Boost & mount haha

[Kralljin]

Bots are on since 2004. There is no chance to cut them out permanently.

You miss the point, you said that due to the boost, there will be less botters and thus a better economy, i said the boost will have the opposite effect because goldfarmers will use the boost to get their bots going ASAP, which obviously leads to a worse economy.

Stick to what i say, not what you want to read into this post, i refute the claim it's going to help the economy and going further to say that will make things worse.
I didn't claim that not having a boost will somehow resolve the botting issue.

Shop boost will take some gold from the game and take cash from bots that i real thing.

They're just going to make even more money in other areas because they can get a bunch of new bots up in no time whenever they want to.

[erifwodahs]

That's just you trying to rationalize liking p2w. The same thing can be said with all mobile games or world of tanks too. If you start 5 years later than others and put in 1000 euros to catch up then it's not pay to win anymore?
Does that affect other vanilla patches? Since After Naxxramas came out MC and AQ are old content.

We even have Belfs and Draenei that especially don't get the p2w boost. They even limited it at only 1. It's very clear it's a pay money to gain power feature that they limited.

While it is sort of p2w, it's a very weak one. You don't get to level cap, you don't get epic items, you don't get epic mount, you don't get professions, we don't know about skills and pet talents yet.
One could say that leveling now would certainly be better than boosting and having to do 2-3 days of pure grind for professions alone, even if we ignore mount price. This boost only gives us a chance to play TBC and not do the classic stuff on ONE CHARACTER.

Comparing this boost to catch up endgame content items and flat out skipping raids has just destroyed your argument because you are moaning to moan and don't really know what you are talking about. Even if it was boost to 70 and full dungeon set, epic flying and attunements done it would not be as bad as what you compared to.

[Thestrawman]

They can do it if they want to. It's still p2w. That's why there should be fresh realms without boosts, and the ones who don't mind can play on existing realms. I never said they should endure it. They can be on their p2w realms all they want.

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Have you heard of a saying win a battle but lose a war? It's used with narrow minded commanders. There's many parts to the game.
Personally I don't enjoy raiding at all and it's really boring. I don't call it winning. To me dailies, gold and 70lvls are winning. So I should be able to buy Sunwell gear for money and it's not p2w?

Please show me someone who thinks they "won" by being level 58.

[kukkamies]

While it is sort of p2w, it's a very weak one. You don't get to level cap, you don't get epic items, you don't get epic mount, you don't get professions, we don't know about skills and pet talents yet.
One could say that leveling now would certainly be better than boosting and having to do 2-3 days of pure grind for professions alone, even if we ignore mount price. This boost only gives us a chance to play TBC and not do the classic stuff on ONE CHARACTER.

Comparing this boost to catch up endgame content items and flat out skipping raids has just destroyed your argument because you are moaning to moan and don't really know what you are talking about. Even if it was boost to 70 and full dungeon set, epic flying and attunements done it would not be as bad as what you compared to.

What I'm for is that the boost is p2w. And seems that you agree. So why is my argument destroyed when you agree?

[Rageadon]

Even a new player could start playing after at level 58 and be ok, gamers are not backpaddling mouse clicking kids with "my first computer game".

They might not be kids, but they sure backpaddle and click

[kukkamies]

Please show me someone who thinks they "won" by being level 58.

You must be trolling by now. Are you truly unable to understand that skipping 58 levels is a benefit, skipping maybe 60 hours of gameplay and gets you closer to finishing the whole game?
That's literally what p2w is. Speeds you up so you're better than those who don't.

[Rageadon]

What I'm for is that the boost is p2w. And seems that you agree. So why is my argument destroyed when you agree?

Its not p2w, do you win the game when youre lvl 58? Is that the end content to get to 58? Running around in blue gear on ur 60% mount and no gold? Is that winning in ur book?

[Askyl]

HAHAHA. Fucking hell Blizzard, have you no shame? Let's start off TBC with allowing people to boost and buy a mount...that's unthinkable. Only Blizzard.

Yeah! The people with 0 gold, 0 professions, lvl 58 och a 60% mount will ruin the game for everyone with T2-T3 gear, 10k+ gold and epic mounts. Its an obvious thing, since a lot of people just want to jump straight into TBC and now they can with 1 character only, if they pay, that will be at a disadvantage towards the rest of the community.

[Mosotti]

I fundamentally agree with all the changes they put in. I won't use any boost, but I don't want people who like TBC but not classic to spend several /played days going through something they don't like just to play the thing they want to play. A lot of them would most likely not bother to run around like idiots until level 30, so they won't play at all. I want people to play the actual expansion, not to be chased away by several days of leveling.

The economy is fucked already, all the arguments about economy are just plain stupid. People bought tons of gold for the last 2 years and will continue to do so. Who the fuck cares, there's nothing to be done, you have old people with jobs returning to an old game, who make in an hour enough money to buy maybe a day or more of farming for gold in game. Of course they will buy gold, if gold is what they want... That's more p2w than the silly level 58 boost.

There are currently boost service sites through Naxx and people complain about the 58 level boost being p2w. Lol.

[erifwodahs]

What I'm for is that the boost is p2w. And seems that you agree. So why is my argument destroyed when you agree?

I did not say that there is no argument. Argument exists even if you don't point that out.
What you did is just destroyed any credibility, therefore anything you say is just not worth considering as you seem to blow it out and put loads of strawmans in.

[Thestrawman]

You must be trolling by now. Are you truly unable to understand that skipping 58 levels is a benefit, skipping maybe 60 hours of gameplay and gets you closer to finishing the whole game?
That's literally what p2w is. Speeds you up so you're better than those who don't.

So if I boost I get to go into Hellfire first? Get early access into TBC? Because otherwise I'd be behind those at level 60. Or even those at 58 because they'd have money. Doesn't sound like winning to me.

[kukkamies]

Its not p2w, do you win the game when youre lvl 58? Is that the end content to get to 58? Running around in blue gear on ur 60% mount and no gold? Is that winning in ur book?

Are you of the opinion that nothing can be p2w? Because you never literally win WoW so nothing can ever be p2w.

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I did not say that there is no argument. Argument exists even if you don't point that out.
What you did is just destroyed any credibility, therefore anything you say is just not worth considering as you seem to blow it out and put loads of strawmans in.

If you read the conversation it's about whether the boost is p2w or not. And you clearly say "While it is sort of p2w, it's a very weak one". Please tell me why that doesn't have any credibility? Do you also not have any credibility?

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So if I boost I get to go into Hellfire first? Get early access into TBC? Because otherwise I'd be behind those at level 60. Or even those at 58 because they'd have money. Doesn't sound like winning to me.

And if I don't boost I'll be at level 1. Behind you while we both did nothing. Sounds like booster is the winner to me.

[chrisnumbers]

You aren't convincing anyone that a 58 boost is p2w or even "buying an advantage in the game". All buying a 58 boost does is save you time.
What you have to do is convince me of why you think that I have to level 1-58 by hand, without using "p2w!" as an argument, because it's been 32 pages. Threads only go this long when it's a battle of opinions and very little facts. Constantly asserting that it's "pay to win" isn't working, nor is it even true.

[kukkamies]

You aren't convincing anyone that a 58 boost is p2w or even "buying an advantage in the game". All buying a 58 boost does is save you time.
What you have to do is convince me of why you think that I have to level 1-58 by hand, without using "p2w!" as an argument, because it's been 32 pages. Threads only go this long when it's a battle of opinions and very little facts. Constantly asserting that it's "pay to win" isn't working, nor is it even true.

I don't think you have to level to 58 by hand. I never thought that. You are free to use the boost as you want. What I do want is fresh realms. The ones who go to existing realms are free to use boosts as much as they want.
What I want is for people to be honest as well. Gaining power by paying money is p2w and always has been.

[erifwodahs]

They might not be kids, but they sure backpaddle and click

That talks more about the player and not what someone can learn while leveling. Plenty of clickets who did it since 2004 and are still doing that now. Nothing to do with leveling. All it does it might teach you combat flow in WoW, which is the same at level 1 and level 65.
Boost is most beneficial for people like me, who don't want to get through classic experience, I know the game and I am pretty sure, not to come out as prideful, that I would be in top 10 percentile of players with little effort. All I want to do is just smash TBC content while not being clueless on what the game is about.

[chrisnumbers]

I'm not interested in arguing about what pay to win is so I'll just highlight this point:

Gaining power

Could you elaborate on what power is being gained?

[kukkamies]

I'm not interested in arguing about what pay to win is so I'll just highlight this point:

Could you elaborate on what power is being gained?

Try pitting a 1lvl and 58lvl character against each other. It's easy to see which one is more powerful. Maybe after 150 hours of gameplay with both they'd be around equal again?

[kamuimac]

You actually believe this is where blizzard will stop? Are you new? Blizzard will do whatever they can to milk TBCC for all it's worth. Paid boosts. Paid transfers. Paid tokens. The store. It's all coming to TBCC.

real shame they dont add paid boosts to classic too

i would personaly instantly buy 4-5 of those. without them i never will level my alts there as leveling in classic was garbage that i cant stomach as adoult.

[chrisnumbers]

Try pitting a 1lvl and 58lvl character against each other. It's easy to see which one is more powerful. Maybe after 150 hours of gameplay with both they'd be around equal again?

Ok I thought we were about to have an honest discussion. Guess not.

[kukkamies]

Ok I thought we were about to have an honest discussion. Guess not.

?? I don't understand. Do you think it's not power to gain levels?