1. #2161
    Void Lord Elegiac's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by WowIsDead64 View Post
    Do you have any proves, that anything was done violently and not voluntary?
    I dunno habibi maybe all the gunshots being fired might indicate something violent is going on.
    Quote Originally Posted by Marjane Satrapi
    The world is not divided between East and West. You are American, I am Iranian, we don't know each other, but we talk and understand each other perfectly. The difference between you and your government is much bigger than the difference between you and me. And the difference between me and my government is much bigger than the difference between me and you. And our governments are very much the same.

  2. #2162
    Quote Originally Posted by Elegiac View Post
    "Vetting" is not "handpicking", especially considering the context of Yuschenko being thrown out precisely because he was a Russian stooge.



    1) Syria was happening during Obama's second term and Russia was busy pouring money into that particular pit.
    2) Putain had a personal cocksleeve in office during the period between the Obama and Biden administrations that was undermining NATO well enough on his own.
    And then it flipped to an American cocksleeve. This is why this is happening. That’s the context. None of this is disputed anywhere including MSM sources. It’s very clear why Putin would be doing this if you’ve been paying attention.

  3. #2163
    Void Lord Elegiac's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by D3thray View Post
    And then it flipped to an American cocksleeve.
    ...You do realise I'm talking about Trump, right? Fucking lol.

    It’s very clear why Putin would be doing this if you’ve been paying attention.
    I have; and it has fuck all to do with "Russian security" and everything to do with needing to deflect attention from domestic conditions in typical autocrat fashion. Hence his little tirade wherein he spends most of it talking about shit that has fuck all to do with Ukraine.
    Quote Originally Posted by Marjane Satrapi
    The world is not divided between East and West. You are American, I am Iranian, we don't know each other, but we talk and understand each other perfectly. The difference between you and your government is much bigger than the difference between you and me. And the difference between me and my government is much bigger than the difference between me and you. And our governments are very much the same.

  4. #2164
    Quote Originally Posted by Elegiac View Post
    I dunno habibi maybe all the gunshots being fired might indicate something violent is going on.
    I don't know, why this is so hard to understand, but situation is pretty simple. There was democratic voting back in 2014 and Yanukovych was elected as legitimate president by majority of Ukraine's population. He was then overthrown via coup by western Ukraine military nationalists, sponsored by USA, as it was done with Georgian ones before that. What is bad in eastern parts of Ukraine not accepting results of this anti-democratic coup?

    I don't care about Wow 11.0, if it's not solo-MMO. No half-measures - just perfect xpack.

  5. #2165
    Void Lord Elegiac's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by WowIsDead64 View Post
    There was democratic voting back in 2014 and Yanukovych was elected as legitimate president by majority of Ukraine's population.
    Who then changed their minds as a result of him being incompetent, corrupt, and a Kremlin stooge.

    Or is this gonna be some Brexiteer-esque bullshit about how people aren't allowed to change their minds?

    He was then overthrown via coup by western Ukraine military nationalists
    Bzzzzt. This is a lie. Euromaidan was not a coup, it was a popular uprising which resulted in Yanukovych fleeing the country by helicopter after stealing a bunch of money.

    What is bad in eastern parts of Ukraine not accepting results of this anti-democratic coup?
    Because it's a belief based on a lie being spread by paid Kremlin shills and there's no evidence to suggest a majority of people in Eastern Ukraine even care who's in charge let alone "live in fear of being made victims of genocide by Ukraine" as you suggested previously.
    Last edited by Elegiac; 2022-02-22 at 07:36 AM.
    Quote Originally Posted by Marjane Satrapi
    The world is not divided between East and West. You are American, I am Iranian, we don't know each other, but we talk and understand each other perfectly. The difference between you and your government is much bigger than the difference between you and me. And the difference between me and my government is much bigger than the difference between me and you. And our governments are very much the same.

  6. #2166
    Quote Originally Posted by Elegiac View Post
    Who then changed their minds as a result of him being incompetent, corrupt, and a Kremlin stooge.

    Or is this gonna be some Brexiteer-esque bullshit about how people aren't allowed to change their minds?



    Bzzzzt. This is a lie. Euromaidan was not a coup, it was a popular uprising which resulted in Yanukovych fleeing the country by helicopter after stealing a bunch of money.



    Because it's a belief based on a lie being spread by paid Kremlin shills and there's no evidence to suggest a majority of people in Eastern Ukraine even care who's in charge let alone "live in fear of being made victims of genocide by Ukraine" as you suggested previously.
    This is called "double standards". Why can't eastern part of Ukraine be pro-Yanukovych and pro-Russia? So you just can't admit simple fact, that eastern Ukraine people can have another opinion, than western ones? And that if such opinions aren't compatible and never will, then separation is only viable variant? It's their legitimate will. Same as for Albanian people back when they separated from Serbia with assistance of USA's bombing. So, USA supports separation when THEY need it and denies, when they don't? Isn't it double standards?

    I don't care about Wow 11.0, if it's not solo-MMO. No half-measures - just perfect xpack.

  7. #2167
    Quote Originally Posted by Elegiac View Post
    Bzzzzt. This is a lie. Euromaidan was not a coup, it was a popular uprising which resulted in Yanukovych fleeing the country by helicopter after stealing a bunch of money.



    Because it's a belief based on a lie being spread by paid Kremlin shills and there's no evidence to suggest a majority of people in Eastern Ukraine even care who's in charge let alone "live in fear of being made victims of genocide by Ukraine" as you suggested previously.
    I mean Euromaidan protesters called it a coup. And leaders from Crimea and Luhansk signaled their intention to secede if the government was overthrown before Yanukovych was even ousted.

    Sourced by the way from the well known Kremlin shill wikipedia.

    Ever consider that if Russia propagates propaganda that the US does as well? Just a thought.

    Edit: by the way I didn’t know the ‘peaceful protesters’ had burned a journalist alive in a building. And killed 10 police officers. Before that whole thing with the snipers (still unidentified) and police firing on ‘peaceful protesters’. This thing was a bloody coup/revolution depending on your point of view, no two ways about it.
    Last edited by D3thray; 2022-02-22 at 08:25 AM.

  8. #2168
    Void Lord Elegiac's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by WowIsDead64 View Post
    Why can't eastern part of Ukraine be pro-Yanukovych and pro-Russia?
    Because there's no evidence to suggest it is, while the evidence we do have suggests most people there are indifferent.
    Quote Originally Posted by Marjane Satrapi
    The world is not divided between East and West. You are American, I am Iranian, we don't know each other, but we talk and understand each other perfectly. The difference between you and your government is much bigger than the difference between you and me. And the difference between me and my government is much bigger than the difference between me and you. And our governments are very much the same.

  9. #2169
    Quote Originally Posted by Elegiac View Post
    Because there's no evidence to suggest it is, while the evidence we do have suggests most people there are indifferent.
    What evidence? This evidence? How about your evidence?


    And another thing. USA don't have right to decide on behalf of other countries on the other side of globe, what they can and what they can't. If eastern Ukraine doesn't want to accept nationalist government, set via military coup, then it's their democratic right to do it.
    Last edited by WowIsDead64; 2022-02-22 at 08:30 AM.

    I don't care about Wow 11.0, if it's not solo-MMO. No half-measures - just perfect xpack.

  10. #2170
    Yeah at this point I’m gonna say this is most definitely another proxy war between US and Russia and as a result you’ve both got semi-unreliable information due to propaganda from both sides. So let’s say you’re half right. Better than completely wrong yeah?

  11. #2171
    Void Lord Elegiac's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by D3thray View Post
    I mean Euromaidan protesters called it a coup.
    They didn't; some protesters threatened a coup if Yanukovych did not resign, which he did.

    Edit: by the way I didn’t know the ‘peaceful protesters’ had burned a journalist alive in a building.
    They didn't; the Odessa Trade Union Building was occupied by anti-Maidanists who were *checks notes* firing weapons and throwing firebombs onto protestors below and then accidentally lit the building on fire, resulting in Dymtro Ivanov's death in the blaze.

    And killed 10 police officers.
    While resisting much worse violence from law enforcement. You don't seem to understand just how much of a disparity in force there actually was.

    Ever consider that if Russia propagates propaganda that the US does as well? Just a thought.
    Lemme know when nearly every mainstream media source in the US is either state run or owned by personal friends of the Tsar.

    They're not? Why, it's almost as if your analogy is horseshit. Which is hardly surprising because you are still repeating Kremlin talking points.

    Quote Originally Posted by WowIsDead64 View Post
    What evidence? This evidence?
    More bullshit from Kremlin owned news sources isn't evidence, especially when it's just a video of a bunch of people milling around.

    And another thing. USA don't have right to decide on behalf of other countries on the other side of globe, what they can and what they can't.
    They didn't, the Ukrainian public did.

    If eastern Ukraine doesn't want to accept nationalist government
    Something for which there's no evidence for.

    set via military coup
    Euromaidan was not a military coup, for the hundredth time.
    Last edited by Elegiac; 2022-02-22 at 08:43 AM.
    Quote Originally Posted by Marjane Satrapi
    The world is not divided between East and West. You are American, I am Iranian, we don't know each other, but we talk and understand each other perfectly. The difference between you and your government is much bigger than the difference between you and me. And the difference between me and my government is much bigger than the difference between me and you. And our governments are very much the same.

  12. #2172
    Quote Originally Posted by Elegiac View Post
    More bullshit from Kremlin owned news sources isn't evidence, especially when it's just a video of a bunch of people milling around.



    They didn't, the Ukrainian public did.



    Something for which there's no evidence for.



    Euromaidan was not a military coup, for the hundredth time.
    All facts can be verified. Because there are documents, like passports. Go and check it yourself instead of throwing "highly likely" non-provable nonsense.

    Yeah. And coup wasn't military and wasn't nationalistic. All fact are there. You just need google to find them.



    I don't care about Wow 11.0, if it's not solo-MMO. No half-measures - just perfect xpack.

  13. #2173
    Void Lord Elegiac's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by WowIsDead64 View Post
    All facts can be verified.
    You haven't presented any facts though, habibi. All you've done is spam posted a bunch of videos run by various Kremlin-owned sources.

    Yeah. And coup wasn't military
    You're correct: it wasn't. Something which is very easily verifiable once you sanitize your Google search from whatever bullshit Sputnik or RT are spamming the algorithm with.
    Quote Originally Posted by Marjane Satrapi
    The world is not divided between East and West. You are American, I am Iranian, we don't know each other, but we talk and understand each other perfectly. The difference between you and your government is much bigger than the difference between you and me. And the difference between me and my government is much bigger than the difference between me and you. And our governments are very much the same.

  14. #2174
    Quote Originally Posted by Elegiac View Post
    They didn't; some protesters threatened a coup if Yanukovych did not resign, which he did.
    You fail basic history. Yanukovich never resigned.

    He was "deposed" by remaining members of Rada (while his party was absent) which lacked constitutional majority required by law to do that.

    Rada then proceeded to remove Constitutional Court judges that needed to confirm it by law (as it was obvious they would not agree), therefore completing the coup.

    They didn't; the Odessa Trade Union Building was occupied by anti-Maidanists who were *checks notes* firing weapons and throwing firebombs onto protestors below and then accidentally lit the building on fire, resulting in Dymtro Ivanov's death in the blaze.
    There were firebombs thrown into building from below (there is plenty of video evidence about it), and "maidanists" surrounding it stopped firefighters from getting to the fire.

    While resisting much worse violence from law enforcement. You don't seem to understand just how much of a disparity in force there actually was.
    You know that maidan supporters by that point already took over police arsenals in Western Ukraine?

    Lemme know when nearly every mainstream media source in the US is either state run or owned by personal friends of the Tsar.
    Have you checked how many people actually control "mainstream media sources" in US lately?
    Last edited by Shalcker; 2022-02-22 at 08:55 AM.

  15. #2175
    here comes the gas lighting zzzzzzz

  16. #2176
    Void Lord Elegiac's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Shalcker View Post
    You fail basic history. Yanukovich never resigned.
    I'll correct myself.

    He never formally resigned, he just outright fled the country after stealing a bunch of money like a little bitch. Moreover, him and his ministers choosing to abdicate their duties in an unconstitutional manner renders any question of the Rada's process moot. They worked with what they had.

    As opposed to Putain who is working with shit he chose to instigate.

    There were firebombs thrown into building from below
    Which were dropped from the roof and then thrown back, I'm aware. The reports concluded that the fire that resulted in Ivanov's death began on the roof.

    and "maidanists" surrounding it stopped firefighters from getting to the fire.
    Gee that sucks maybe the folks on the roof shouldn't have started the fight resulting in the fire, then.

    You know that maidan supporters by that point already took over police arsenals in Western Ukraine?
    Yep; as a result of escalation by law enforcement.

    I'm not going to criticise people for resisting police brutality, even if violently.

    Have you checked how many people actually control "mainstream media sources" in US lately?
    Again, let me know when mainstream media sources in the US are exclusively either state run or owned by personal friends of the President after being acquired after publishing material critical of said President.

    They still aren't? Well I guess it's still a bullshit analogy, then.
    Last edited by Elegiac; 2022-02-22 at 09:24 AM.
    Quote Originally Posted by Marjane Satrapi
    The world is not divided between East and West. You are American, I am Iranian, we don't know each other, but we talk and understand each other perfectly. The difference between you and your government is much bigger than the difference between you and me. And the difference between me and my government is much bigger than the difference between me and you. And our governments are very much the same.

  17. #2177
    Quote Originally Posted by Elegiac View Post
    I'll correct myself.

    He never formally resigned, he just outright fled the country after stealing a bunch of money.



    Which were dropped from the roof and then thrown back, I'm aware.



    Gee that sucks maybe the folks on the roof shouldn't have started the fight resulting in the fire, then.



    Yep; as a result of escalation by law enforcement.

    I'm not going to criticise people for resisting police brutality, even if violently.



    Again, let me know when mainstream media sources in the US are exclusively either state run or owned by personal friends of the President after being acquired after publishing material critical of said President.

    They still aren't? Well I guess it's still a bullshit analogy, then.
    World should really understand, that it's in great danger, while guys, who make facts up like this have access to nuclear red button. Because no laws and agreements can stop them from providing their "democracy" to you, so YOUR home can be their next target. We all have seen James Bond and Mission Impossible films. We all know, how good western special services are at making facts up and managing provocations.

    I don't care about Wow 11.0, if it's not solo-MMO. No half-measures - just perfect xpack.

  18. #2178
    Void Lord Elegiac's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by WowIsDead64 View Post
    We all have seen James Bond and Mission Impossible films.
    You do realise those are fictional narratives and not documentaries, yeah?

    What are you, a fucking Thermian? Lol.

    They are an extremely naïve, gullible and kind species, Thermians have no concept of fiction, or deceit, and as such they have mistaken broadcasts of human television programmes as "historical documents", in particularly Galaxy Quest and Gilligan's Island.
    Last edited by Elegiac; 2022-02-22 at 09:11 AM.
    Quote Originally Posted by Marjane Satrapi
    The world is not divided between East and West. You are American, I am Iranian, we don't know each other, but we talk and understand each other perfectly. The difference between you and your government is much bigger than the difference between you and me. And the difference between me and my government is much bigger than the difference between me and you. And our governments are very much the same.

  19. #2179
    Hey if they believe propaganda so inept that school kids could do a better job I'm not surprised they believe that.

  20. #2180
    Quote Originally Posted by WowIsDead64 View Post
    World should really understand, that it's in great danger, while guys, who make facts up like this have access to nuclear red button. Because no laws and agreements can stop them from providing their "democracy" to you, so YOUR home can be their next target. We all have seen James Bond and Mission Impossible films. We all know, how good western special services are at making facts up and managing provocations.
    Hollywood is not the real world mate.

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