Redefining the word used doesn't change the point.... why make a system that exists to fuck people up on. When the mass majority of your playerbase essentially ignore it.
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The people who want impactful talents are roughly... 9-20% based on shadowlands metrics. When given the choice of covenants near every player min maxed.
I'm not "redefining" it, I'm stating facts.
As to why make a system that does that? Blizzard doesn't have to "make" them, those systems exist for years; they only freshen them up. So the question should be rather: why not get rid of those systems? Well, for what? Those people you talk about play the game anyway; and the playerbase that loves theorycrafting and min-maxing would be super upset.
Why remove the pitfalls for new players though? Does every game have to be super approachable? Well then, lets turn WoW into Candy Crush, that'd definitely remove a lot of pitfalls.
No, there's no need to. A game can have pitfalls for new players; have some faith in people - most of them can use google and should be able to find wowhead or icyveins, or one of the dozen other WoW-realted sites. There's not a single game in this world with as many resources as WoW.
If most of the game is far easier than Candy Crush, than I'm baffled why it matters if people min-max or not. Just do whatever build you want since it's so easy. Where's the pitfall if the game is so easy that you can beat it with any possible build, clicking randomly on the talent tree?
Giving us talents that were just baseline abilities before Dragonflight is the biggest false sense of choice I've ever seen. Who the hell greenlit this?
"May the way of the Hero lead to the Triforce"
"May the Goddess smile upon you."
"Hero", is what they've all been saying. This world, it isn't worth the saving."
I like it. For leveling you can do whatever and in the end you have your few presets you just switch between like it has ALWAYS been and always will be.
This is one of the thing we had threads for every month since they removed the old talent trees.
Now we have the old talent tree with actually different paths for differnent situation.
Sure there is fluff in between but i like it and there are still impactfull like always. Just not EVERY.
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What did you epxect? Them making two huge tress for every class and just throw six+ completly new abilities on top? Talk about talent bloat and clutter
You still have the abilities.
Strongly disagree that every talent should be a choice node. In a good designed tree you already have the choice of left/right/center and usually have different playstyles that are supported this way.
Also not every talent has to be super impactful. Sometimes 10% more lavaburst damage is enough to differenciate it more between elemental and resto for example.
But i agree that good designed trees are the minority currently. If the tree is designed in a good way (elemental) simple talents can turn into impactful ones for your build. If it isn't (prot pala) such talents feel meaningless and like a waste of points
Last edited by Foolicious; 2022-09-20 at 03:16 PM.
"May the way of the Hero lead to the Triforce"
"May the Goddess smile upon you."
"Hero", is what they've all been saying. This world, it isn't worth the saving."
As i fill my mythic plus group i will just armory prospective applicants on my other monitor and make sure they picked the correct talents as listed by subcreation then they get an invite. Not everyone will do that either but a meta will be formed and more will follow it. Now if we could get an add-on that grades the perspective applicant on a scale of how much of the meta they are would be absolutely amazing to save some time looking them up but we can only dream.
Ok so this is a matter of balance. We used to have extremely impactful and special abilities, that in certain specific situations were extremely strong. This resulted in class stacking for certain raids, certain tiers, even certain bosses. Over the years, in the pursuit of balance, all the "rough edges" have been removed.
Personally, i hate that. I really miss doing fucking idiotic numbers on AOE fights on my war in MOP, for example. Focusing on balance has removed a lot of the fun for me personally. Fully appreciate some will disagree, but thats my opinion.
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What class / spec do you play?
And I rather not, and moved 90% spells back in general class spellbook by sections, so player self could decide what one need to use and what doesn't, so there will be one general "tree" of modifications and that's just them, by which player will "design" own specialization, without devs imposing spell kit/rotation ~ playing style and own stylistics. Hmm...
ps. Just to specify my general point of view on existing system (and their tree didn't change anything in since&after-cata approach, it just redistributed spellbook and conditionally "pretend", that devs are moving away from borrowed powers, just change of visualization, everything is as usual):
smoke and mirrors...
- 2020-08-07 -it remains the such one
ps2. Friend joked that maybe they stole idea of "branched" simplified spellbook from BDO (however, it follows from description that this tree is a little wider than "rank"-growth by spell points in BDO, but I think joke is pretty appropriate).
Last edited by Alkizon; 2022-09-21 at 07:56 AM.
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Not the good ones. There are countless "new" SP games that release AMAZING SP dlc, and continue supporting for years. Witcher 3 is probably the poster child for amazing DLC, but even the much hated CP2077 is continuing to release content, and the mighty No Mans Sky is a prime example of how much a game can be turned around with quality DLC. Yes, it is now pretty mucha coop / MP game if you want it to be, but many people play it purely SP.
Releasing a sequel is probably the most profitable rout to take though, which i guess is why so many stick to that formula. Remember, it wasnt THAT long ago that once a game was released, that was IT. No patches, no updates, no DLC - sequel or die. It gave us a lot of great sequels, and some of the worst cash grab sub-dlc "sequels" of all time as well.
Players wanted talent trees back, that means lots of talents that are only filler talents. Usually less talents = more quality talents, more talents = less quality talents.
This is not me saying not having talent trees is better, just a realistic view on how the talents themselves will be affected by any chosen system of them.
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Impactful really just means that it improves your throughput/effective health beyond a certain margin or offers a substantial utility benefit. Not every talent can offer a proc or an interaction. I mean it can, just look at azerite traits. But why do you hate the engine so much you want to litter it with procs that just pad your damage instead of just giving you some straight stats is beyond me. We cannot go from 7 transformative talents to 61. And the tree may not have 61 but it definitely has way more than 20
The moment they announced its gonna be build-a-spellbook, was when it was clear it will be boring. They couldve made the classes work baseline with their base abilities and then have talents actually augment your performance based on content (pvp, raid boss, cleave, mass pulls, utility stuff, x mechanic, etc.). Instead, you get more or less Shadowlands playstyle.