Will people downrank Immortals on the app stores?

[PosPosPos]

Theatre into TV? I'm afraid this is a good comparison. One requires, in contrast to the number of people it can reach, a metric ton of time, effort and resources, the other, while requiring an advanced infrastructure (TV network in case of TV, high speed and easily accessible wi-fi in case of mobile games) and more resources, can reach infinitely more people. Just like the guys at Blizzcon said, "you guys have phones, right?". The network is in place almost everywhere in the world now, everyone has smartphones, so... Mobile games are unfortunately the future.

I never said it wasn't. It's just not the kind of future I would vote for with my wallet.

It's like having fresh garden salad your entire life, and suddenly someone came up with frozen peas and carrots. Yeah, the latter might gain popularity, but I will never downgrade unless I was forced to, either by lack of supply or financial reasons.

And unlike my greens, gaming isn't "mandatory", I have other hobbies like reading and traveling to fall back to pass my time.

- - - Updated - - -

This is where that narrow thinking comes into play. Complexity doesn't necessarily make a better game. Perhaps the game you played would have been served better by being played with a keyboard and mouse, but that doesn't mean that all gaming is better that way. Most of my favorite games from the late 90's could probably be played just as well on a mobile platform. What made them great wasn't mechanical complexity, but rather the compelling stories or immersive gameplay.

I'm also not saying that mobile gaming is the end all be all for gaming. What I AM saying is that mouse and keyboard gaming is not that either. These are both just steps in the evolution of video gaming.

Yeah, I will wait when there are compelling mobile games at all.

But it's going to be a real long wait, and I am not going to hold my breath over this one.

[Battlebeard]

You expressed it just fine. It's a common mentality held by people who are so stuck in their ways that they can't adapt to a changing world and invariably are left behind.

I agree to a certain degree. But you make it sound like change is almost always good. Or that change is change, for good or bad, live with it.

I try to be objective in most things in life, but here, I really, really think mobile games ARE seriously bad for the gaming industry. This change IS BAD regardless how you look at it. Here, we SHOULD stay behind because this is a step in the wrong direction.

[Mercane]

This is where that narrow thinking comes into play. Complexity doesn't necessarily make a better game. Perhaps the game you played would have been served better by being played with a keyboard and mouse, but that doesn't mean that all gaming is better that way. Most of my favorite games from the late 90's could probably be played just as well on a mobile platform. What made them great wasn't mechanical complexity, but rather the compelling stories or immersive gameplay.

I'm also not saying that mobile gaming is the end all be all for gaming. What I AM saying is that mouse and keyboard gaming is not that either. These are both just steps in the evolution of video gaming.

For me it's not necessarily about complexity or even the quality of the game. I play a small handful of mobile games, in really short bursts.

My issue with mobile games in general is- I'm in my late 30's. Staring at even an iPhone X for more than 20 minutes strains my eyes, I'm 6'6 and have abnormally large hands and the controls in mobile games aren't meant for people with giant thumbs, I can't even see a good portion of the screen most of the time. There's no comparison (for me) in comfort when the choice is either staring at a small screen or lounging in an office chair, at a desk, playing a keyboard and mouse game.

[Battlebeard]

I still disagree. Keyboard and mouse is not the ultimate way. It is a complex way, but as with all things sophisticated it does not mean it is better. Like you said, music tastes and differences, you can say you likr certain instruments better but who would say electric guitar is better than violin or piano is better than cello?

Mobile gaming may not be complex as keyboard mouse, but user friendliness is why there are so many new generation mobile gamers than PC. Kids and women now find accessible means to play games where a PC has a huge learning curve on top of knowing what games to play, what PC can run the game, how to play the game etc.

We can even look at the most complex genre that epitomizes PC gaming complexity -RTS. It takes huge skill to master the controls, huge skill in being able to micro and macro at SC pro player levels. That cant be replaced by mobile games, so it must be better right? But how many people can actually play on that level of pro SC players? Not many. RTS in general is not accessible. Even on PC that interest has evolved to MOBAs and Minrcraft, but this is not a bad thing either because RTS is still around and the genre has room to improve itself. Just that RTS today is very dated and the controls, while having a high skill ceiling, are also frightening away most peoplr interested in learning. Its like the cathedral organ of music, not eceryone wants to learn to play that even if they enjoy the music from it.

Future of gaming is gonna shift. VR is getting better each year. Mobile gaming is getting better each year. You cant compare these to keyboard mouse and just flatly say it is better. At some point you will be an old man with slow fingers and you cant be pro RTS player even if you wanted to. Reaction times slow. Your taste in games will change. That is how it is.

I still disagree

Because the current state of gaming, with more accessible games, is harmful to the industry . I know this might sound over the top, but this is some kind of affermative action to get more people into gaming. If we make gaming more accessible, it means more noobs, casual players, stupid people etc. I dont WANT games to be too accessible or too easy. When I lived at home and played games my father, who is a smart high educated man, didn't understand my games at all nor did he think he could ever handle the controllers. That is not a bad thing.

We gamers have always prided ourself of being smarter than the avarage person, have better reflexes and finger coordination than the avarage person. What happens to the gaming industry when it becomes more accessible? It start with games we dont play, casual games, but it will spread. I love my dad with all my heart, but he sucks at games and I would never want him to play a game I play. I don't want more bad people in the gaming world. I don't want it accessible. I want us to have this world for ourselves. People are welcome to join IF they can handle it. Mobile games require so little effort yet alone PASSION to play and mobile gamers, excuse my "ignorance" but it has to be said, ARE NOT REAL GAMERS.

I always speak out for improved technology and science. I want better healthcare and more medical research. I want technology when it comes to computer systems, software and hardware. I want technology when it comes to transportation and I think the future of cars can actually be really cool. I want the world to evolve, BUT not the gaming industry. Sure, I want a future Playstation 5 and Nintendo Switch 2.0 w/e it's called and I want cooler PC games with improved gameplay, graphis etc. But I don't want it too mainstream. I don't want mobile games to take over. I don't want this interest, OUR interest, to be shared with those who are not as passionate and dedicated as us. I want people in World of Warcraft who are ready to put in 1000+ hours, not those who can casually play it on their phone twice a week.

I like the development of smartphones and if used correctly they are useful. But people misuse them in my opinion and it's sad to see people stare at them 24/7. My sister argued it's no different than playing games 24/7 but i really think games makes us smarter, while phones make us more stupid. And even though it sound harsh, I don't want the phone-people to come here. Now, I realize people who play games also use their phones, but not at the same time.

Gosh, I should copy everyhting I wrote and organize it better, but I wrote it as I thought it up. At my masters degree in college I wrote a big paper on the future of movies, how streams etc would kill movie rental etc (one could say I predicted the end of Blockbuster). I feel like going back to school to research this for real as well. My conclusion about the movie paper was that there would be more convinient ways to watch movies with netflix etc and that people could make a lot of money on this. But that it killed the soul of movies. The feeling of going to the rental store, going in the isles, picking your movie, buying some candy there, talking to the clerk about movies etc, THAT was the heart and soul of it. That is gone now, and that is really, really sad. I predict cinemas will also end fairly soon. And going with friends to the cinemas, and eating popcorn will also be a thing of the past soon. I feel the same about gaming. The nerdy exclusivity we had was the soul of gaming. Mainstream accessible gaming will kill the heart and soul of the gaming world.

[Triceron]

I still disagree .

The soul of gaming isnt any different. The medium is shifting, and the attitudes surrounding gaming are shifting. Grasping on to the old methods is akin to pining for Arcade culture to come back; and this is coming from someone who grew up with Arcades in every mall.

You like PC gaming. I get that. But it isnt ultimate because you like it. Gaming isnt dying because you are seeing it go in a different route. Gaming itself is not one static thing you can talk about, it is many things at many points in time.

Netflix killed blockbuster, so is Netflix and on-demand bad or worse than going out to rent videos? Did the cultural shift make movies less enjoyable to the crowds who had to hunt down a patticularly obscure movie amd who prided themselves for finding it? I dont think so.

I think mobile gaming experience can replicate the fun of PC LANs even, we simply arent at a point where we have games to play on mobile. Monster Hunter on portable was probably the best multiplay game Ive ever played, and that is compared to every PC online game. I would have never thought hat it was possible for any portable to replicate a fun social experience if we were to talk about gameboys and game gears. Amd all it took was one good game to change 10+ years of bias against portables.

[tangers58]

I don't get why people want to ruin a chance for Blizzard to make one of their IPs be available to the biggest gaming platform in the world - an audience the Diablo franchise hasn't really touched so far.

Okay, they didn't announce D4, just like they said they wouldn't. I'm sure the same people whining now are the same people who didn't like D3.

They said they wouldn't... a week before blizzcon. They had a very different story when they were releasing videos hyping up their "multiple Diablo projects" when it was time to sell the virtual tickets. They had no one to blame but themselves for players being excited, and no one to blame but themselves for having nothing to show.

- - - Updated - - -

The soul of gaming isnt any different. The medium is shifting, and the attitudes surrounding gaming are shifting. Grasping on to the old methods is akin to pining for Arcade culture to come back; and this is coming from someone who grew up with Arcades in every mall.

You like PC gaming. I get that. But it isnt ultimate because you like it. Gaming isnt dying because you are seeing it go in a different route. Gaming itself is not one static thing you can talk about, it is many things at many points in time.

Netflix killed blockbuster, so is Netflix and on-demand bad or worse than going out to rent videos? Did the cultural shift make movies less enjoyable to the crowds who had to hunt down a patticularly obscure movie amd who prided themselves for finding it? I dont think so.

I think mobile gaming experience can replicate the fun of PC LANs even, we simply arent at a point where we have games to play on mobile. Monster Hunter on portable was probably the best multiplay game Ive ever played, and that is compared to every PC online game. I would have never thought hat it was possible for any portable to replicate a fun social experience if we were to talk about gameboys and game gears. Amd all it took was one good game to change 10+ years of bias against portables.

Pretending that mobile games are the next step doesn't make it so. As long as its tapping on a tiny screen to play pay to win crap it is going to stay the basement of the gaming world. All Mobile is these days is the place publishers go to make a quick buck for little investment. And that is very unlikely to change.

[Appelgren]

People that only play clash of clans and things like that on mobile and dont play consoles/computers arent real gamers.
If it was then pretty much everyone with a phone is a gamer. Anyone with common sense understands that its ridicolous.

Do i have anything against people who play mobile games only? No. Against people who play all available platforms? No.

Just dont call my mother a gamer because she plays snake on her phone. Shes not a gamer.

[GrossOnToast]

I love diablo. That series has a special place in my heart. Ill give this new Diablo game a good try for a few weeks (depending how much i enjoy it off the bat) and will rate it appropriately. ive never tried "gaming" on a mobile device, and was kind of hoping for something to help/fix/solve D3, but oh well.

[Triceron]

Pretending that mobile games are the next step doesn't make it so. As long as its tapping on a tiny screen to play pay to win crap it is going to stay the basement of the gaming world. All Mobile is these days is the place publishers go to make a quick buck for little investment. And that is very unlikely to change.

Gaming is gaming. This isnt Diablo 4, this is Diablo Immortal, so why pretend its Diablo 4? This is like saying Street Fighter 5 on PC is not real gaming because it isnt being played on an arcade cabinet, or console/PC fighting arent real games. The medium and the specific experience may be different, but the game and the potential enjoyment is the same.

For me, I dont see mobile F2P games as a bad thing. Have you played Hearthstone and felt the microtransactions got in the way of your enjoyment? Heroes of the Storm? I see no reason to judge Diablo Immortal so quickly when we know nothing of its business model.

Ive played Torchlight Guardians and other than having repetive content, the game itself was enjoyable. And honestly, D2 baal runs and D3 greater rifts arent exactly perfect to begin with.

I can see a standard microtransaction system being implemented, but talking of item grinds amd such, Diablo is already designed to be a timesink with repetitive play no matter how you look at it.

[kendro1200]

I hope Diablo Immortal gets down voted into oblivion Despite Blizzard trying to spin it otherwise, it is a NetEase reskin using Diablo art assets. The train of thought that bred and wasted company resources into getting Diablo Immortal off the ground needs to be thoroughly quashed (Even being a NetEase reskin there are some higher tier developer resources to review the reskin and design and review how close it is actually like a Diablo game, there is the story department, then there are the artists porting their assets from D3 into the NetEase engine, then there are all of the admin staff taking care of everything legal and logistics). Blizzard threw away Starcraft: Ghost, which still looks like a 10x better game than Diablo Immortal even in today's environment. The only reason why Diablo: Immortal got a stamp of approval was because of the monetization scheme which could be more predatory than what exists with Hearthstone, which means they hope it could be another free money printing machine. There was no thought in making a good game out of this effort, only how to make a quick buck without investing the time and money of a new Diablo game.
Blizzard has become too greedy and too eager to please investors at the cost of screwing over customers. The community has given Blizzard a lot of slack over this last decade when delivering under quality material, because Blizzard has shown they will always support their games. Now we see with HotS they are not going to do that anymore.

[Thrif]

Yep, going in for a big hard zero despite it potentially being good.

[Byleth]

I will treat it like I would any other game, and review it based on it's merits and failures.

[Deleted]

Only if it sucks, i always give games a chance.

For instance Atlas , so many bad reviews, most of them because of server issues, people dont understand what e.a. games are, of course i made a good review because the game is AMAZING (once you actually can start playing)

[Kokolums]

The soul of gaming isnt any different. The medium is shifting, and the attitudes surrounding gaming are shifting. Grasping on to the old methods is akin to pining for Arcade culture to come back; and this is coming from someone who grew up with Arcades in every mall.

You like PC gaming. I get that. But it isnt ultimate because you like it. Gaming isnt dying because you are seeing it go in a different route. Gaming itself is not one static thing you can talk about, it is many things at many points in time.

Netflix killed blockbuster, so is Netflix and on-demand bad or worse than going out to rent videos? Did the cultural shift make movies less enjoyable to the crowds who had to hunt down a patticularly obscure movie amd who prided themselves for finding it? I dont think so.

I think mobile gaming experience can replicate the fun of PC LANs even, we simply arent at a point where we have games to play on mobile. Monster Hunter on portable was probably the best multiplay game Ive ever played, and that is compared to every PC online game. I would have never thought hat it was possible for any portable to replicate a fun social experience if we were to talk about gameboys and game gears. Amd all it took was one good game to change 10+ years of bias against portables.

Everything here is absolutely wrong. Gaming has never changed. Ever. Its just developers or people who run the games ruin them because they don't understand human nature. I don't believe in absolving the culprits of blame by making some appeal to emotion.

[Noxina]

Of course they will, because manchilds gotta manchild.

Personally I will download it, sounds like a great game to play while I take a shit. And then rank it depending on how it actually perform.

[Triceron]

Everything here is absolutely wrong. Gaming has never changed. Ever. Its just developers or people who run the games ruin them because they don't understand human nature. I don't believe in absolving the culprits of blame by making some appeal to emotion.

What kind of statement is that? Gaming has never changed ever? That is the most ambiguous, generic statement you could make, and says nothing about making what I said wrong.

Gaming is not static nor singular therefore it is always in a state of change. Playing Paxman is gaming. Plating World of Warcraft is gaming. Playing Fortnite is gaming. Playing Candy Crush is gaming.

Even if you specify this to PC multiplayer online ARPGs, there is a huge difference between Path of Exile and Torchlight. Hell you cant even compare Diablo 2 and 3. You cant pin point this as a developer issue when players are the reason entire genre of gamesbare no longer played and why trends move away from certain mediums in favour of others.

If gaming is the same then theres no reason why RTS has waned in favour of MOBAs or FPS waned in favour of Battle Royales. No reason why you dont see Adventure games on PC anymore or why Beat em Up console games are rarely seen today.

Sometimes, developers react to trends. Sometimes they try to stick to what they are good at, or try something experimental and new. Hit and misses are to be expected when an audience is unwilling to try something new or different and only want to guage the success of any company by the height of their popularity. This isnt singular to Blizzard, this applies to Nintendo, Sega, EA and practically every company and developer of games. Its funny that you say gaming doesnt change and its the companies that do without considering that gamers are the first ones to criticize any sequel or derivative for lacking innovation or creativity.

[Kokolums]

What kind of statement is that? Gaming has never changed ever? That is the most ambiguous, generic statement you could make, and says nothing about making what I said wrong..

Well, mostly because I've explained why gaming has never changed ever in tons of posts over the years and I get tired of repeating myself lol. But then I feel obligated to because people keep saying things have "changed".

Gamers always want the same thing and its never changed. In fact, its when people think gamers have changed that things get really screwed up.

Most gamers want a social experience. That never changes. This extends into all forms of gaming from video games to pinball to playing cards or even sports. What has changed in regards to PC gaming is a serious turn towards solo play which is murdering several titles, including all Blizzard titles.

[Triceron]

Well, mostly because I've explained why gaming has never changed ever in tons of posts over the years and I get tired of repeating myself lol. But then I feel obligated to because people keep saying things have "changed".

Gamers always want the same thing and its never changed. In fact, its when people think gamers have changed that things get really screwed up.

Most gamers want a social experience. That never changes. This extends into all forms of gaming from video games to pinball to playing cards or even sports. What has changed in regards to PC gaming is a serious turn towards solo play which is murdering several titles, including all Blizzard titles.

When you talk about gamers not changing... We still have Diablo 4 coming.

What people dont seem to get is we are getting variety, and not all games have to be made for them. Immortal is a spinoff aimed at a wider audience. If it isnt for you then move on.

Look at Mario games. Is Nintendo abandoning their core audience by making Mario 2D games on portable systems? Or having Mario in a new fighting game? Or even having a new 3D adventure on a major console?

People treat Immortal with contempt as if it is a replacement for Diablo 4. It isn't. Why even judge it for being what it is not? If you don't play Xbox games, why would you shit on xbox gamers? Mobile gaming is a growing medium for 'PC games'; I use quotations because no game is bound to being played on any one medium. They're simply not meant to be held to the same standard; just like playing Diablo 3 on consoles is its own experience and isn't bound to the PC counterpart.

I went to China in March. I wanted to go to a netcafe to see what games people were playing, if WoW was still popular etc. Know what? Netcafes dont even exist in the city I was in anymore. A city of 14m people, and everyone was playing ARPGs and MOBAs on their phone. Guys, girls, old men, kids.... This is gaming culture in a place you didnt even know had a gaming culture. I even thought to myself 'why doesnt Blizzard have a mobile Diablo game'. Honestly, the biggest flaw Blizzard did was announcing this at Blizzcon when they hyped up a potential D4 announcement. On its own merit, Diablo Immortal should be judged as its own game.

[anon5123]

I don't get why people want to ruin a chance for Blizzard to make one of their IPs be available to the biggest gaming platform in the world - an audience the Diablo franchise hasn't really touched so far.

Because after 6 years of Diablo 3, we were expecting an announcement of Diablo 4, but instead we got "Diablo 3 but it's on your phone now".....and it's not even Diablo 3, it's literally some chinese diablo clone re-skinned to look like Diablo 3.

A game series that has ALWAYS been PC-exclusive, is now having its next major release as a fucking phone game with LESS depth to it than a game released 6 years ago.

It's like Banjo Kazooie: Nuts and Bolts...we got an adventure platformer, then an adventure platformer, then.....a car building and racing game? What?

And now with Diablo, we got a roguelike PC game, then another roguelike PC game, then another roguelike PC game....and now a half-rate phone game which is inferior to the previous game in the series, with the devs treating us like children, "dont u guys have phones lol????"

Do you understand now why people are mad?

Yes, they are "making their IP available to a bigger game platform", but at the cost of giving a giant middle finger to the established fanbase.

also lol @ all the blizz shills rabidly defending it just to be contrarian

[Super Kami Dende]

I'll down rank it if it is trash. If I enjoy it for a Mobile game I'll not tank it.

- - - Updated - - -

When you talk about gamers not changing... We still have Diablo 4 coming.

What people dont seem to get is we are getting variety, and not all games have to be made for them. Immortal is a spinoff aimed at a wider audience. If it isnt for you then move on.

Yeah, which is why I didn't throw a hissyfit over Fallout 76, since genre changes within franchises can often lead to fun things. Like Warcraft -> World of Warcraft.
C&C -> C&C: Renegade, Crash bandicoot -> Crash team Racing etc.