New interview with Steve Danuser about BfA

[Verdugo]

he needs to send a press release to all the south african druglords. he's clearly discovered some new, more powerful form of jenkem from sniffing his own farts all day every day.

Blizzard HQ non-stop.

[Vakir]

...Sir, the story is even less nuanced than Mists.

Ow. Owww.

[Powerogue]

"One of the major themes in this expansion was expressed by Sylvanas in the opening words of the Battle for Azeroth trailer: "Ours is a cycle of hatred." To demonstrate that there is a cycle, we created a story structure for Sylvanas that, on the surface, echoed many broad strokes of the road Garrosh took. A warchief promoted under questionable circumstances. A brutal act of aggression that instigated conflict. Distrust among the inner circle that led to an uprising. These parallels were intentional. But it's within the nuance that we sought to show the story grow and change."

I mean yeah. Ultimately the story of BFA would not have been possible without MOP. We never experienced the burning legion orc stuff first hand. We weren't a part of that. Garrosh is essentially that, but for us, completing the parallel between us and Saurfang throughout the expansion, and utilized to give us sympathy to his position of frustration and defeat towards the Horde, who seem to repeatedly fall to darkness.

This expansion is a key example of what I've always said is Blizzard's greatest writing strength: Taking some writing they didn't like and expanding on it with new writing that makes it seem like it was all the grand plan all along. Jaina's arc is iconic in that regard. A perfect example of it, watching her change particularly from MOP to now. Thrall's arc is iconic in that regard, watching him through "Green Jesus" Cataclysm, through WOD, through Legion, through now.


What's different this time?
We are.

The expansion is over. Take a step back. Look at all of it, start to finish. I don't think it was perfect, but they accomplished a lot and I can see what they tried to do.

[Varodoc]

Garrosh was still the better villain btw. Unlike Sylvanas, his motivations and thought process actually made sense, even if they were not particularly complex.

[Kumorii]

Not even comparable. GoT had the biggest character assassination in history (Daenerys). Nothing in Warcraft comes close to that.

Their delivery was shit...but I saw that coming from season 2. The entire story arc and message is all good, but yeah...delivery was atrocious.

[Morae]

There is really not much point reading/listening to this sort of thing when its negative stuff. Its his job. He can't say anything negative unless he is told that he can do so. Even when they would do so its said in a way that "its not really that bad, we made some small mistakes".

As far as positive stuff. They want to tell you all that.

[Nagawithlegs]

Looks like a lot of this forum just wants an apology, which from a modern business isn't going to happen.

The biggest weakness of BFA is, besides the lack of agency for Horde players, is that they sabotaged N'zoths story because they didn't believe he could work in modern times. I wish more interviewers asked what the fuck was up with using half the expansion for Shadowlands setup.

[matrix123mko]

Not even comparable. GoT had the biggest character assassination in history (Daenerys). Nothing in Warcraft comes close to that.

Well... maybe Kael, who could've been a very good tragic villain... but they're bringing him back in Shadowlands anyway.

I have a feeling that Tyrande is Daenerys and Sylvanas in only Cersei. Just wait.

[Powerogue]

Looks like a lot of this forum just wants an apology, which from a modern business isn't going to happen.

The biggest weakness of BFA is, besides the lack of agency for Horde players, is that they sabotaged N'zoths story because they didn't believe he could work in modern times. I wish more interviewers asked what the fuck was up with using half the expansion for Shadowlands setup.

The heck does that even mean?

[ravenmoon]

I'm sure the answers would be very different if the same interview was given at the start of the expansion

[Darknessvamp]

Nuance being the twist that Sylvanas was working for a random Death Lord this whole expansion that they pulled out of their ass a couple of months before 8.2.5 so they could ollie out her for the next expansion. Also what cycle was displayed in this expansion? The war was essentially instigated back in Legion during the defence against said Force after Greymane pulled a fast one (Assassination Attempt). Then there was a lull followed by an escalation first initiated by Anduin royally screwing the Gathering and the Night Elves deciding to move their whole force against Silithus to "pre-empt" a Horde "Invasion" which then partially justifies the attack against Darnassus. No defence for the resultant burning though which the reasoning for has been recontextualised/retconned so much by now it's hard to be certain why Sylvanas burnt down the tree in the first place. Not to mention Distrust being limited to some faction leaders who moaned about Baine and not some greater atrocity against the races of the faction (like full on Xeno Garrosh) and an uprising that was literally propped up overnight and was blown away as quickly as Sylvanas noping out leaving everything unresolved does not make a cycle.

Though what in-depth story reflection can we expect from the guy who self-inserts on a newly promoted "main character" to feel closer to his undead Waifu.
Oh and look forward to the Old Gods Electric Boogaloo Council Fight in the future.

[Nagawithlegs]

Nuance being the twist that Sylvanas was working for a random Death Lord this whole expansion that they pulled out of their ass a couple of months before 8.2.5 so they could ollie out her for the next expansion. Also what cycle was displayed in this expansion? The war was essentially instigated back in Legion during the defence against said Force after Greymane pulled a fast one (Assassination Attempt). Then there was a lull followed by an escalation first initiated by Anduin royally screwing the Gathering and the Night Elves deciding to move their whole force against Silithus to "pre-empt" a Horde "Invasion" which then partially justifies the attack against Darnassus. No defence for the resultant burning though which the reasoning for has been recontextualised/retconned so much by now it's hard to be certain why Sylvanas burnt down the tree in the first place. Not to mention Distrust being limited to some faction leaders who moaned about Baine and not some greater atrocity against the races of the faction (like full on Xeno Garrosh) and an uprising that was literally propped up overnight and was blown away as quickly as Sylvanas noping out leaving everything unresolved does not make a cycle.

Though what in-depth story reflection can we expect from the guy who self-inserts on a newly promoted "main character" to feel closer to his undead Waifu.
Oh and look forward to the Old Gods Electric Boogaloo Council Fight in the future.

That is false. While the concept of "Jailer" is probably new the idea that "Sylvanas is evil because something she saw after she died" is 10 years old. Her being somewhat good in Legion is worse writing than the natural progression of her character since Cata.

- - - Updated - - -

The heck does that even mean?

N'zoth/Azshara expansion wouldn't have had the faction war theme slapped on top of it if the higher ups believed the expansion could carry itself without a war/Sylvanas.

[Verdugo]

That is false. While the concept of "Jailer" is probably new the idea that "Sylvanas is evil because something she saw after she died" is 10 years old. Her being somewhat good in Legion is worse writing than the natural progression of her character since Cata.

Maybe if you played Alliance only, sure.

[Varodoc]

That is false. While the concept of "Jailer" is probably new the idea that "Sylvanas is evil because something she saw after she died" is 10 years old. Her being somewhat good in Legion is worse writing than the natural progression of her character since Cata.

- - - Updated - - -



N'zoth/Azshara expansion wouldn't have had the faction war theme slapped on top of it if the higher ups believed the expansion could carry itself without a war/Sylvanas.

N'Zoth and Azshara are not interesting enough to carry an entire expansion on their back. They would've been Deathwing-tier -- and plenty of people hated Deathwing.

In hindsight, the only villain who truly carried an expansion on his back from start to finish was the Lich King.

[DemonHunter18]

I agree. N'Zoth and Azshara are not interesting enough to carry an entire expansion on their back. They would've been Deathwing-tier -- and plenty of people hated Deathwing.

I'm pretty sure everyone wanted Azshara to have her own expansion.

[Darknessvamp]

That is false. While the concept of "Jailer" is probably new the idea that "Sylvanas is evil because something she saw after she died" is 10 years old. Her being somewhat good in Legion is worse writing than the natural progression of her character since Cata.

What? I wasn't saying Sylvanas being evil was pulled out before 8.2.5. Heck she's been evil and cruel since Warcraft 3. They pulled the "Death Lord" as an explanation for this war, her shifty actions and her supposed "betrayal of the Horde" this expansion some months before 8.2.5 considering none of it was being foreshadowed as the result of an additional party's involvement. I mean even Bwom didn't have any complaints about soul delivery to the shadowlands or his realm being disrupted this whole expansion, you'd think that would be a major indication that something else was happening.

[Tyrathius]

N'Zoth and Azshara are not interesting enough to carry an entire expansion on their back. They would've been Deathwing-tier -- and plenty of people hated Deathwing.

In hindsight, the only villain who truly carried an expansion on his back from start to finish was the Lich King.

They'd have done better than Sylvanas. Azshara and N'Zoth are, at the absolute worst, relative unknowns to people who don't follow the lore (which worked just fine in Legion). Sylvanas makes half the playerbase cringe every time she shows up.

[Feanoro]

And he kind of admitted they straight up lied to the fans when saying Sylvanas won't be Garrosh 2.0. - No instead she's a Garrosh 2.0 with nuances... with a shade of purple maybe?

Rule 1, ActiBlizzard lies.

These old white men at Blizzard are just complacent dickheads. If they haven't learned how to make a good expac or tell a good story by now, they most likely never will.

Why the racism? Hell, if anything, a large part of the story's problem is all the woke bullshit:
- all races are ridiculously tolerant of each other, when they have absolutely no reason to be and it robs them of actual conflicts
- the women are all supposedly strong and independent, except Jaina's flip flops look hysterical if not downright nuts, and "genius tactician" Sylvanas has been shown as constantly failing, Thalyssra's convictions didn't even last past the end of Legion, and so on. It's absolutely embarrassing for women.
- peacenik Anduin is almost universally despised as a weak, selfish, hypocritical coward

[Varodoc]

I'm pretty sure everyone wanted Azshara to have her own expansion.

It was wishful thinking at best. They stopped doing single-villain expansions since Cataclysm with Deathwing (TBC was also meant to be about Illidan, Zul'jin and Kil'jaeden were added later to stretch for WotLK's release). All expansions since then follow the general rule of having multiple main villains per patch.

So in truth it was pretty obvious that there would never be a 100% Azshara expansion. There might have been an expansion where Azshara played a major role as villain.

And that was BfA.

[Verdugo]

- peacenik Anduin is almost universally despised as a weak, selfish, hypocritical coward

Among the fanbase MAYBE. In universe he is the personification of perfect being.