Mega-Thread: Impeachment Proceedings & Inquiry of Trump

[Xeones]

How would anyone know if this is a nothing burger if you hold all your meetings in secret? If this is truly as damning as democrats say and Trump has truly broken laws and is corrupt, why are they hiding it from everyone? Why is it not open testimony? Why is there no whistleblower testifying? Why not just show everyone if this is so damaging and threatening?

Some of the testimony cant be public for national security. They also don't want the people they subpoena to know the entirety of the testimony that came before them to try getting the best testimony.

Public hearings come after the evidence is gathered, Republicans will have plenty of time for nonsense at that time.

At this time you should be more concerned when trump publicly complains about the constitution like he did the other day.

[cubby]

"I'm in charge of the Hatch Act" says Resident Trump in front of Cabinet members while lashing out at his Chief of Staff.

I bet President Pence is looking really good right now.

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How would anyone know if this is a nothing burger if you hold all your meetings in secret? If this is truly as damning as democrats say and Trump has truly broken laws and is corrupt, why are they hiding it from everyone? Why is it not open testimony? Why is there no whistleblower testifying? Why not just show everyone if this is so damaging and threatening?

I thought there was nothing to worry about? Why do you care where/when/how the Democrats hold their illegitimate witch hunt?

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Why did this process start before he even took office?

It didn't.

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Taylor's opening statement was just obtained...

https://www.washingtonpost.com/conte...-bce45468a3ff/

Sondland told Taylor that aid was directly contingent on Ukraine investigating Biden.
He wanted Zelenksky in a "public box".

These are excerpts I'm taking as I'm reading this - ... denote sentences removed for brevity.

"I sensed something odd when Ambassador Sondland told me on June 28 that he did not wish to include most of the inter-agency participants in a call planned with President Zelenskyy later that day... However, Ambassador Sondland said that he wanted to make sure no one was transcribing or monitoring as they added President Zelenksyy to the call."

"In a regular NSC secure video-conference call on July 18, I heard a staff person from the Office of Management and Budget (OMB) say that there was a hold on security assistance to Ukraine but could not say why. Toward the end of an otherwise normal meeting, a voice on the call - the person was off-screen - said that she was from OMB and that her boss had instructed her not to approve any additional spending of security assisstance for Ukraine until further notice. I and others sat in astonishment... All that the OMB staff person said was that the directive had come from the President of the Chief of Staff to OMB."

"There followed a series of NSC-led interagency meeting, starting at the staff level and quickly reaching the level of Cabinet secretaries. At every meeting, the unanimous conclusion was that the security assistance should be resumed, the hold lifted. At one point, the Defense Department was asked to perform an analysis of the effectiveness of the assistance. Within a day, the Defense Department came back with the determination that the assistance was effective and should be resumed. My understanding was that the Secretaries of Defense and State, the CIA Director, and the National Security Advisor sought a joint meeting with the President to convince him to release the hold,..."

"The next day on the phone, Dr. Hill and Mr. Vindman tried to reassure me that they were not aware of any official change in the U.S. policy toward Ukraine, OMB's announcement not withstanding. They did confirm that the hold on security assistance for Ukraine came from Chief of Staff Mick Mulvaney and that the Chief of Staff maintained a skeptical view of Ukraine."

"... Specifically they told me that Ambassador Sondland had connected "investigations" with an Oval Office meeting for President Zelenskyy"

"... Ambassador Sondland said that a call between President Trump and President Zelenskyy would take place soon. Ambassador Volker said that what was '[m]ost impt is for Zelensky to say that he will help investigation..."

"During this same phone call I had with Mr. Morrison, he went on to describe a conversation Ambassador Sondland had with Mr. Yermak at [a meeting in] Warsaw,” Taylor says. “Ambassador Sondland told Mr. Yermak that the security assistance money would not come until President Zelenskyy committed to pursue the Burisma investigation"

And that's just the opening statement. Taylor almost defines beyond reproach.

[PosPosPos]

I'm still fuckin' baffled that you think the fate of the stability of the planet rests on Donald Fucking Trump and pandering to extremist idiots.

It's kind of obvious though, alt-righters have a vastly different idea of stability(to us normal good folks it's called chaos and/or evil), so they want to support Trump and those like him, because the alternative is having a sane/good-faith leader who won't stand for extremists like them.

Just think about it, if I am a sociopath myself, I would vote for sociopaths, and not the other more normal, moral and ethical leaders.

[kaelleria]

"I'm in charge of the Hatch Act" says Resident Trump in front of Cabinet members while lashing out at his Chief of Staff.

I bet President Pence is looking really good right now.

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I thought there was nothing to worry about? Why do you care where/when/how the Democrats hold their illegitimate witch hunt?

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It didn't.

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And that's just the opening statement. Taylor almost defines beyond reproach.

That's a super highly edited version of the opening statement I just transcribed... There's way more in there that people should read like this -

"Before these text messages, during our call on September 8, Ambassador Sondland tried to explain to me that President Trump is a businessman. When a businessman is about to sign a check to someone who owes him something, he said, the buisinessman asks the person to pay up before signing the check. ... I argued to both that the explanation made no sense: the Ukrainians did not 'owe' President Trump anything, and holding up security assistance for domestic political gain was 'crazy'..."

[TexasRules]

It didn't.

I guess all those articles explaining how they should impeach Trump or could before he even took office are imaginary. I am sure government agents saying the y have an insurance policy in case Trump was electe3d are also imaginary. I am so glad none of that happened.

Also all you defenders of a shame of an inquiry, how come only democrats can ask questions? Also the whistleblower did not testify to anything in front of congress because they know his testimony is invalid. If you have a transcript, you don't need falsified testimony so that guy will never testify. This is all a partisan sham that you guys won't admit because it's your party conducting the sham. How can you only let ceertain people ask questions? Oh because you are afraid of the answers. Why wasn't the whistleblower called to testify, you know the one who worked with Joe Biden in the past?

[cubby]

McConnell presents resolution condemning the Syrian withdrawl.

People are setting themselves up politically for reasons to vote to Convict on Impeachment. This is what distancing and CYA'ing looks like at the higher levels.

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I guess all those articles explaining how they should impeach Trump or could before he even took office are imaginary. I am sure government agents saying the y have an insurance policy in case Trump was electe3d are also imaginary. I am so glad none of that happened.

What the holy fuck are you even talking about? They are conducting investigations into events that happen in July/2019. I wish you could pay the fuck attention for once rather than just spewing the GOP talking points that tell you what to believe.

I mean - did you even read that drivel before you posted it?

[Thekri]

Taylor's opening statement was just obtained...

https://www.washingtonpost.com/conte...-bce45468a3ff/

That opening statement right there should be required reading for every single American. It is by far the most clear and well written description of this whole debacle that I have seen, and it doesn't have anything about it that can really be attacked. Almost every salient point has already been verified. Mulvaney already admitted to his part in all this, and that ties directly to the President.

I have to admit. John Bolton looking like the good guy in all this is quite a shock to the system. I mean he is still a hateful walrus, but clearly his hate for Russia really worked in our favor here.

[Draco-Onis]

Also all you defenders of a shame of an inquiry, how come only democrats can ask questions?

The panels have republicans and democrats and they both ask questions behind closed doors, what are you talking about?

[Zaydin]

It is by far the most clear and well written description of this whole debacle that I have seen, and it doesn't have anything about it that can really be attacked.

You underestimate the spinelessness of the GOP and their dishonesty when it comes to protecting their God Emperor.

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The panels have republicans and democrats and they both ask questions behind closed doors, what are you talking about?

He's probalby whining about Drunk Gaetz getting kicked out when he tried to crash the Fiona Hill depositions last week because he wasn't on any of the three committees that had subpeonaed her.

[Edge-]

I guess all those articles explaining how they should impeach Trump or could before he even took office are imaginary.

I think you're confusing media speculation with a clear effort from the Democratic party.

Media and the Democratic party are two different groups. Democrats discussed being open to impeachment out of the gate, and media speculated on that matter, but there was no planned or concerted effort to begin impeachment investigations or proceedings.

If you have evidence to suggest otherwise then by all means show it. Otherwise, you're just lying.

I am sure government agents saying the y have an insurance policy in case Trump was electe3d are also imaginary. I am so glad none of that happened.

https://www.washingtonpost.com/polit...ctually-about/

“I want to believe the path you threw out for consideration in Andy’s office — that there’s no way he gets elected — but I’m afraid we can’t take that risk,” he wrote. “It’s like an insurance policy in the unlikely event you die before 40.

If you're falling for this fake news despite it being thoroughly and repeatedly debunked, that's on you. Stop repeating debunked propaganda.

Also all you defenders of a shame of an inquiry, how come only democrats can ask questions?

Not familiar with this, but sauce?

Also the whistleblower did not testify to anything in front of congress because they know his testimony is invalid.

No, because they haven't been called to. Because there are serious concerns regarding the safety of the whistleblower if their identity is revealed.

Because they don't need to directly testify, as the IG already investigated their claims with the named firsthand witnesses and verified their severity.

If you have a transcript, you don't need falsified testimony so that guy will never testify.

Of the Ukraine call? That's not a transcript. That's based off of notes taken during the call, and not a word-for-word readout.

Why wasn't the whistleblower called to testify, you know the one who worked with Joe Biden in the past?

This is nonsense. There is no evidence to suggest they were a political ally of anyone or that their working relationship with Biden extended beyond a professional relationship of an agent operating out of the White House and working with whichever administration was in charge.

This was like a "greatest hits" of debunked, weak, conservative talking points.

[Shadowferal]

Trump tried earlier to drag Moscow Mitch's name into the infamous phone call with Zelensky, but MM says flat out he’s never had a conversation about the phone call with the president.

“We’ve not had any conversations on that subject,” McConnell told reporters about the transcript of the call between Ukrainian President Volodymyr Zelensky and Trump.

Democrats are using the call to bolster their impeachment inquiry into Trump, claiming the president abused his power when he pressured Zelensky to investigate political rival Joe Biden. ------------------

[Edge-]

https://www.thedailybeast.com/imaad-...dicted-by-feds

A Los Angeles financier who donated $900,000 to President Donald Trump’s inaugural committee has admitted to falsifying records to hide his work as a foreign agent while he lobbied prominent U.S. government officials, federal prosecutors announced Tuesday.

Shah Zuberi, 49, also known as “Imaad Zuberi,” has agreed to plead guilty to three counts in a criminal information for allegedly making almost $1 million in illegal campaign contributions, engaging in various lobbying efforts, and evading taxes, according to the U.S. Attorney’s Office in the Central District of California.

“Mr. Zuberi’s multi-faceted scheme allowed him to line his pockets by concealing the fact that he was representing foreign clients, obtaining access for clients by making a long series of illegal contributions, and skimming money paid by his clients,” United States Attorney Nick Hanna said in a press release Tuesday announcing the charges.

Why is it that Trump seems to be completely surrounded by criminals?

[Thekri]

https://www.thedailybeast.com/imaad-...dicted-by-feds



Why is it that Trump seems to be completely surrounded by criminals?

Well it is all part of draining the swamp. You see, Trump is the drain, and just like a shower, all the crud rushes to the drain and gets stuck around the drain. So by this point it is basically a giant hairball of corruption around Trump.

[Edge-]

https://www.buzzfeednews.com/article...ublic-hearings

For weeks, the impeachment inquiry into President Donald Trump has been happening almost entirely behind closed doors, leaving a confused American public to follow an incredibly complex investigation largely through reporting on leaks and vague comments from members of Congress.

That is all about to change. The impeachment inquiry is coming soon to a television near you, a move House Democrats told BuzzFeed News they hope will shut down Republican complaints about secrecy and help shape public opinion as the 2020 election draws nearer.

...

No one can say yet when public hearings will start, but with Democrats aiming for a full floor vote impeaching President Donald Trump by the end of the year, they’d have to begin soon.

There you go, folks.

[Thekri]

https://www.buzzfeednews.com/article...ublic-hearings



There you go, folks.

Then @TexasRules and others will just switch the talking point to "Media circus to win political points, why can't they do it behind closed doors like a normal government process?"

[Shadowferal]

4 takeaways from Bill Taylor’s huge opening statement

1. There was a quid pro quo on military aid, he believes
In his opening statement, he says nothing has disavowed him of that belief.
“I believed that then, and I still believe that,” he says.

2. But it wasn’t the only one
One of the big questions here was whether Trump might have gotten leverage from a) withholding hundreds of millions of dollars in military aid, or b) from withholding an Oval Office meeting that new Ukrainian President Volodymyr Zelensky badly wanted.
Taylor says it’s both.

3. He says Gordon Sondland relayed an explicit quid pro quo to Ukraine
During this same phone call I had with Mr. Morrison, he went on to describe a conversation Ambassador Sondland had with Mr. Yermak at [a meeting in] Warsaw,” Taylor says. “Ambassador Sondland told Mr. Yermak that the security assistance money would not come until President Zelenskyy committed to pursue the Burisma investigation.”
That’s about as explicit as it gets — although it’s secondhand. Morrison’s testimony now appears it will be key.
Taylor also says Sondland later told him directly that both a meeting and military aid depended on the investigations.

4. Sondland has explaining to do
Sondland testified last week, for instance, that he wasn’t able to vouch for the lack of a quid pro quo. But Taylor suggests he was directly involved in communicating one. Taylor suggests Sondland tried to put a good face on it -- and that Trump and Sondland took care to say it wasn’t a “quid pro quo” -- but that that’s what it effectively was.
“Ambassador Sondland said that he had talked to President Zelenskyy and Mr. Yermak and told them that, although this was not a quid pro quo, if President Zelenskyy did not ‘clear things up’ in public, we would be at a ‘stalemate,' " Taylor says of his Sept. 8 phone call with Sondland. “I understood a ‘stalemate’ to mean that Ukraine would not receive the much-needed military assistance.”
Sondland also testified last week, “I recall no discussions with any State Department or White House official about former Vice President Biden or his son, nor do I recall taking part in any effort to encourage an investigation into the Bidens.”
But Taylor describes Sondland relaying a direct request involving the Bidens to Ukraine.

[Breccia]

Republicans, however, downplayed Taylor’s testimony. Rep. Mark Meadows, a Republican from North Carolina, said of Taylor’s testimony there was “nothing new here, I think.”

*ahem*

said that she was from OMB and that her boss had instructed her not to approve any additional spending of security assisstance for Ukraine until further notice.

Ambassador Sondland told Mr. Yermak that the security assistance money would not come until President Zelenskyy committed to pursue the Burisma investigation"

in fact, Ambassador Sondland said, ‘everything’ was dependent on such an announcement, including security assistance. He said that President Trump wanted President Zelenskyy ‘in a public box’ by making a public statement about ordering such investigations."

There are two options:
A) The bolded is "nothing new" and, therefore, the GOP knows all about the quid pro quo.

B) The bolded is new, and the GOP Denialist just didn't listen.

I mean, take your pick.

[cubby]

https://www.thedailybeast.com/imaad-...dicted-by-feds

A Los Angeles financier who donated $900,000 to President Donald Trump’s inaugural committee has admitted to falsifying records to hide his work as a foreign agent while he lobbied prominent U.S. government officials, federal prosecutors announced Tuesday.

Shah Zuberi, 49, also known as “Imaad Zuberi,” has agreed to plead guilty to three counts in a criminal information for allegedly making almost $1 million in illegal campaign contributions, engaging in various lobbying efforts, and evading taxes, according to the U.S. Attorney’s Office in the Central District of California.

“Mr. Zuberi’s multi-faceted scheme allowed him to line his pockets by concealing the fact that he was representing foreign clients, obtaining access for clients by making a long series of illegal contributions, and skimming money paid by his clients,” United States Attorney Nick Hanna said in a press release Tuesday announcing the charges.

Why is it that Trump seems to be completely surrounded by criminals?

I seriously cannot wait until we can see Trumps financial records. He might be dead by then, but it will still be worth the wait. Trump's money laundering operation is legion.

[Thekri]

The whole "Quid Pro Quo" thing in that testimony would be pretty funny if it wasn't so serious. Trump insisted it wasn't a quid pro quo, but you also can't get this unless you give me that. It is like me insisting I am not robbing you, but you still have to give me your money or I will shoot you. But it definitely isn't robbery.

[cubby]

Trump is looking to replace Mulvaney.

IIRC, Mulvaney is a link to serious conservative GOP leaders who still back Trump. Dumping him would create a rift that might get Trump more Conviction votes. Can someone remind me of that connection, if I have it remotely correct?