[SUGGESTION] Things to fix in WOW.

[Palapop]

Copy of my own post on wow.eu forums. I just wanted to share it with you guys and also to see if, hopefully someone agrees with me so that we may have our voices heard

Hello there folks
First of all, I'm sorry for my "inglish". It's not my mothers tongue, but I do my best to make it, at least understandable.

Ok, so... I've been playing WOW for quite some time (actually since vanilla). And honestly, it saddens me to see the current state of game. And, many might not agree with my opinion, but to me, it all started with Legion. A "modern WoW" as some would say. Whole game took a different course with that expansion. Was good "fresh start", but it went downhill quickly.
I'll do my best to explain everything in few "items on the list ".

1. Game philosophy and rewarding system(s)/ gear progression.

Theres WAAAAAAY too much RNG in game: m+ keys (yep, these are RNG too), weekly vault (endless RNG slot-machine) daily covenant calling (rep RNG), conduits, legendaries (ok, they are fixing it in 9.1.5, kudos to that), etc, etc, etc...

It's a little bit over the top guys. Remember the game where our ONLY RNG was boss loot? EVERYTHING ELSE in the game- WE HAD POWER TO CONTROL IT. We had power to choose our pvp item with honor/conquest points, pve item with justice/valor points, our glyphs, our legendary item (mop/wod) progression.
Now we have control over nothing. It feels extremely UNREWARDING to grind the HELL out of pvp/m+/raid.... just to be stuck with low ilvl trink/wep/chest/dom socket... etc, etc, etc...
**Solution**: Bring back PROPER pve/pvp vendors (pvp vendors without 34972397492 honor/conquest required to "upgrade" an item)
1.1 Also, the "ilvl inflation" is way out of proportion. 4 difficulties x 13 ilvls differences just within 1 patch x 3 "X.X" patches in 1 exp cycle = 150+ ilvls difference. A little bit over the top because it makes previous raid tiers COMPLETELY irrelevant once new raid comes.
**Solution**: Nerf ilvls to the ground. Especially new-tier LFR + normal sets so that they are not (at least not too much) higher than previous hc-difficulty. Atm it's new normal raid=previous mythic raid.


2. Power progression.

People just don't like it. Period. They are fed with it. Most of the players (at least from what I have heard from) glorified Legion's artifacts just because of the lore behind these items, the way how we obtained them and various sets of skins.
NO ONE LIKED AP GRIND THAT CAME WITH IT!
Instead, it ruined players wish to play different specs or to even level alts!
Legion artifacts/legendary items (RNG SLOT MACHINE) = BFA azerite gear/essences = SL covenants/soulbinds/conduits/"legendary" items (huuuuuge gold sink)
**Solution**: Bring back MOP-style glyphs (that would also affect economy. heavily). Simple and easy to use/replace. Buy glyph for 20-200g off the AH (I assume prices would be 200-2000g with todays inflation, which is still more than fine). And resurrect inscription! VOILA!

3. CLASS DESIGN(S)!!!!!!!!!

Please, please, PLEASE... DO SOME SERIOUS CLASS REDESIGN!
Do you remember what you guys said before Legions release? That you want to "completely overhaul" all classes every 2 expansion so they may not feel "old/stall".
Well, that's what you made happen. How many classes have changed fundamentally since Legion? Non.
Instead, they were just gutted completely with countless systems, sub-systems and borrowed powers.
**GET RID OF GAINER> SPENDER CLASS-DESIGN PHYLOSPHY!!!**
Holy power/maelstrom/combo points/runes..... it's all just gainer> spender.
All DPS classes are being designed to have 2-3 "gainer" abilities and 1-2 "spender" abilities.
EG: Ret paladins have: crusader strike, judgement, exorcism (+ Hammer of wrath below 20%) these are 3 gainers we use to dump everything onto templars verdict and divine storm. Our 2 spenders.
Very same thing happens with ele shamans: lightning bolt, lava burst= 2 gainers with 2 "spenders" - earth shock and earthquake.
Do you see the pattern here? Cast 3-5 "gainers" > spend it on 1 (out of 2, MAYBE 3) "spenders".
Extremely boring. Bring back classes with ACTUAL DPS ROTATION. Some classes might have multiple possible rotations per spec even (depends if it's single target fight, aoe fight, pvp fight, long fight, short fight... etc, etc, etc...)

Almost ALL of specs I played actively in MOP were IMMEASURABLY better than now (or anything after overhaul that came with Legion).
Ret/holy pala, ele/resto shaman, frost dk, mm hunt (can't even play that class anymore), affli lock, shadow priest (WHAT HAVE YOU DONE TO THEM?!... they are SHADOW PRIESTS. SHADOW. NOT VOID!)

**Solution**: PLEASE get rid of "borrowed power" systems which decimate our classes (lets be honest, all classes are designed with assumption that you have already unlocked all borrowed power systems), and bring back mop-style glyphs and classes with actual rotations and resources.

**Add:** Also in this progression, pvp talents would no longer exist. Instead, bring back "pvp talents" to "normal talents". Let us use thorns in pve. Grounding totem. Hell even lasso would be great talent for ST fights instead of Ascendance (this is just an example for ele shamans since that was always my "main alt")


4. PVP!

This needs MOST (re)work!
What were you thinking when you made "new honor system" back in Legion, guys?
To create ENDLESS grind machine which only few have EVER achieved in the world (and did so by using various exploits/multiboxing/etc/etc)?!?!?!?!
I have reached "close to top" back in Legion (can't remember what was the exact rank number) only to be nerfed back to the ground with "overhaul" that happened with BFA? Now I sit at "2xx" honor level... i don't even remember the number of it. Why? Because I never even open it. I still receive all the rewards I got back in Legion. Who the HELL did math for you there?!

Open world pvp (gank fest).
Why do you so desperately push "wpvp" quests which end up in ruining someones fun/free time doing random open world activities when he gets jumped by group of 5-10-15-20.... players of different faction (usually it's 10 H : 1 A, but I don't say different situations don't occur as well)
**Solution**: Instead of giving us daily quest to kill (gank) X members of different faction in open world, give us quests to: Assault X graveyards, defend X flags, kill X players, win X amount or specific BG? Don't you think that would give players A LOT BETTER EXPERIENCE in WORLD OF WARCRAFT PVP?!
Is it more fun to get jumped by 5-10-15-20... people of opposite faction, or just to enter fair and square fight with same amount of people in certain battleground?
Lets be honest, when is the last time that you encouraged player to enter an BG? - Loooong, long time ago.

4.1 PVP GEAR!
Just end this torture! PLEASE!
Bring back MOP-era gearing philosophy! PVP resilience and just 1 set of pvp ilvl gear.
Honor pvp gear should be the same ilvl as new normal raid.
Conquest pvp gear should be the same ilvl as new heroic raid.
Elite pvp gear (2.2k+) should be the same ilvl as new mythic raid.
Theres additional math that you could do with elite pvp gear. Like: Upgrade X items on 1.8k, 2k, 2.1k, 2.2k.... etc, etc, etc... (Just as how we unlock "elite pvp set")
You still keep your grinds to certain point, and we keep our sanity too (to certain point)
This way, leveled ilvl pvp/pve gear won't be "requirement" for pve since we have 1 secondary stat + pvp resilience. PVE gear will still be superior to PVP gear in PVE environment. And PVP gear will still be superior to PVE gear in PVP environment.
Simple solutions folks. Always go for SIMPLE solutions. They are always the most effective!

5. Servers

Just remove sharding. It kills the feel of open world. It sux to roam around with no living soul in your sight. Or to have empty hubs and main cities.
Not to mention the times you spot rare mob/herb/item/whatever... Just to see it disappear into thin air the moment you reach it because you suddenly changed shard/or God knows what happened.


6. Professions/economy

Why have you forsaken your professions? Why?
Why did we lose 90% of gem slots in our gear?
Why did we lose 90% of our useful enchants on our gear?
Why did we lose all extra gem sockets as BS/LW/Tailor?
Why did we lose all useful gadgets as engineers?
Why did we lose all our glyphs?
Why? Anyone has any reasonable answer?

**Solution**:
1. Removed "shared nodes" (this is 1 single thing you have to do in order to kill ALL MULTIBOXERS)
2. Profession crafted items are current-raid-heroic ilvl. Wouldn't it be cool to create heroic plate belt again? Or cloth pants maybe? With patterns actually dropping from raid bosses/trashes. Just as they did use to? Materials would be gathered in open world with certain "special" items from bosses or new-patch rep vendors maybe?
3. Re-adding colour-specific gems, "enchantable" gear slots, shoulder enchs, glyphs.... it would all make PROFESSIONS MATTER AND ALIVE AGAIN! IN AN MMO GAME!!!!!! IT WOULD GIVE PEOPLE THINGS TO DO!

All in all: BRING BACK FUN TO THE GAME! Not chores! Even if that means theres no "chore" to make us log in EVERY SINGLE DAY, make us WANT TO LOG IN EVERY SINGLE DAY. By playing dungeons, battlegrounds, farming certain items/professions/pets... etc, etc, etc....

There... it's 7 am now... I should be gone to sleep now. If I think of some things that I could add, I definitely will. Just as I wrote this, I remembered I didn't say anything about what should be our daily "chore" in game. It should never EVER be anything more than 1 random heroic dungeon or 1 random BG. NEVER EVER!

FUN GAME >>>>>>>>>>>>>>> chorecraft.

Thank you for reading
Have a good night and wonderful day everyone.

Lets hope we will have fun again playing our favorite game!

[Dracullus]

As always, more of "revert game to version when I was young", without any reflection why some changes was introduced in first place.

Like sharding, no one of course remember abysmal launches, smooth transitions we see from Legion is taken for granted.

Professions are "forsaken", but on same breath people complain that legendary base items cost fortune on 9.1 launch.

PVP gear "should" be on same ilevel as raid in PVE environment, but you don't care about consequences - you either join RNG fiesta from PVE (Legion, BfA) or vendor cause problems we saw in 9.0, which lead to reintroducing old system when PVP gear is better only in PVP situations.

People ask for no more "power progression", but would be first to complain new expac has nothing to offer. Source - check comments about SL when Blizzard revealed expac, but didn't reveal any power systems on first day.

Of course I'm not saying that complaining is wrong. But every issue presented here has no obvious and quick solutions, every need deep discussion and devs are not some morons that can't see obvious things that every Andy on MMO-Champion can notice.

[kaminaris]

Literally none of the things listed here is design problem. Everything is wrong:

1. RNG is a part of this game since developers made their first pre-alpha. Its not the amount of RNG that is the problem, it's how it affects your character is the problem. Solution to this was titanforging and it worked way better than the current or even previous implementations. Specifically, its better to have 1000 scratch cards with ~$100 rewards than 10 scratch cards with ~$10000 rewards.

2. People don't like power progression? Pure nonsense, play CSGO if you don't want power progression.

3. Again, nonsense. You have 36 specs with tons of variety. Having more buttons doesn't add variety. If anything they should follow the same rework as Demo got as it is currently the only fun spec to play, and far outshines everything else combined and multiplied together. But then again, you have variety because of that.

5. It's not the server's or sharding fault. You simply have no desire or goal to go open world since there is nothing there. That is why you don't see people.

And your solutions are something you never gave a deeper thought about. Removing shared nodes doesn't remove bots. Those are the problem, not multiboxers.

That being said, current developers has probably around the same level of insight.

[WowIsDead64]

Only thing, that could be ultimate solution of all problems - is "casual mode". This mode may have worse rewards or even just cosmetic rewards (in this case it should be 100% doable without gear progression), but devs just STOP caring about competition between players. I.e. it should be "Nobody should care and be envious/jealous about what you do in game - everybody cares about his own business only". Players are allowed to do ANYTHING. If you want to fly - just fly, because nobody cares about ore/herb farming or some stupid treasure chests. I.e. that "Why should I care about jump puzzles, if player X can just use flying mount and easily get that treasure?". Player, who chooses this mode, automatically accepts, that he shouldn't care about other players in this mode. If he don't agree - he should play normal/war mode instead.

[Val the Moofia Boss]

Theres WAAAAAAY too much RNG in game: m+ keys (yep, these are RNG too), weekly vault (endless RNG slot-machine) daily covenant calling (rep RNG), conduits, legendaries (ok, they are fixing it in 9.1.5, kudos to that), etc, etc, etc...

Literally everyone agrees that this has been a serious problem since the introduction of Thunderforging in MoP. Blizzard won't remove it because it drags out the loot treadmill.

2. Power progression.

People just don't like it. Period. They are fed with it. Most of the players (at least from what I have heard from) glorified Legion's artifacts just because of the lore behind these items, the way how we obtained them and various sets of skins.
NO ONE LIKED AP GRIND THAT CAME WITH IT!

Again, nobody likes the grinds. Blizzard won't get rid of them because each expansion has had less and content and Blizzard is unwilling to fix the problem by making more content. They instead try to hit it by using grinds to pad out playtimes (and therefore, subscriptions).

Almost ALL of specs I played actively in MOP were IMMEASURABLY better than now (or anything after overhaul that came with Legion).
Ret/holy pala, ele/resto shaman, frost dk, mm hunt (can't even play that class anymore), affli lock, shadow priest (WHAT HAVE YOU DONE TO THEM?!... they are SHADOW PRIESTS. SHADOW. NOT VOID!)

That's because MoP still had the good game designers like Xelnath, but he left along with Ghostcrawler and the last of the WoW team's talent to go to Riot and become the kings of a far better designed game.

4. PVP!

This needs MOST (re)work!
What were you thinking when you made "new honor system" back in Legion, guys?
To create ENDLESS grind machine which only few have EVER achieved in the world (and did so by using various exploits/multiboxing/etc/etc)?!?!?!?!
I have reached "close to top" back in Legion (can't remember what was the exact rank number) only to be nerfed back to the ground with "overhaul" that happened with BFA? Now I sit at "2xx" honor level... i don't even remember the number of it. Why? Because I never even open it. I still receive all the rewards I got back in Legion. Who the HELL did math for you there?!

If Blizzard went back to the MoP model everybody would be happy, but Blizzard is hellbent on not giving their customers what they want.

Open world pvp (gank fest).
Why do you so desperately push "wpvp" quests which end up in ruining someones fun/free time doing random open world activities when he gets jumped by group of 5-10-15-20.... players of different faction (usually it's 10 H : 1 A, but I don't say different situations don't occur as well)

Open world PvP has been borked since BC added flying, since the aggressor can always pick when to engage at will and with absolute safety regardless of their class (whereas in Vanilla only Rogues could stealth and even then there was a lot of risk to them involved). Admittedly open world PvP without flying wasn't usually fair as it was pretty much Rogues ganking people or a zerg mob, but it was still better than the crap we have today.

5. Servers

Just remove sharding. It kills the feel of open world. It sux to roam around with no living soul in your sight. Or to have empty hubs and main cities.
Not to mention the times you spot rare mob/herb/item/whatever... Just to see it disappear into thin air the moment you reach it because you suddenly changed shard/or God knows what happened.

Blizzard will never fix their servers because it'd require merging servers. Blizzard is too prideful to do that. Blizzard implemented paid server transfers in the first place because some servers were dying or woefully imbalanced but rather than addressing that problem by merging servers (and generating headliens) they instead decided they would rather make people have to pay extra to get a good game experience.

6. Professions/economy

Why have you forsaken your professions? Why?

Because they don't care. FFXIV has been out on the market for 8 years and its professions/crafting/gathering blows WoW out of the water, and yet Blizzard could never be bothered to step up their game.

[Luck4]

There are so many things that need to be fixed or reverted in the game that I really believe they instead will milk the WoW player-base as much as possible until the game bites the dust.

I mean, if the next expansion ends being generic, or with less content, than Shadowlands, then I think it'll be a huge sign that WoW is no longer considered a flagship product.

Tbh, I fear that this new 8-month patch cycle is already that, but I'm hoping to be wrong. I'm waiting for 10.0 to prove me wrong.

[Relapses]

Ah yes, back to the 'ol universal definition of fun in a video game.

[TheLucky1]

Get in the line armchair dev #83528831

[lolmmofuture]

wow is flawed at the core

they need a full reset, hence wow 2

but modern blizzard wont be able to do it
so ttherfore a new mmo is needed form elsewhere

[Lolites]

Tbh, I fear that this new 8-month patch cycle

i chuckle whenever i see this
first of all the patch took 7months, not 8,
second thing: its not like there were some things that might slow down work, right? like other companies were totaly not delaying games or patches (there was a calendar from developers saying FFXIV was 2months behind schedule), its soooooooo weird that blizzard too would be 1-2 months later than usual (FASTEST raid added -i didnt check wod as that should not be taken as example in any way or form- was nighthold opening 4.5months after expansion, usualy its 5-6months for raid patch so 7 months is 1-2 months later)

[Ryzeth]

[SUGGESTION]: Don't post bad ideas on fansites.
[SUGGESTION]: Don't give up your day job.

[CalamityHeart]

Bringing your post from the official WoW forums to MMO-C is a bit of a step down, ain't it? Like taking your campaign from the steps of city hall over to the local orphanage.

I'm sure you're not the first or last person to post feedback and suggestions for the direction of WoW in the form of a huge wall of text that can be easily boiled down to, "JUST RE-RELEASE MOP." without sacrificing much of the integrity of the post's point.

It's... well, it's definitely feedback, I guess. Could it actually be a solution, the solution to all of WoW's troubles? Sure, I... I guess. Maybe. I mean, I loved MoP too. I wouldn't mind.

But if this is the sort of feedback that gets all the hearts and responses on the real forums, a chorus of "Shut the fuck up and send me back to the good ol' days.", instead of like... you know... ideas. Then on some level, I can kind of understand why people on the forums get the impression that Blizzard doesn't listen to them. I'm not on the forums anymore, so I wouldn't know. But it just seems like an exercise in futility.

[Steelangel]

shadow priest (WHAT HAVE YOU DONE TO THEM?!... they are SHADOW PRIESTS. SHADOW. NOT VOID!)

Shadow is void. I mean, paying attention to the lore is important too.

6. Professions/economy

Why have you forsaken your professions? Why?
Why did we lose 90% of gem slots in our gear?
Why did we lose 90% of our useful enchants on our gear?
Why did we lose all extra gem sockets as BS/LW/Tailor?
Why did we lose all useful gadgets as engineers?
Why did we lose all our glyphs?
Why? Anyone has any reasonable answer?

No one has any idea why professions have been almost completely abandoned in terms of dev time. Inscription, Jewelcrafting, Engineering exist in only a perfunctory manner at this point, and there is no good reason why.

[Echocho]

Most of these are very good imo

[Palapop]

Literally none of the things listed here is design problem. Everything is wrong:

1. RNG is a part of this game since developers made their first pre-alpha. Its not the amount of RNG that is the problem, it's how it affects your character is the problem. Solution to this was titanforging and it worked way better than the current or even previous implementations. Specifically, its better to have 1000 scratch cards with ~$100 rewards than 10 scratch cards with ~$10000 rewards.

2. People don't like power progression? Pure nonsense, play CSGO if you don't want power progression.

3. Again, nonsense. You have 36 specs with tons of variety. Having more buttons doesn't add variety. If anything they should follow the same rework as Demo got as it is currently the only fun spec to play, and far outshines everything else combined and multiplied together. But then again, you have variety because of that.

5. It's not the server's or sharding fault. You simply have no desire or goal to go open world since there is nothing there. That is why you don't see people.

And your solutions are something you never gave a deeper thought about. Removing shared nodes doesn't remove bots. Those are the problem, not multiboxers.

That being said, current developers has probably around the same level of insight.

1. The "only" rng we had was the killed mob/boss loot. EVERYTHING ELSE was on our hands.

2. Power progression =/= borrowed power.
Power progression can be:
tier sets
legendary drops (Glaives, bow...)
legendary quests
rated gameplay
timed gameplay...

3. Guess what? The only nonsense here is what you have said.
You have COMPLETELY missed my point there. And this is the mistake others do too.
I have never complained about the number of spells/abilities we use. But about how the WORK.
You clearly don't understand "gainer> spender" logic.

Having 937246823674193724723 abilities wouldn't change anything unless the WAY HOW 1 CLASS WORKS changes. The core mechanic of the class.

Do you understand what I'm trying to tell you? Difference between HOW 1 spec works and WHAT YOU USE to make it work? Here we discuss about HOW.

5. Should I even comment this? Did you ever happen to gather some herb just to have it disappear the moment you finish your "cast"?

You have completely misunderstood my post, I'm afraid.

[kaminaris]

1. The "only" rng we had was the killed mob/boss loot. EVERYTHING ELSE was on our hands.

You do not understand how RNG works then. "The only RNG" is irrelevant. Relevant are the odds and gains from these odds.

2. Power progression =/= borrowed power.
Power progression can be:
tier sets
legendary drops (Glaives, bow...)
legendary quests
rated gameplay
timed gameplay...

tier sets, legendary drops/quests is borrowed power that will eventually go away.
not sure what you mean rated/timed gameplay because its not a power progression itself at all.

3. Guess what? The only nonsense here is what you have said.
You have COMPLETELY missed my point there. And this is the mistake others do too.
I have never complained about the number of spells/abilities we use. But about how the WORK.
You clearly don't understand "gainer> spender" logic.

I do and it's a nonsense. Not every spec is gain/spend mechanics. It is you who clearly don't understand that.

5. Should I even comment this? Did you ever happen to gather some herb just to have it disappear the moment you finish your "cast"?

You have completely misunderstood my post, I'm afraid.

Its literally the same effect when other players does it. Benefit is that you see herbs at all. But then again if you understood why it was introduced in first place you would know what problem was.


All in all, your solutions would only make game worse at this point, simply because you don't really understand the actual problems of a game and focused on some irrelevant stuff.

[Paperfox]

It looks like you put some thought into this.

Simply put WoW is designed solely for the shareholders, I used to think they made the shareholders happy by making the players happy. Not so much anymore.

It's all about sales - subs, tokens, mounts, whatever. SL with its current sub base made as much money as WoW did when it had double the players.

So it isn't broken, and therefore doesn't need fixing.

Maybe if enough people leave then they might think it needs something more than a bandage.

I wish they would fix it, please continue to put your ideas in the official forums.

[tacoloco]

So many people come to this forum with their big ideas and solutions and so many people get dope slapped virtually.

[arkanon]

I have said this a few times, but this seems as good a place as any to say it again; Blizzard need to make a big decision - look back at what worked before, and basically release a new expansion, but with the core design philosophy of one of the older, more popular and successful expansions -OR- Look ahead, and take a risk – do something innovative and different, something no one sees coming.

If they decide to look back, that’s fine, and could result in something quite special – An expansion in a new location, with new bosses and content, but based on old design ideas – progression, gearing, systems (none), and class design all BASED on older versions of the game – I could absolutely see this working. With all the advancements in the visuals etc, this could be amazing.

If they decide to look forward, I would want to see something REALLY drastic done – complete reworking of the class system, specs gutted and built back up, progression, difficulties, gearing, and class design all stripped back to a blank sheet of paper and start from dot – what is a rogue? Does it need 3 specs? Do we even need specs? Would a thief spec work for the rogue using a bow/xbow? You get the idea, a complete reimagining of the classes.

There are risks with both – if they look back, things might end up looking like a reskinned Wrath, or a reskinned Mop, and fans might get pissed about it being “lazy”, but I do believe so long as the core gameplay remains fun and rewarding, people forget about that stuff – look at MoP – people were outraged they would do a “chyna” expansion, but the gameplay was so godamn strong, it is now considered one of the better expansions.

On the flip side, a total reinvention of the game could backfire by alienating the dedicated players, but, it could also reinvigorate a stale old franchise and open up so many new possibilities, and bring in hordes (no pun intended) of NEW players to the franchise. I think this is one of the things bringing interest to New World – its not people saying “this is better than wow” its people saying “whoa, this is a bit different, that’s pretty cool!” NW vs WoW is not Honda Vs Nissan, its Honda Vs Kawasaki – they both have the same intention; to make money by entertaining people, but they go about it in very different ways.

The sad truth is, the same thing Blizzard used to openly brag about at cons is really hurting them right now – they plan SO far ahead, the next expansion was probably set in stone before SL even launched – the story, the systems, the features – its too late to change it. I wish that wasn’t the case, I hope its not, but im confident it is.

- - - Updated - - -

wow is flawed at the core

they need a full reset, hence wow 2

but modern blizzard wont be able to do it
so ttherfore a new mmo is needed form elsewhere

Like say.......a League of Legends mmo? What do you think, LoL MMO Future?

[gubasti]

Factions being able to play together. That's the big one by my reckoning.