spec (Healing/Fistweaving), and Hunters will get a Dark Ranger spec (DPS).

[Ielenia]

There won’t be an entire class based on support.

The OP never said "a class based ENTIRELY on support". He only said that he's hopeful that the bard class is the next one added.

If we ever get Bards, it’ll be a 4th spec for Rogues,

You're welcome to that opinion, just like it's other people's opinion that bards merits its own class, and that tinker is just going to be a hunter's fourth spec.

But on the OP: yes, I hope that the bard class is the next one added. It's the only "core class" for most RPGs around, online or table-top, that is missing from WoW's class lineup, and one I adore.

[Teriz]

The OP never said "a class based ENTIRELY on support". He only said that he's hopeful that the bard class is the next one added.

You're welcome to that opinion, just like it's other people's opinion that bards merits its own class, and that tinker is just going to be a hunter's fourth spec.

If Tinkers had anything to do with Hunters, but they don’t. Unlike Bards which are linked to Rogues.

In the end, if we get Bards, it’ll be a Rogue spec.

[Ielenia]

If Tinkers had anything to do with Hunters,

They have more to do with hunters than bards have to do with rogues, considering hunters have a non-insignificant amount of tech gadgets in their arsenal but rogues don't have a single musical ability.

In the end, if we get Bards, it’ll be a Rogue spec.

Again: you're welcome to that opinion, just like it's other people's opinion that the bard concept merits its own class, and that the tinker is just going to be a hunter's fourth spec.

Bards are just too versatile a concept to be restricted to a single spec of a class that is not about spellcasting. It's like giving warriors an arcane spec, or the warlock a holy spec. The bard can be a melee fighter, a ranged fighter, a spellcaster and a healer. It's versatile enough that you don't even need 'support' to make it a viable bard in a game.

[Runicblood]

They have more to do with hunters than bards have to do with rogues, considering hunters have a non-insignificant amount of tech gadgets in their arsenal but rogues don't have a single musical ability.


Again: you're welcome to that opinion, just like it's other people's opinion that the bard concept merits its own class, and that the tinker is just going to be a hunter's fourth spec.

Bards are just too versatile a concept to be restricted to a single spec of a class that is not about spellcasting. It's like giving warriors an arcane spec, or the warlock a holy spec. The bard can be a melee fighter, a ranged fighter, a spellcaster and a healer. It's versatile enough that you don't even need 'support' to make it a viable bard in a game.

what kind of ranged fighting or spell casting would a bard be capable of lol

[Nightshade711]

There won’t be an entire class based on support. If Augvoker is a success, Blizzard states that they’re going to add specs to existing classes.

If we ever get Bards, it’ll be a 4th spec for Rogues, since like Dark Rangers and Hunters, Bards appeared in the Rogue class hall. Thus, according to Blizzard, Bards are a type of Rogue. I’d put my money on it being a melee healing spec.

A bard class wouldn’t be based entirely around support.
ETC in Hots doesn’t have any support abilities for example, and a hypothetical bard class would absolutely have a spec based around them.

[ro9ue]

While I can see Bards being either a profession or full-fledged class, I'd personally like Rogues to get Bard as a 4th spec because I think they need to add additional roles to pure dps classes for more gameplay options. Frankly, I would also convert Outlaw into a tank spec based on dodging/parrying.

On Rogue Bards - you can check out Rift Bards for what they could be like, since Rift copied the combo point system from WoW and their Bard used it. It's what I played in that game and found it pretty fun overall.

[Jujudrood]

I could see arguments for Bard being a Rogue spec to fit in the WoW universe.
It's not uncommon for Bards in other fantasy genres to be considered scoundrels and such, using their abilities and deception and whatnot.
Seems to fit well with WoW's take on a rogue, and if they add a new spec, it could be the 'flashy' version of Outlaw as a support DPS.

But I could also see a whole class, if they wanted, because you could have melee DPS, ranged DPS, and heals, with any (or multiple) of those flavors having support features.
Battle songs and shit like that, temporary buffs that grant some form of buff to friends/debuff to enemies, maintain a Vicious Mockery debuff on targets to make them deal 3% less 'standard' damage or something, as a small tank helper, I dunno.

If it was down to Bard being a spec or class, I think I'd lean towards Class with 2-3 specs.

[Teriz]

They have more to do with hunters than bards have to do with rogues, considering hunters have a non-insignificant amount of tech gadgets in their arsenal but rogues don't have a single musical ability.

False. Bards appear in the Rogue halls, just like Dark Rangers appear in Hunter halls. We all know what happened with Dark Rangers don't we?

If we look at the two major Tinkers in the game; Gazlowe and Mekkatorque, neither one of them are running around with mechanical beasts as pets, and they don't even use guns or ranged weapons. Instead they're running around in Mech suits and using lasers and other high-tech gear. That has nothing to do with the hunter class.

Again: you're welcome to that opinion, just like it's other people's opinion that the bard concept merits its own class, and that the tinker is just going to be a hunter's fourth spec.

Bards are just too versatile a concept to be restricted to a single spec of a class that is not about spellcasting. It's like giving warriors an arcane spec, or the warlock a holy spec. The bard can be a melee fighter, a ranged fighter, a spellcaster and a healer. It's versatile enough that you don't even need 'support' to make it a viable bard in a game.

Yes, that is completely your opinion, but as I've said numerous times, that isn't how Blizzard has ever defined the class in any WC media ever. Typically it's a guy playing a lute and singing. That's about it. Why can't we have a Rogue whip out a lute and play tunes utilizing combo points?

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A bard class wouldn’t be based entirely around support.
ETC in Hots doesn’t have any support abilities for example, and a hypothetical bard class would absolutely have a spec based around them.

No, they'll probably be attached to a standard role but have support abilities. IMO, you're probably looking at damage support or healing where Rogues deal damage, build combo points, and their combo spenders are songs that enhance the power of the group. Length and power of song is determined by number of combo points used.

[Linkedblade]

There won’t be an entire class based on support. If Augvoker is a success, Blizzard states that they’re going to add specs to existing classes.

If we ever get Bards, it’ll be a 4th spec for Rogues, since like Dark Rangers and Hunters, Bards appeared in the Rogue class hall. Thus, according to Blizzard, Bards are a type of Rogue. I’d put my money on it being a melee healing spec.


Beyond that, Shaman will more than likely get an Earth spec (Tanking), Monks will get a Red Crane spec (Healing/Fistweaving), and Hunters will get a Dark Ranger spec (DPS).

blood mage healer, please.

[Teriz]

blood mage healer, please.

I think a Blood Mage would ironically fit better in Warlocks than Mages.

[Linkedblade]

I think a Blood Mage would ironically fit better in Warlocks than Mages.

To be fair, the difference between a mage and warlock in wow is whether you use fel magic or order magic.

[Nightshade711]

No, they'll probably be attached to a standard role but have support abilities. IMO, you're probably looking at damage support or healing where Rogues deal damage, build combo points, and their combo spenders are songs that enhance the power of the group. Length and power of song is determined by number of combo points used.

That’s what a “support spec” is in WoW, yes.

[Teriz]

To be fair, the difference between a mage and warlock in wow is whether you use fel magic or order magic.

Yeah, but warlocks have abilities like Drain Life, Drain Soul, Health Funnel, Soul Stones, and Health Stones. That's more in line with Blood Magic than what Mages do.

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That’s what a “support spec” is in WoW, yes.

Yes, and Bards will fit right in. A couple of stabby abilities, build up combos, then whip out your lute and play a song to buff the group.

[Lolites]

So Blizz said, if Augvoker works out, there will be more buffing classes/specs in the future.

when did they say that?
afaik they only said IF they will ever do more support specs they would add specs, not rework current specs

[Ielenia]

what kind of ranged fighting or spell casting would a bard be capable of lol

Ranged fighting: bows, crossbows and guns are a thing in WoW, I hope you didn't forget.
Spellcasting: song-based magic is a thing in WoW as well.

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False. Bards appear in the Rogue halls, just like Dark Rangers appear in Hunter halls. We all know what happened with Dark Rangers don't we?

Call me when Blizzard considers giving rogues a talent called "bard" in an expansion's beta testing. What happened to one concept doesn't mean that is what will happen to another concept. Not to mention that the 'dark ranger' concept is somewhat similar in concept in that both are centered around the use of ranged weapons, with few differences, especially considering that both concepts can do heavy battlefield control, what with the hunters' traps and the dark ranger's charm and slows. Whereas there's no class in the game that even comes close to the bard concept.

If we look at the two major Tinkers in the game; Gazlowe and Mekkatorque, neither one of them are running around with mechanical beasts as pets, and they don't even use guns or ranged weapons.

And if we look at rogues in the game, they don't go around wielding musical instruments that they use to cast song-based magic. That's my point here: you're trying to fit a square peg through a round hole.

Yes, that is completely your opinion,

It is my opinion. Unlike you, I don't pretend my opinion is fact.

but as I've said numerous times, that isn't how Blizzard has ever defined the class in any WC media ever.

So what? That doesn't really mean anything. That doesn't preclude the addition of a proper bard class inspired in the RPG concept of the bard. Blizzard also never defined the monk as someone who manipulates magical mists in any Warcraft media ever, too, before the playable class becoming a reality. Blizzard also never portrayed the draenei as elegant light-worshipper aliens from outer space who are the same race as one of the demon races in the Burning Legion before the race became playable. Etc, etc.

IMO, you're probably looking at damage support or healing where Rogues deal damage, build combo points, and their combo spenders are songs that enhance the power of the group.

What you're describing is neither a rogue or a bard, though. Bards don't go doing sneak attacks, and rogues don't cast song-based magic. Again, what you're doing is akin to giving the warrior class an arcane spec, or warlocks a holy spec.

[Nightshade711]

Yes, and Bards will fit right in. A couple of stabby abilities, build up combos, then whip out your lute and play a song to buff the group.

That would be a spec for the hypothetical bard class likely yes.

[Teriz]

That would be a spec for the hypothetical bard class likely yes.

Why would you need an entirely new class? Rogues do the hefty lifting of the concept already.

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What you're describing is neither a rogue or a bard, though. Bards don't go doing sneak attacks, and rogues don't cast song-based magic. Again, what you're doing is akin to giving the warrior class an arcane spec, or warlocks a holy spec.

This is your definition of Rogues and Bards, nothing more, nothing less. Like I said, Blizzard placed Bards in the Rogue’s class hall for a reason. Just like there’s Necromancers in the DK hall, and Dark Rangers in the Hunter class hall.

Anyway, no point of discussing this further. You can have the last word. If Blizzard implements 4th specs, we’ll see the results soon enough.

[Urti]

FWIW, in D&D (a pretty heavy influence on WoW specifically and fantasy in general), Bards have historically always been associated with rogues until fairly recently. In 2nd edition bard made up literally half of the rogue family of classes, alongside Thief. In 3rd and forward that connection has lessened, but the rakish/fast-talker/swashbuckler/con-man flavors of bard are ABSOLUTELY in line with general rogueish archetypes

TL;DR: Bards are 100% viable as a flavor of rogues, if Blizz wants to go that way.