If SW:TOR is successful...

[jusitoo]

I have quited wow during cataclysm and the x-pac won't bring me back

Not exactly relevant to the topic tho. =(

[Yoggtimus Prime]

I'm just really not interested in SWTOR anymore. I realized that maybe TOR was still not the right game for me. People like to bitch about how I'm always defending other games, but I do it because people state stupid comments/low blows to games such as WoW. I actually started playing WoW again, and I'm now finishing up all my quests and whatnot from cataclysm. Does TOR have potential to push? Absolutely, as long as it aims for people that aren't like me. You have to also realize that even one day, you'll say that SWTOR is boring. Every game has that happen, but the reason why games don't die is because people invest so much time into the game that they CAN'T leave. You can't really say that SWTOR or GW2 will kill WoW. Look at games like EQ, SW:G, Champions Online, DCUO, and many others (even Runescape). These aren't dead because they still have people playing them (well SW:G has closed, but it still had a fanbase). What makes people think that if these games are still running, that a new game can kill out a game that they despise?

---------- Post added 2011-10-28 at 12:48 PM ----------

I have to comment on this too. The new expansion is a sign that competition is coming and they need to copy as much from these other games as possible in order to retain subscribers.

A new x-pac won't change the fact that 50% of the current servers could all be combined due to low population issues, and that the game will STILL revolve around factions queuing up from whatever major hub they are designated to.

They won't combine servers though, because they don't have to. They have turned each player's community into their guild and the random people from other servers who show up when queueing for everything.

I will always keep my WoW account, have great memories in the game and may revisit it in the future with my wife (who loves Pandas). But saying that the game is evolving for the better might be a matter of what a person thinks is better.

Their game still has 7+ million subscribers.

[Trollsbane]

I hear ya, but we're not talking about killing WoW. Let's be honest, it's the WoW fans that really tote that phrase. "That game won't kill WoW" is far more common then "This game will kill WoW."

[Deleted]

Let's be honest, it's the WoW fans that really tote that phrase. "That game won't kill WoW" is far more common then "This game will kill WoW."

Hmm.. to make a sig out of or not.. Tempting. Maybe not, brings too much controversy.

[Wildmoon]

I think what will decide this battle between SWTOR and WoW is end game. No matter how people complain about WoW, WoW's end game is very solid and I think it's the reason why WoW is still on top today. Bioware have to surpass Blizzard in this area if they wanna SWTOR to lead this market.

[Trollsbane]

Possibly. BUT, so many people use the statistics that most MMO players actually don't raid. And if they don't raid, that really only leaves dailies as end game. So if most people like questing the best, and spend most of their time doing that, then TOR should do extremely well.

[Yoggtimus Prime]

I hear ya, but we're not talking about killing WoW. Let's be honest, it's the WoW fans that really tote that phrase. "That game won't kill WoW" is far more common then "This game will kill WoW."

I disagree. I think that trolls and people who really want to see WoW fail tote the comment more than people standing in defense, hence why we have to continue to tell people that WoW won't die. Problem is, not the defense nor the attackers can prove any example previously like I did, it's just immature "You're an idiot, shut up" posts back and forth.

[Cakka]

It's kinda weird how so many people see the MMO market as a zero sum game, ie. for TOR to gain subscribers others have to lose them. I personally think, as many people in the MMO industry have said as well, that TOR has the potential to grow the MMO market as whole, in the same way WoW did when it was released. You have to remember that at the time of WoWs release Everquest was the biggest MMO out there with just about half a million subscribers. At that time the whole MMO genre put together didn't have even 1/5 of the subscribers WoW alone has now, so even if every player had moved to play WoW it wouldn't be nearly as big as it is today. In my opinion TOR has a great chance of doing something similar. That would in the end benefit the MMO genre as whole since it would bring a huge amount of new people in to the genre, and at least some of them would eventually go try out the other MMO games as well...

PS. Dont read this as meaning that people wont move from game to game as that will definitely happen too, but compared to non-MMO games MMO games are still a rather small niche so there is still a huge potential for growth if the right game comes along.

---------- Post added 2011-10-28 at 08:23 PM ----------

I disagree. I think that trolls and people who really want to see WoW fail tote the comment more than people standing in defense, hence why we have to continue to tell people that WoW won't die. Problem is, not the defense nor the attackers can prove any example previously like I did, it's just immature "You're an idiot, shut up" posts back and forth.

I agree. That argument basically puts the cause before the effect.

[Mothhive]

I agree. That argument basically puts the cause before the effect.

You've really never seen someone come into a thread about another MMO and completely un-provoked said something along the lines of "This game fails. It'll be just like all the other supposed WoW killers like Aion, Rift, bla bla bla..."?

I see that virtually every day on these forums alone, but I can't remember the last time I saw a fan of another MMO proclaim it will kill WoW. Hurt it's subs? Yes. Kill? No.

[Fenixdown]

Of course, this depends on your definition of "failure".

If you think the game fails because it's total active subs won't surpass WoW's before Blizzard finally ends it, then yes. It will likely fail. I don't see that detracting future interest in the MMO market, however.

If you think the game fails because nobody buys it at all, then yes. That would be a complete and utter disaster. However, we know this won't happen.

[Smitzelplix]

If TOR goes free to play then it will be a failure.

But yet DDO and LotRo both saw their freemium revenue surpass the revenue they were making when they were subbed based only, so yeah doesn't really sound like failure to me.

[Thornstar]

Going freetoplay is a last alternative for games. Yes a struggling game will make more that way. They can survive that way but once that happens it ruins some of the integrity of the game ( I speak only from lotro experience) I mean I enjoy LotrO but as it is I just can't get too serious with it because of that.

[BatteredSausage]

I disagree. I think that trolls and people who really want to see WoW fail tote the comment more than people standing in defense, hence why we have to continue to tell people that WoW won't die. Problem is, not the defense nor the attackers can prove any example previously like I did, it's just immature "You're an idiot, shut up" posts back and forth.

Yet its the wow players that deem up and coming titles to be an instant fail before they have even been released, most spout out this bullshit most probably without even playing it/seeing any of it for themselves. Remember that bandwagon?
You dont see the devs of bioware and the devs of warcraft argueing this crap, they leave that to the twats of society. Yes its immature but some people will never grow up.

[Weerra]

I hear ya, but we're not talking about killing WoW. Let's be honest, it's the WoW fans that really tote that phrase. "That game won't kill WoW" is far more common then "This game will kill WoW."

It only looks that way because for every thread "X kill wow!" there are many responses.
The illusion breaks when you realise that those threads are made by a legions of barely ever posted newbies, but all the responses in each thread are from the same old users.

[Thornstar]

Yet its the wow players that deem up and coming titles to be an instant fail before they have even been released, most spout out this bullshit most probably without even playing it/seeing any of it for themselves. Remember that bandwagon?
You dont see the devs of bioware and the devs of warcraft argueing this crap, they leave that to the twats of society. Yes its immature but some people will never grow up.

Yeah everytime they say "Wow will not die" blah blah blah I just think of the Romans and the Roman Empire. Everything comes to an end eventually. No point arguing about it, no point trying to discuss it.

[Trollsbane]

It only looks that way because for every thread "X kill wow!" there are many responses.
The illusion breaks when you realise that those threads are made by a legions of barely ever posted newbies, but all the responses in each thread are from the same old users.

/shrug

I'm not not seeing an illusion in the forums I read. Perhaps it's different elsewhere. Not a big deal though. The people who write that crap should all fall in an antlion pit. =)

[Vestig3]

Im kinda suprised people think TOR will be Wow's end or atleast for a big part but what people still dont know is that the only thing that can beat blizzard's wow is blizzard themself will it be either them going on like they do now and end it will the next 2 expensions or Titan which is still a big mystery for most people and if i check back from the orignal creators of wow of how many of them moved over too this "new" game i think the MMORPG world is gonna see something totaly new and flashy thats gonna be hard to beat "yet again".

[Zenotetsuken]

SWTOR will come out of the gate very strong much like Rift, and much like Rift it will quickly lose the majority of those subs until it hits it's stride and maintains decent numbers for any other game, but nowhere near WoW's subscriber base.
I can't stand SWTOR personally, but I know there are a lot of people that will latch on to it simply because it is within the Star Wars universe, and even more people that will try it out when it is released because they are looking for a new experience.
Like any MMO you will only be able to measure it's success at the 1 year mark. SWTOR has almost no replayability due to having a single linear questing path, so it will turn off the people that enjoy leveling many alts, which will in turn limit it's potential market.

[Trollsbane]

... Titan huh... Hate to say it, but that's like saying Depfertanitfsayto will be the one to rule them all.

Let's get off the beating WoW stuff. It was never the point of the thread.

[Deleted]

Don't see why people always have to go about seeing if a new MMO will be a wow-killer... we need diversity for the whole MMO aspect to come more acceptable, instead of constantly being labeled as people who are fat and do nothing but play wow and live in our mom's basement.

I really hope they succeed as I would like to change things up a bit, whenever I get burned out by wow, as I did with cata I can go play swtor, thats my intention moving between the 2 depending on my mood. It's the same thing I do with a lot of other games, I love CoD if I want to play more of a rambo-style game and show my skills, but when i'm in the mood for some more teamwork BF3 is my game.

That's what I hope WoW and SWTOR will do, live side by side and have their own merits for people to play hopefully both at the same time, just depending on what they want at the moment, this will ensure for a lot of plays like myself to not quit wow (which is good for both developers) because we got bored from the content.