What problems do you have with Final Fantasy 14?

[Cthulhu 2020]

And it blows my mind people are offended by comments, such as mine, who think the art style is too feminine (even by FF standards) so they choose not to play ff14 seriously. The people in denial about it only need to look up and down this thread to see the aesthetic IS the #1 thing complained about, even if some people do love it.

From the way I see it, it's more that conan the barbarian and other ultra macho characters are just the fantasy. They're fun to look at, but when you look at the world many men are nowhere close to that. The FF characters look well taken care of, clean, groomed. If you can't make a highlander, au ra, or roegadyn look masculine, you aren't really trying.

I just prefer a darker fantasy aesthetic, something like ESO or even older warcraft (Wow retail suffers from a lot of the same problems... fox people ugh)

I find it funny... not necessarily at you, but in general, that people complain about how FF is too colorful or cartoonish or whatever. Thing is, back in 2004, Everquest was the king of MMOs and when WoW came around, everyone was saying that WoW was a cartoon because of how colorful and saturated it was, and how the characters looked like derpy over buff disney characters. The most gritty thing was demons which... are very purple and green. FF in general tends to have far more "realistic" coloring for its environments. Aside from the plaguelands, and a scant number of expansion zones, WoW zones have been extremely saturated with bright colors.

[Aliven]

Yes, the Hunter was doing wrong. If his DPS was normally that low he had no business getting into a highish key and wasting everyone's time (and probably wasting someone else's key). If it wasn't normally so low, he was outright being a dick. This guy was wasting four other people's time, and double that time for the keyholder (because they'd have to re-level the key).
It's reasonable to expect players in mythic plus runs in WoW to perform to at least an average level for their gear, and for them to not step into content they are very clearly not ready for without asking you if you mind carrying them (and asking before the key is inserted in the case of m+ runs).

I think a lot of players who pug run mid-high m+ keys can be quite dickish in their behaviour, but the warrior in this example is not an example of that, though asking what was up sooner and without the expletive would've been nicer. The healer was, though - if the warrior wasn't standing in avoidable stuff and was dying that's entirely on the healer, and telling a melee DPS to 'not stand in melee' was just a BS attempt to hide their own incompetence/laziness.

If that is your stance then enjoy misery i guess? You dont change how other people acts or reacts. Quite literally NOBODY has that power other than said individual. No matter how loud, obnoxious you want. Thats why i said it is POINTLESS to being a dick from even an efficiency standpoint.

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The vast majority of FFXIV characters look feminine. The most "masculine" FF14 characters, like male Au Ra or Highlander men, pale in comparison to your usual western standard of "masculine". One of the common complaints of WoW players looking at FF14 is that there are no manly looking men in FF14 like WoW humans.



The trailer WoL is probably the most masculine looking FF protagonist ever. Sadly you cannot quite replicate his look ingame, as his facial hair is not available.







By American cultural standards, Barret looks pretty normal. The Arnold Schwarzenegger was considered the ideal male physique during the 80s and the 90s, and still somewhat persists today.

Isnt that the standard "beard" of male midlander but just in cinematic?

[Kalisandra]

If that is your stance then enjoy misery i guess?

I just don't pug higher m+ keys. I do that stuff with my guild, and pug low keys on alts. This cuts down on the dickhead encounter rate, but doesn't help with avoiding the incompetent. However, most people don't care much of one person's DPS is low in low keys. It's just not worth wasting time over - better to just get the run done and move on.

The 'misery' is when you do run into a dick that just won't shut up, and this is not someone like the warrior. It's someone who is bad and blames others, or is bad and claims he's good, or is just a prick to everyone else.

I don't get why you think the warrior was somehow wrong. Five deaths, four of them completely not his fault, and all before the first boss (so over the course of about half a dozen trash pulls, none of them particularly hard at that key level) because of not being healed. That's a certain amount of time wasted, a certain amount of gold in repairs, and that wasted time also has an opportunity cost (he could've been running an instance with a healer that didn't suck). I completely understand him being annoyed with the healer, and I'd have dropped after getting the answer he got, too (though I'd not have been so rude - I'd probably have done what the poster was planning and tried the first boss, then dropped if it was a wipe).

The healer wasted everyone's time, and was a dick about it, yet it's other people's fault somehow?

[Aliven]

The point is that there is a clear, undeniable difference in aesthetic tastes between what flies in Japan, and what Westerners (like your average WoW player) are used to, and FFXIV's aesthetics are a barrier of entry to a lot of people.

I would say that the barrier is theyr pre conception of what is right and wrong about aesthetics.

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I just don't pug higher m+ keys. I do that stuff with my guild, and pug low keys on alts. This cuts down on the dickhead encounter rate, but doesn't help with avoiding the incompetent. However, most people don't care much of one person's DPS is low in low keys. It's just not worth wasting time over - better to just get the run done and move on.

The 'misery' is when you do run into a dick that just won't shut up, and this is not someone like the warrior. It's someone who is bad and blames others, or is bad and claims he's good, or is just a prick to everyone else.

I don't get why you think the warrior was somehow wrong. Five deaths, four of them completely not his fault, and all before the first boss (so over the course of about half a dozen trash pulls, none of them particularly hard at that key level) because of not being healed. That's a certain amount of time wasted, a certain amount of gold in repairs, and that wasted time also has an opportunity cost (he could've been running an instance with a healer that didn't suck). I completely understand him being annoyed with the healer, and I'd have dropped after getting the answer he got, too (though I'd not have been so rude - I'd probably have done what the poster was planning and tried the first boss, then dropped if it was a wipe).

The healer wasted everyone's time, and was a dick about it, yet it's other people's fault somehow?

Fault of the warrior is being a dick. Healer was also a dick. Somebody being a dick is not a free pass to you being a dick. There was a tank also, there was also 3rd dps. So 3/5 people were doing shit awesomely i presume, since they were not mentioned as bad apples. Also hunter stayed silent. So i think he was bad - being bad is not a fault. He was not lazy. He do what he could.

I NEVER leave m+ keys. No matter what shit is throw around. The party cant find replacement, and while doing key slower it is waaaaay better than not doing it at all.

Do be perfectly honest... I dont believe warrior never get a heal as was 100% getting unavoidable dmg. No way in hell.

[Val the Moofia Boss]

Isnt that the standard "beard" of male midlander but just in cinematic?

No, for that face you an only get a mustache. No beard. The facial hair for that face has only ever appeared in trailers and is not in the game. Pic below from the 5.2 trailer.

[T-34]

Most people realize that your posts don't show FFXIV punishes competitive people. The only people who get punished are people who are toxic about it and act like the game needs to be played their way. If you're saying that FFXIV is the most toxic playerbase you've ever seen, then you've never actually played the game. You're likely just mad that WoW is bleeding players and FFXIV is still thriving. So of course you'll lie and say negative things about it. Especially since you claim WoW ISN'T super toxic. FFXIV isn't the problem. Based on every comment you've made, the problem is you.

I will bookmark this post of yours and show it to my friends if they should ask me whether they should play FFXIV or not. Then they can make up their own my mind up on how they will be treated in-game in FFXIV.

[ippollite]

Apology accepted, forgiven and consider it water under the bridge. We all have bad days, myself included

I was asked what I dislike about the ff14 and in particular the art style hits my eyes wrong. So did wildstar’s for example

Now, something I adore about ff14? The music and sound design. The music is so perfectly ff, same for the sound, and my mounts having their own theme music? *chefs kiss* perfection. Every game should emulate their quality of sound design

I also had way too much fun racing Chocobo’s and wasting time in the casino. I never did hit the weekly numbers tho but that’s ok

There’s a lot I really do like about ff14, from the sound, to the monster design, to the class animations, housing done properly, etc

/nod. Since you posted the positives, let me balance it out.

1. This inventory is garbage.
2. What even is glamours? No, but really? I know i could learn about in the space of a 2 minute youtube guide. But IN GAME...? Its super clunky, right? I havent watched said 2 minuye guide. Ive thrown a bunch of stuff in my armoire. Ive gone to a glamor table. Nothing is available. This doesnt make sense in game without a guide. Wow transmogs are so far beyond this it isnt funny.
3. I have all these orchestral rolls from arr. They're crafting recipes. Im currently playing HW... they're usable. Whats happening? I agree with HW, i get a scroll, i use it, i can then use it. Whats happening with these ARR scrolls? They just sit in my bags.. or on my retainer? Just let me right click and use them like you do in heavensward. And then when i sit in an inn, because housing isnt a thing in this game (point5), i can use them.
4. I dont hate this to be honest. Because i am the absolute worst white mage you could ever have in your group. And i dont really care, because outside of a 4 man dungeon, im getting carried. But... the msq needs you to grind dung... look, its fine. I can count the full party wipes on one hand right now (267 hours and 3.4). I think its three digits. Im the WORST healer. I only play it because zero queue and also zero memorising massive 48 button rotation (im so sorry dps, you apparently need to do things). My whm gets to run in on pull, hit medica 2, then lol at people who cant dodge MASSIVELY telegraphed mechanics. Its easy mode gameplay. When i get a window, i assize, aero, the stone spam (glare spam), until i need to heal. Its easy mode ff14. Zero pressure. But if you must play dps... play a tank dudes it seems even easier than healer. Oh, you have to turn a boss and dodge a telegraphed mechanic? The skill! I mean, er, look, dps is... its just the hardest difficulty in game. My job is easy. The tanks job looks easy. Sure, in a 4 man dungeon it seems like we're working. But at 8 man... then 24 man... then 48 man? Can you even grasp the carry? You need to learn a 48 button rotation to get us all through this asap. All deeps in my group is a hero because you not only had to face a 15-30 minute queue, but you have to remember so much bs. And i know you have meters because youve decided youre dps.
5. Housing is garbage (its 5 because its got to be a top priority). This is going to be fixed. because it has to be.
6. There's too much shit to do.

[justandulas]

/nod. Since you posted the positives, let me balance it out.

1. This inventory is garbage.
2. What even is glamours? No, but really? I know i could learn about in the space of a 2 minute youtube guide. But IN GAME...? Its super clunky, right? I havent watched said 2 minuye guide. Ive thrown a bunch of stuff in my armoire. Ive gone to a glamor table. Nothing is available. This doesnt make sense in game without a guide. Wow transmogs are so far beyond this it isnt funny.
3. I have all these orchestral rolls from arr. They're crafting recipes. Im currently playing HW... they're usable. Whats happening? I agree with HW, i get a scroll, i use it, i can then use it. Whats happening with these ARR scrolls? They just sit in my bags.. or on my retainer? Just let me right click and use them like you do in heavensward. And then when i sit in an inn, because housing isnt a thing in this game (point5), i can use them.
4. I dont hate this to be honest. Because i am the absolute worst white mage you could ever have in your group. And i dont really care, because outside of a 4 man dungeon, im getting carried. But... the msq needs you to grind dung... look, its fine. I can count the full party wipes on one hand right now (267 hours and 3.4). I think its three digits. Im the WORST healer. I only play it because zero queue and also zero memorising massive 48 button rotation (im so sorry dps, you apparently need to do things). My whm gets to run in on pull, hit medica 2, then lol at people who cant dodge MASSIVELY telegraphed mechanics. Its easy mode gameplay. When i get a window, i assize, aero, the stone spam (glare spam), until i need to heal. Its easy mode ff14. Zero pressure. But if you must play dps... play a tank dudes it seems even easier than healer. Oh, you have to turn a boss and dodge a telegraphed mechanic? The skill! I mean, er, look, dps is... its just the hardest difficulty in game. My job is easy. The tanks job looks easy. Sure, in a 4 man dungeon it seems like we're working. But at 8 man... then 24 man... then 48 man? Can you even grasp the carry? You need to learn a 48 button rotation to get us all through this asap. All deeps in my group is a hero because you not only had to face a 15-30 minute queue, but you have to remember so much bs. And i know you have meters because youve decided youre dps.
5. Housing is garbage (its 5 because its got to be a top priority). This is going to be fixed. because it has to be.
6. There's too much shit to do.

Agree with all your points, and I’d include that the map design isn’t exactly intuitive either. Once you get used to it, fine, but I could see it putting off some new players who aren’t so used to dealing with that

The housing system I actually like, but only if they’d open it up a bit more. It seems unobtainable for the average joe player simply because it is an rng waiting game vs what are essentially bots (people clicking 24/7). Just open housing in every city and add them to every small settlement. Everyone would own a home. Eso does housing better, imo, except that they lean too hard into the store aspect.

I’m also not a big fan of ff14 store, but I can overlook that because literally every game is doing it now so I won’t pick on them about it

There is certainly a lot I like about ff14, just one of the main things I don’t is the soft artwork. Some people adore it tho which is why I’m open that it’s subjective like all art. What works for me, won’t work for some

This works for every medium too, example: I used to love that hbo show Oz back in the late 90s but it was too violent and graphic for most. That’s ok

I love horror movies too, the gorier the better, but that doesn’t work for a lot of people. That’s ok

I also pointed out wildstar as another game who’s art hit me wrong.

Besides, it’s certainly not all negative. The world looks great and the monster design is pretty fantastic.... I would just prefer a different aesthetic for player characters is all

[Aliven]

No, for that face you an only get a mustache. No beard. The facial hair for that face has only ever appeared in trailers and is not in the game. Pic below from the 5.2 trailer.

Would be nice for them to implement this, and looking at theyr track record they would do this if enough people would demand it.

[justandulas]

From the way I see it, it's more that conan the barbarian and other ultra macho characters are just the fantasy. They're fun to look at, but when you look at the world many men are nowhere close to that. The FF characters look well taken care of, clean, groomed. If you can't make a highlander, au ra, or roegadyn look masculine, you aren't really trying.



I find it funny... not necessarily at you, but in general, that people complain about how FF is too colorful or cartoonish or whatever. Thing is, back in 2004, Everquest was the king of MMOs and when WoW came around, everyone was saying that WoW was a cartoon because of how colorful and saturated it was, and how the characters looked like derpy over buff disney characters. The most gritty thing was demons which... are very purple and green. FF in general tends to have far more "realistic" coloring for its environments. Aside from the plaguelands, and a scant number of expansion zones, WoW zones have been extremely saturated with bright colors.

If you’re going to go by real world comparisons, most characters in game would be fat balding middle aged men

The Conan the barbarian character when role playing a dungeons and dragons or fantasy game like experience, is the model to go for. Not to be some teenager who can’t shave, and who doesn’t even look like they can lift a sword. I’d rather a cartoonishly bulky character than one who just came out of a beauty salon

No adventure is metrosexual. Period. Nobody has time to worry about how they look in the middle of questing, dungeons, or fighting monsters. THAT aesthetic is far more unrealistic than the dirty muscleman look. It isn't just bound to that niche either, where are the more... evil characters? If i roll a black mage for example, i'd prefer to be an evil character or at least one who LOOKS evil... and instead, my black mage looks like the only magic he's mastered is how to look fabulous while casting.

If you were alive and playing EQ back then, you’d know that they were kind of at the end of their rope anyway. Their game was built for 1996 dial up internet, not 2004 beginning of broadband. That is a world of difference, and at the time, was monumental for gamers and regular internet users. The game engine was slower, and outdated by vanilla WoW standard. People left cuz WoW was smoother to play, and didn’t require such a time commitment

The artwork on EQ and even EQ2 is far superior to wows original art, but it doesn’t matter if it plays slow, looks dated, and takes too much time. EQ2 looked better than WoW and had other issues tho...

Notice I didn’t insult the environments or monsters of ff14 as the art is great for both.. but the character design is a big fat nope for me. I want to roll as a cliche over the top manly man, not some dainty little teenager, or furry, or man who looks like he cares more about sharpening his nails than his sword.

Taste is subjective. Some people love that art and that’s perfectly fine. I only listed it as the reason I personally don’t stick with ff14, and I’m not alone. This thread is filled with complaints about the character artwork being this that or the other

I’m not knocking you for liking that look, try and respect that I don’t like it. Just my 2 cents

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Would be nice for them to implement this, and looking at theyr track record they would do this if enough people would demand it.

Tbh that is one of the more traditional character aesthetics and even that is little soft.

Between the “can’t grow facial hair” stubble to the bowl cut 90s boyband haircut.. ugh.

He may be a fantastic character. And his armor looks good, but that facial design is legit high school senior look... NOT world class hero

[PizzaSHARK]

Notice I didn’t insult the environments or monsters of ff14 as the art is great for both.. but the character design is a big fat nope for me. I want to roll as a cliche over the top manly man, not some dainty little teenager, or furry, or man who looks like he cares more about sharpening his nails than his sword.

Play roegadyn or highlander, then. They're both Conan types, one being more or less within human possibility (though very tall) and the other being closer to the Hulk than Conan.

[justandulas]

Play roegadyn or highlander, then. They're both Conan types, one being more or less within human possibility (though very tall) and the other being closer to the Hulk than Conan.

No they aren’t. Neither is my au’ra

No amount of character creation can fix the limitations of the character designs. No matter what you pick, it’s soft dainty and looks more like they are preparing for a big prom date and not a monster hunt. A bulky chest or height is not the only requirement for a manly, gritty look. I’d prefer to make solid snake, not garter snake

You honestly can’t tell half the male and females players apart in game when it should be noticeable from 100m out.

I want a darker, more mature aesthetic. Not toons who look like we skipped high school prom to raid

[TidalConflux]

To be honest, I wouldnt listen to NA players on gatekeeping what content should be in the game -- they dont have high participation in many forms of content as is (high-end raid content or casual content like Ishgardian restoration). Id trust the JP players first rather than the fair-weather NA players.

[Kalisandra]

No amount of character creation can fix the limitations of the character designs. No matter what you pick, it’s soft dainty and looks more like they are preparing for a big prom date and not a monster hunt. A bulky chest or height is not the only requirement for a manly, gritty look. I’d prefer to make solid snake, not garter snake

This reads as "Real men don't bathe", and also "Women don't go out and do things that get dirt on them".

[Wrecktangle]

What are the asterisks for?

I didn't specify when being an adult means composing yourself because it's all about composing yourself at all times. Whether it's after a failure, teaching someone, etc.

I know you didn't. I did. I'm saying it because even children can play nice when things are easy. Part of being an adult is being responsible for your decisions when you come across adversity. Adversity that quickly shows who has grown up and who hasn't, aka separating the adults from the children.

We're in agreement .

I still find that kinda hard to believe, considering that I've seen people in pugs start in on each other even before the first pull is made. With some regularity, in fact.

No one ever harasses me because:

1) I take responsibility for my own mistakes and failures REGARDLESS of the content/situation. This measure alone probably prevents 85% of it. I don't blame anyone for my mistakes.

Great anecdote - Expert Roulette: Shadowbringers - I quick glanced at everyone's gear (based on HP values, easy way to tell people's gear levels if you're actively playing) We wiped on the first wall to wall pull. We had MORE than enough gear, no one was new, so what the heck happened?

One DPS is sub 3k dps, and the healer cast exactly 3 spells (only 1 of which was a heal oGCDs) in a 26s pull before I died. I rotated through an immunity and another cooldown and a half before dying.

CLEARLY one DPS and a healer AFKing was the issue, but instead I simply said oh shit I'm sorry I thought we could have handled that I'll slow down.

The healer piped up and so no it's not your fault it's mine, my dog attacked me and spilled coffee all over the keyboard right as we pulled, the other DPS had ran over to help them IRL (i guess they lived together) hence why there weren't doing anything.

Now I can't say for sure what would have happened had I called them out, but the fact is even though they made mistakes, I did too, and I chose to focus on that instead.

2) I'm generally a nice person despite what you lot think here so if I notice things getting tense I'll sometimes throw the blame on myself even if it's not my fault. It seems to help most of the time.

3) My definition of toxicity is a lot more strict than a lot of the posters here. For instance, disagreeing with someone or cursing in frustration do not qualify nor does a respectful display of frustration at someone.

People not performing to your standard are not intentionally wasting other people's time, they're doing their best, usually. As I said earlier, if they're intentionaly doing it, that's harassment and you can kick them for it, just like in WoW.

I didn't wanna get between you and the other poster, but I wanted to chime in here. I do agree that most people aren't malicious on purpose, and I do genuinely believe that a lot of people try their best.

HOWEVER, I have literal empirical data that shows that a lot of people's best is worse than simply spamming a single key over and over again and that's my only hangup with this argument and that tells me that there is a subset that's surprisingly large (roughly 1 in 5 players I run into in matchmade content) that is offensively lazy.

The fun thing about anecdotes is the vast subjectivity in them. I'm not saying Wrecktangle is wrong by any means but some people see that telling someone "git gud scrub" isn't belitting but helping. So to them, if that happened in every game they played, they would see no belittling going on

No, that is belittling and combative IMO. Saying "Please join a few more practice parties for lights rampant so that you understand all possible iterations of the mechanic intimately before joining a clear party" is not.

Here's a hypothetical:

I pugged a mists 14 yesterday for the weekly as a tank. The group broke up right before the first boss, which has never happened to me. The reasons:
-The warrior (top DPS) died 5x, including to the pride. Almost all of the damage he took at that point was unavoidable aside from a single melee hit from a spiteful mob.
-The 220 hunter was doing 2.6k dps
-The healer was doing 1.6 HPS on a grievous week, significantly less than I was doing as the blood tank.

Before the boss, the warrior asked "can I get a fucking heal?" after his 5th death. The healer told him to stop standing in melee. The warrior then said he's not going to carry a trash healer and a trash hunter and left.

--

To me, he was completely justified in leaving the group at that point. This group clearly wasn't going to beat the key - or if they did, it would take forever. I was personally going to pull the boss and leave if we wiped on it.

Is this toxic behavior? What if the game didn't allow you to comment on damage and healing meters?

No it isn't. It's a valid display of frustration. Sure the cursing is a bit unnecessary, but it's not toxic. The healer was clearly not pulling their weight. The healer was in actuality far more abrasive than the warrior by saying not to stand in melee. That would be the equivalent of telling a healer not to heal and be downright combative and unhelpful, and it reads that the healer thinks that they did nothing wrong and shifted the blame.

The hunter was bad, but being bad by itself isn't the end of the world, although I would definitely expect better our of i220. I would sustain ~ 5.5k dps in a M+ before I quit. I was ilvl 207...

I don't see anything toxic here personally on any side, but the healer is the closest IMO.

Once again, I don't believe you AT ALL. You also never asked anything what class and such I play. though it's literally irrelevant because I know why you're asking. No matter what answer I give you, you'll respond with some kind of passive aggressive nonsense and I'm not falling for it. And you're ABSOLUTELY lying if you're saying that you've never seen people belittle other people in WoW.

Why are you being so aggressive? I don't want to know to disprove you or hurt you. I'm not some big scary boogeyman raider out to harass you. I genuinely believe you have had a different (and better!) experience than me, and I think I know why, but I can't confirm it until you clarify.

What's worse? Someone who defends what they feel isn't toxic or someone who just plain makes things up?

Good. I'll just leave that there.

I'll have you know I'm literally fucking dying in my chair laughing. A+++ content.

Yep, exactly this. These people that come in here whining about "players that don't respect other players' time" don't sound like they're actually having fun with the game. Not if it's just a task that must be completed as efficiently as possible.

To be fair, you're assuming your way of fun is the ONLY way to have fun. I personally don't have fun having a 12 minute dungeon take 38 minutes because Timmy thinks that he's an ice mage and Michele thinks that Shield Lob is a PLD's highest DPS move.

This sounds like a problem with your guild? Why not find a likeminded group of players who don't care about performance and just want to shoot the shit?

The best way to have fun in any game like this is to be with likeminded people who have a shared goal, whatever that goal is. I would say that almost all guild conflicts come from a violation of that principle - either so and so is "too serious" or so and so is "not serious enough."

100% the solution to every problem. Likeminded players. Friction is what happens when you have player styles clash too frequently and friction is the cause of toxicity IMO.

The 'misery' is when you do run into a dick that just won't shut up, and this is not someone like the warrior. It's someone who is bad and blames others, or is bad and claims he's good, or is just a prick to everyone else.

The healer wasted everyone's time, and was a dick about it, yet it's other people's fault somehow?

This is my experience as well. Everyone will agree that outward toxicity sucks and blah blah blah, but it's situations like these where you can see people really divide. Being bad and blaming others, or being bad and claiming your good are things I see in FF14 a lot and it's why I wish people could see their DPS.

Anecdote time - Titania EX on Shadowbringers launch - A NIN says yeah, we're not gonna clear this because we have double PLD and it's stalling our LB and we need it for damage (was a learning party that hit enrage).

No mr. NIN, we need you to not do less damage than one of the healers and both tanks despite not dying, but the rest of the party doesn't know that and think it's the double PLD. THANKFULLY the party leader also had ACT up and listened to me when we dropped out and I said trust me replace the NIN and mark it a clear party and he said yeah don't worry I hear you loud and clear. We killed it in 2 pulls with a new player.

The issue here isn't that we're bad or harassment or anything like that. We simply booted him with no words. The problem is HE thinks he's right and we're super toxic, but we have no recourse to show him or tell him he's wrong. He is going to go on and join OTHER players parties continuing to spread misinformation and possibly hold players back and they might not have the same information we do.

That's what sucks about this situation.

I would say that the barrier is theyr pre conception of what is right and wrong about aesthetics.

Eh - aesthetics isn't about right or wrong. It's a PERFECTLY valid excuse to not like a games art style. As much of a fan of WoW I am, I VASTLY prefer my FF14 characters appearance and job aesthetic.

[PizzaSHARK]

No they aren’t. Neither is my au’ra

No amount of character creation can fix the limitations of the character designs. No matter what you pick, it’s soft dainty and looks more like they are preparing for a big prom date and not a monster hunt. A bulky chest or height is not the only requirement for a manly, gritty look. I’d prefer to make solid snake, not garter snake

You honestly can’t tell half the male and females players apart in game when it should be noticeable from 100m out.

I want a darker, more mature aesthetic. Not toons who look like we skipped high school prom to raid

Are you insane or just stupid?

[Kyriani]

No they aren’t. Neither is my au’ra

No amount of character creation can fix the limitations of the character designs. No matter what you pick, it’s soft dainty and looks more like they are preparing for a big prom date and not a monster hunt. A bulky chest or height is not the only requirement for a manly, gritty look. I’d prefer to make solid snake, not garter snake

You honestly can’t tell half the male and females players apart in game when it should be noticeable from 100m out.

I want a darker, more mature aesthetic. Not toons who look like we skipped high school prom to raid

This doesn't look "soft" or "dainty" to me:

[justandulas]

This doesn't look "soft" or "dainty" to me:

Is this trolling, or a joke?

[Jazzhands]

This doesn't look "soft" or "dainty" to me:

Nah dude he doesn't look like he's on roids so he's just a lithe little boy going to prom, c'mon. Can't be "manly and rugged" or whatever unless your arms are thicker than your head or something I guess.

[Saltysquidoon]

(The default) Spell effects are eye-melting. This stuff is fine in a turn-based game or hell even playing on your own but once you get a couple of BLM's wailing on a boss my eyes start getting seared out of my skull.
Melee hits don't feel impactful. It's probably a combination of the overblown animations and rigging but melee combat has a very 'air fight' feel to it.
Dots also feel almost perfunctory, with a set tick rate and being so easily lost in the spell animation wash you could remove them basically entierly and no one would even notice a change in their gameplay or care.

This doesn't look "soft" or "dainty" to me:

You aren't going to convince the type (you know what type) of person who needs a male character to look 'manly and gritty' not 'soft and dainty' of much by posting a character dressed like Freddie Mercury (Not that the onus is on you to prove anything).