How do I make tanks stop pulling so I can drink?

[kukkamies]

Noes. You have to go at healer’s pace EXACTLY because there’s a timer and you waste more time if there’s a wipe because healer is oom than waiting 10 seconds from time to time to let him get back from 15-20% to 60-70%.

Also if a healer gets constantly oom, assuming he’s not spamming heals with ppl at 100% hps, it means the other 4 are taking TONS of AVOIDABLE damage.

It’s enough to run the same dungeon at the same level 4-5 times in a row to notice it: sometimes you can even dps, sometimes you are oom after 2-3 pulls. Guess why in the second case.

It's of course different with baddies. When they can't play right it spreads to healer and tank needing to accommodate and take slower. As when healer can't play right it spreads to tank and dps needing to wait and take it slower.

[chiddie]

It's of course different with baddies. When they can't play right it spreads to healer and tank needing to accommodate and take slower. As when healer can't play right it spreads to tank and dps needing to wait and take it slower.

It’s mainly part of the rush mechanic that timer unconsciously puts in the players mind. Until they understand that interrupting mechanics and avoid damage is even more important than dpsing, runs will fail. Last week I ran a couple of +3s where we took 1 hour and over 60 deaths to complete them, because ppl completely ignored mobs mechanics focusing only on bringing them down the fastest possible. That it’s ok when you vastly overgear that M+ level but it’s not working when you’re “on par” with that level. Apart from running oom at light speed, we have not a set of magic buttons that bring group’s hps from zero to hero 3-4 times per pull and for the whole party.

[Temp name]

Say you need mana and start drinking.
If they pull, let them pop CD's
If they die, they die.

[Mendzia]

Ask politely in chat... if he won't listen let him die.

[De Maffe]

I hate having to read this thread.

I'm a tank that has his healer on focus, just so I can see their mana bar.

Some healers don't even carry any drinks on them, did you know that?

Anyway, some healers will drink before a boss if they're not even 20% mana.

Some healers, I ask "need MB?" in the same scenario, and they're like "no, I'm good".

Mean while the DPS is saying "ffs pull".

You know what fuck it.

I don't need DPS telling me I'm too slow, and healer telling me I'm too fast.

If you are a healer and you want to drink you can type "I need a mana break".

If the tank isn't stopping, they're not listening, whisper them "I need a mana break".

If he still isn't stopping, then it's on him!

It's basically DPS want to go fast, Healer want to go slower, both blame tank...

[chiddie]

I hate having to read this thread.

I'm a tank that has his healer on focus, just so I can see their mana bar.

Some healers don't even carry any drinks on them, did you know that?

Anyway, some healers will drink before a boss if they're not even 20% mana.

Some healers, I ask "need MB?" in the same scenario, and they're like "no, I'm good".

Mean while the DPS is saying "ffs pull".

You know what fuck it.

I don't need DPS telling me I'm too slow, and healer telling me I'm too fast.

If you are a healer and you want to drink you can type "I need a mana break".

If the tank isn't stopping, they're not listening, whisper them "I need a mana break".

If he still isn't stopping, then it's on him!

It's basically DPS want to go fast, Healer want to go slower, both blame tank...

The speed is entirely dependent on the party. If ppl take no damage, for me you can pull half the dungeon in one go, no prob with that.

[thunderdragon2]

when i tank im probably one of the few bears watching the mana bar if it his 25% i stop unless some1 else has been stupid and pulled if you want to make a tank let u drink just let them die while ur drinking

[schwank05]

Watching Healer Mana is like 3rd on your priority list as a tank
1. Stay alive
2. keep aggro
3. make sure healer has mana

If they are not aware or do not care about that then they are not a good tank and I just let them die.

[Hellobolis]

If you ever played an healer and you have not the QI of a stone, you know that the reason being “you spam too many panic heals” is 90% of times wrong.

I do runs where I don’t drink even once and runs where I struggle from the first pull: why? Because often you have to deal with ppl taking TONS of damage at every pull. Since there’s nothing you can do about that, the only way is “rec”.

sure, sometimes you do need to spam. but the scenario were talking about here is one where the group doesn't notice or care the pull was a struggle and just keeps going on, that's unusual. On low keys you can write it off on bad players sure, but if it happens a lot on higher keys chances are you are the problem not them.

which matches my personal experience: you mostly see these announcer addons in low keys. and on the occasion you see someone who does high keys with it, it's because of their premade not because they have a lot of bad experiences in pugs.

[Blackrunner01]

Would be really interesting for MMO-Champion to include a link to people's raider.io

I'd love to compare the average score of someone replaying: "Just let the tank die, he'll learn" to the score of people actually coming up with reasonable reponses.

You running out of mana should at most be a problem once or twice throughout the dungeon. If that is not the case there's 3 probable reasons.

1: You're overhealing or not using your abilities efficiently.
2: You're undergeared and your abilities don't output enough.
3: The group in general is underperforming and letting an unreasonable amount of damage go through.

If you're not already, ask your tank for the route he is going to do. You'll perform a lot better if you know what pulls he is going to do. It will let you plan cooldowns accordingly and you may even be able to move ahead of the tank, giving you valuable extra time to drink between pulls

[chiddie]

sure, sometimes you do need to spam. but the scenario were talking about here is one where the group doesn't notice or care the pull was a struggle and just keeps going on, that's unusual. On low keys you can write it off on bad players sure, but if it happens a lot on higher keys chances are you are the problem not them.

which matches my personal experience: you mostly see these announcer addons in low keys. and on the occasion you see someone who does high keys with it, it's because of their premade not because they have a lot of bad experiences in pugs.

Yeah, it may seem absurd but the more you do higher keys, the less mana is a huge issue. In part because your ilvl is higher, thus your heals are more effective, in part because ppl (should) know a little more how to play and take less damage.

Mana management of course is part of the challenge but if ppl take loads of damage there’s really not much you can do apart from spamming things like a madman.

[Rinaul]

Say something /let them die. Ez.

[Skorpionss]

I don't know what class you play but as a resto druid with like 200 ilvl I rarely have to drink if people are similar ilvl and don't fail mechanics (too much)... But then again I do have innervate to help me out in a pinch, and convoke the spirits too.

[LanToaster]

My WeakAura says "Healer low on mana, drinking after this pull". It automatically posts that to party chat when I drop below 30% mana.

This is Probably the problem. I learned to Ignore Automated stuff like that.
In 90% of the time its not intentional, and you wait for nothing.

I can Imagine a quick "Mana" would be much more efficient.

Sadly, Blizzard decided that Mistweaver should be the only healer with severe mana issues, so there's not much I can do.

This could also be the Problem, while I usually, never ever PuG Mythic+.
My Healer almost never needs a Mana Break, and if he does I can manage the 5-10 seconds on my own.

But as most people said: If the Tank pulls, and dies because the Healer sat down to take a sip, its the Tanks own damn fault, and they only learn that when they die.

[Rozz]

Let them die.

That's what I do, I just sit down to drink and watch them slowly get crushed by mobs they pulled without even considering how your mana is.

I've had tanks pull boss at 15% mana....

Main correct answer. Your tank needs situational awareness more than "right spec, kite kite kite, breathe to fight". I also refuse to waste CDs on jackasses pulling more than they can handle without using their own mitigation abilities. My own abilities/CDS aren't there so you can ignore half your rotation.

[schwank05]

not all tanks will flop over as soon as the healer isn't there... i would say if you need the healer to be there constantly as a tank or you die... then you are playing wrong... i have been tanking on my druid lately... even if the healer isn't there for a pack i can still keep myself alive... they could sit and drink full 20 seconds and i still wouldn't die... incarnation giving +30% hp, pushes my frenzied regen to 8 sec cd... then i have barkskin legendary...

You are playing a tank that does not need heals, if you get stuck with a Dk you need to babysit them 24/7.

[chiddie]

You are playing a tank that does not need heals, if you get stuck with a Dk you need to babysit them 24/7.

Yeh, Blood DKs have really a tough life, maybe I had only bad luck but never timed a key with one of them so far.

[schwank05]

Yeh, Blood DKs have really a tough life, maybe I had only bad luck but never timed a key with one of them so far.

Naw, they are shit tier right now. Honestly Blood Tanks have sucked since Cata ended the stacking bubble was not only fun to play but was actually good, now you have to wait to get your ass kicked before you can start to even be a shitty tank and after that you are a slightly less shitty tank. I will not run with a Blood DK or Prot Warrior. Druids, Monks, DH are the easiest to heal right now IMO, pallys are good, but can cause a lot of unnecessary over healing.

[chiddie]

Naw, they are shit tier right now. Honestly Blood Tanks have sucked since Cata ended the stacking bubble was not only fun to play but was actually good, now you have to wait to get your ass kicked before you can start to even be a shitty tank and after that you are a slightly less shitty tank. I will not run with a Blood DK or Prot Warrior. Druids, Monks, DH are the easiest to heal right now IMO, pallys are good, but can cause a lot of unnecessary over healing.

I didn’t get particular issues with any class till now, including prot warriors, but DK. They fell in a really bad state, I used to tank with a BDK in BfA S2-3 and it was not bad at all.

Monks I cannot say, I only met one as of now and run went bananas before first boss but mainly because he was severely undergeared (168 for a +3 is maybe pretending too much regardless the class).

[clevin]

A lot of it is how you are playing / actions taken that could be rectified on a personal level instead of relying on the tank to stop and wait constantly. With that said, there are still times the tank could stop and let you get more mana, but a lot of it is personal reliance. Being at 30% mana is enough for several pulls so having a Weak Aura spam that isn't doing much good and if tanks / group notices that is when it auto hits will start to ignore it. Now if you were dropping to say 10% or something it'd be a bit different.

Overall you are doing group content and each player has personal responsibilities they must perform for the group. A healer's responsibility is making sure they keep the group up, managing mana responsibly and not slowing down the group. While you don't mention downtime in your post the assumption can be made based on your posts that you are having constant downtime otherwise this wouldn't be an issue. If it was something that happened once or twice the group would be fine as tanks have cooldowns and the group can use whatever stuns / slows they have. Some tanks will even see your mana is low an intentionally do a small pull so you can catch up.

THis, precisely. But now OP will tell you that it's not their fault and you've misinterpreted them and why are 9/10 tanks shit!?. Of course if they continually have mana issues it might be them. But...