Why players enjoy ruining M+ runs?

[Raelbo]

You're so cute thinking anyone will get banned for this

People do get banned for this, but only if they're reported. Of course if people don't bother reporting because they've been misled into believing that nothing will come of it, then the people who enjoy griefing will get away with it and have little reason to stop.

Which makes me wonder about your ulterior motives here....

[T-34]

People do get banned for this, but only if they're reported. Of course if people don't bother reporting because they've been misled into believing that nothing will come of it, then the people who enjoy griefing will get away with it and have little reason to stop.

Which makes me wonder about your ulterior motives here....

Getting banned for leaving a group or mythic+-run? Of course not.
But you might get an infraction for abusing people in chat. But just stating that people suck and then leave isn't abuse in any way.

From my own anecdotal experience I know several people that have gotten infractions for naming, language, but I know nobody that have gotten any infraction for leaving a mythic+ group.

[Deja Thoris]

People do get banned for this, but only if they're reported. Of course if people don't bother reporting because they've been misled into believing that nothing will come of it, then the people who enjoy griefing will get away with it and have little reason to stop.

Which makes me wonder about your ulterior motives here....

They do not get banned. The group leader is responsible for forming a group, if it goes to shit then he needs to form them better. Simple as that. Blizz will not intervene.

[Mirishka]

Sorry, have to vent.

Seems week after week, one way or another, I can't progress anywhere with my M+ keys since players from a certain eastern european server enjoy ruining people's runs. Just now, I had a +5 key for Siege of Boralus and after waiting almost 1h to find a tank and a healer, we got a full group and right at the start, this eastern european dps warrior started pulling everthing and trying to wipe us over and over. We told him to stop as he was not only trying to ruin the run but he was also getting himself killed on purpose. Before the 1st boss he decided to run ahead, pull packs and boss and run back to us, and decides to leave the group without ever having saying anything other than the "hi" when I invited him in the first place. With him , everyone else also leaves , leaving me alone in the dungeon and having wasted my precisou key.

Last week happened something similar, with yet another player from a certain eastern european country.. I simply don't understand why people have nothing better to do with their time, and nothing happens to them when they clearly are ruining and "griefing" (hate the word but it's exactly what is going on here) other people's playtime. Plus, now that I don't have my own key, I can't even start groups for M+ or even join others bc I'm always declined due to this particular char being 440..

Sorry for the vent, I'm pissed and quite frankly frustrated with all this

The short version is, a lot of people in this world are assholes whenever they can get away with it. There really isn't much you can do aside from finding reliable people to do keys with. If you end up in a group with people that seem chill/fun, extend your battletag and explain that you're looking for decent/reliable players to run stuff with.

- - - Updated - - -

They do not get banned. The group leader is responsible for forming a group, if it goes to shit then he needs to form them better. Simple as that. Blizz will not intervene.

Actually people can get banned for stuff like this, that's a fact. I know that 'lol blizz won't do anything' is a common (and idiotic) mentality around here, but they do take action against players when the behavior is clearly 'LOL I'M A DICK RUINING UR RUN'.

Feel free to believe what you want, but in this matter you're wrong. Simple as that.

- - - Updated - - -

People do get banned for this, but only if they're reported. Of course if people don't bother reporting because they've been misled into believing that nothing will come of it, then the people who enjoy griefing will get away with it and have little reason to stop.

Which makes me wonder about your ulterior motives here....

100% this.

[DeusX]

M+ has to go.
It's very anti-RPG.
Promotes toxic behavior.
Lots of players only do M+. If tomorrow Blizz creates dedicated M+ servers with pre-mades, retail population count will half.

I guess Blizzard is seeing the glaring issues caused by M+, but the tradoff, working in their advantage, is that it keeps some people still engaged, people who would otherwise unsub. You have to look hard to see a Twitch stream about something else than M+. Even raiding streams are more and more a rarity (except the 2 weeks race every new patch). Why do they even bother with that animated afterlives when people only want balanced coventats abilities to not gimp themselves in M+? LOL. Sorry, but the game is pathetic. And I am too, for still playing it.

[Deja Thoris]

Feel free to believe what you want, but in this matter you're wrong. Simple as that.


100% this.

No I'm not. Simple as that.

[T-34]

Leaving is not griefing. trying to get dead on purpose, as the OP says, is griefing.

Behavior that intentionally detracts from others' enjoyment (such as griefing, throwing, feeding, etc.)

In this context, i believe it fits perfectly under all three - griefing, throwing, and feeding. Now i realise feeding is more commonly used in games such as LoL and even OW, but it is the act of "being killed repeatedly", and throwing is as the name suggests, intentionally losing.

In open world content then Blizzard does give infractions for extreme same-faction "griefing".
But for actions in player created groups? Blizzard would rightfully tell you that you can leave and don't play with that person again.
Blizzard abolished master loot, most likely to not deal with all the "ninja-loot" tickets.
Blizzard has a hands-on approach to player to player interaction in player created groups.

And lastly I cannot imagine Blizzard to go through a whole mythic+run to determine if a player is a clueless idiot or a troll.
I have done pjg mythic+ and raids where I met players that were so bad that they might as well be trolls.

Blizzard does not and will not punish players for being stupid, bad, lazy and ignorant.
If Blizzard did that then it would lose the vast majority of its players.

My personal lesson from meeting people that were so bad at the game, wilfully or not, is to be more carefull and strict when I filter out people to pug with. That has made my in-game experience more enjoyable.

[Mirishka]

Why do they even bother with that animated afterlives when people only want balanced coventats abilities to not gimp themselves in M+? LOL.

Because the team of animators and writers and VO director who produce cinematics like Afterlives are totally the same people who design and balance the game.

If I facepalmed any harder, I would break my own nose.

[arkanon]

In open world content then Blizzard does give infractions for extreme same-faction "griefing".
But for actions in player created groups? Blizzard would rightfully tell you that you can leave and don't play with that person again.
Blizzard abolished master loot, most likely to not deal with all the "ninja-loot" tickets.
Blizzard has a hands-on approach to player to player interaction in player created groups.

And lastly I cannot imagine Blizzard to go through a whole mythic+run to determine if a player is a clueless idiot or a troll.
I have done pjg mythic+ and raids where I met players that were so bad that they might as well be trolls.

Blizzard does not and will not punish players for being stupid, bad, lazy and ignorant.
If Blizzard did that then it would lose the vast majority of its players.

My personal lesson from meeting people that were so bad at the game, wilfully or not, is to be more carefull and strict when I filter out people to pug with. That has made my in-game experience more enjoyable.

All wrong - 100% false and just "nah, you are wrong, they totally wouldn't do that". Let me make this REALLY simple for you, since apparently that is needed - I lifted that quote DIRECTLY FROM BLIZZARD. You have countered my source with "nah bro, you are wrong". This is quite embarrassing to be honest.

[ZazuuPriest]

Because they are mentally deficient dicks who doesn't have anything better to do.

its really rude to talk about russians like that. if they dont ruin peoples keys how are they going to keep people buying runs from them and their communist chinese brothers
Infracted;

[Ashleyxoxo]

As sad as it is... there are certain nationalities, i don't play with anymore.
One is the certain eastern one. Becuase it had nothing but bad runs with them. And the other is a western european one. They just don't talk english and expect you to speak their language...

So i just don't invite them period.

Not saying people from my country are holy. We are disliked strongly too as far as i know^^

This isn’t racist at all...

[arkanon]

This isn’t racist at all...

If you genuinely feel it is racism, report the post. The moderators will deal with it.

[VinceVega]

This isn’t racist at all...

Oh it is racist as fuck^^
BUT i don't take it into real live. I actually like both cultures very much and have been there a few times.

Gaming culture differs maybe in different countries? Idk. But my style of play is not compatible with the frist country i mentioned and i don't speak the second ones language. I speak good enough english so i can communicate with most online gamers so i expect them to be able to speak english to. If they don't there is no reason to play together as i have no idea what he is doing and don't know if he knows what i am saying.

[T-34]

All wrong - 100% false and just "nah, you are wrong, they totally wouldn't do that". Let me make this REALLY simple for you, since apparently that is needed - I lifted that quote DIRECTLY FROM BLIZZARD. You have countered my source with "nah bro, you are wrong". This is quite embarrassing to be honest.

In my post I corrected myself that Blizzard acknowledges the term "griefing" after another poster pointed that out. (Before you quoted me).

What I am arguing is:
1. That Blizzard does not want to get involved in what happens in player made groups. The change from master to personal loot is a good example of that.
2. I highly doubt that Blizzard has data on what happens in a mythic+ run, apart from chat, loot and maybe number of deaths, but not how each player moved, what abilities he used etc. How would you expect Blizzard to decide if a report for "toxic play" is true?
3. How should Blizzard distuingish between a genuinely bad or new player and someone who does stupid things on purpose?
4. Rewieving such cases would require a lot of time and time is money and Blizzard sure does like to save on costs.

So to sum up: Blizzard might consider such actions as "griefing", but for the reasons I mention above Blizzard in practise will not do anything about it.

[arkanon]

In my post I corrected myself that Blizzard acknowledges the term "griefing" after another poster pointed that out. (Before you quoted me).

What I am arguing is:
1. That Blizzard does not want to get involved in what happens in player made groups. The change from master to personal loot is a good example of that.
2. I highly doubt that Blizzard has data on what happens in a mythic+ run, apart from chat, loot and maybe number of deaths, but not how each player moved, what abilities he used etc. How would you expect Blizzard to decide if a report for "toxic play" is true?
3. How should Blizzard distuingish between a genuinely bad or new player and someone who does stupid things on purpose?
4. Rewieving such cases would require a lot of time and time is money and Blizzard sure does like to save on costs.

So to sum up: Blizzard might consider such actions as "griefing", but for the reasons I mention above Blizzard in practise will not do anything about it.

And you have provided ZERO evidence to support your opinion. It's just you saying "nope, I am choosing to ignore the agreement I accepted and the proof provided, and instead just fall back on made up nonsense with literally nothing to support it".

[Sughs]

+5 key

wasted my precisou key.

Lol...

Anyway, there's nice people and toxic people in every game, just like in real life. It's frustating but go with friends or just try again, there's plenty of good pugs.

Generalizing is a bad thing but it's usually an indication of some truth. There's 3 countries on the EU servers that I try to avoid and they all have red and white in their flags.

[Sughs]

14 of 27 EU countries have red and white in their flags. You are very picky :P

I know a lot of countries have those colors but I think most people can tell which ones I am talking about. Also, I said "EU servers", not "EU members".

[Grimbold21]

Funny story related to M+ griefing:

I love tanking M+ and have one of all tank classes (except warrior) that I do at least a weekly +15 on. One day I decided to I play one of my lower ilvl/io tank chars that I was trying to gear up. It was early morning and I was trying to get a run in before work. I applied for a +12 FH but the leader declined me even though I had a higher ilvl and io than him. I don’t know why he was so picky since tanks are hard to come by, and it was an off time of day, but for some reason it triggered me.

Out of spite, and since I didn’t have much time left before work anyway, i decided to grief the guy. I logged on to my main and applied to that same group. I was instantly invited and summoned to the instance. As soon as the leader put in the key and we started the run, I pulled all the first few packs using minimal abilities and aoe so that the dps pulled aggro and died. I then left the instance and logged out. I then logged onto my next highest ilvl/io tank and applied to the same group, this time as a +11. I did the same thing as before, killing the guy’s key a second time. I then logged onto one of my other tanks and again applied to the group, now for a +10. By now all the dps were like “man what’s up with all the tanks leaving this morning?” We began the M+ run and I promptly alt f+4’d to close the game.

I don’t know if the leader tried to do his key as a +9, or if the other dps/healer stayed in the group after that. All I know is I felt better about sticking it to an ilvl/io elitist and I chuckled the entire drive to work.

Setting aside the credibility of this story

Newsflash: you would be the villain in that scenario.

[Tyze]

You know what, just laugh at him.

He pays monthly to grief in a game. A real loser

[DeusX]

Because the team of animators and writers and VO director who produce cinematics like Afterlives are totally the same people who design and balance the game.

If I facepalmed any harder, I would break my own nose.

Reading your answer, really, I facepalmed even harder. I don't even know where to start from with my answer, so I'll just leave it at that.