Mega-Thread: 2020 United States General Election

[Lynarii]

"If I don't like your ideas, no one should."

You get angry if someone calls you a facist, but you're very quick to defend the importance of making sure things like racism, anti-semitism, and facism are enshrined in politics. If you are going to argue that those views are a valuable part of American politics, you should be willing to own up to the label put on people who espouse such views.

"Conservatives must fit the mold I set for them"????

The problem here is that none of the things Felya mentioned were a mold that any of us set for Conservatives. It's one that the conservatives themselves built and embraced of their own free will. Speaking for myself, I would be more than happy for conservatives to move away from those stated beliefs, because I believe that sane conservatism has an important place in politics.

If each party has a significant moderate wing, everyone would have a voice at the table.

Only if you view everything as a binary left/right, which is highly inaccurate. Many people have very different views on social policies than they do on financial ones, and don't want a desire to balance a budget to be inextricably tied to banning abortion (as an example). A two party oppositional system forcibly ties too many unrelated issues together, and allows both parties to run on platforms of "We aren't the other party" rather than having meaningful competition on policy ideas.

Because those who do not support the liberal ideas of the Democrats should have no power to block it until its too late?

It's really funny how it's all "We won, we have a mandate for our policies, get over it" when the Republicans win, but if the Democrats win it's suddenly "The minority party needs the power to block". Conservative voters already have their voices weighted higher, when even that isn't enough to win you should be asking yourself why some of those views are so disliked, not 'how can we unbalance things even heavier to force them through'.

[Felya]

"Conservatives must fit the mold I set for them"????

By asking you what makes a conservative? WTF?

How does social media know they are conservatives? What conservative things are they saying, that makes them banned?

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"If you are a conservative you have to be a bigot." is a rather wide brush.

Narrow it down... You are the one suggesting conservatives are getting canceled...

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Good thing I didn't say that, put the strawman away. I'm saying that yes, it is in fact okay to set a mold for people if that mold is "don't be a bigot" - and modern conservatives are by and large failing that bare minimum since a lot of them buy into an ideology that is based on fundamentally bigoted worldviews.

I called it:

Can we just get to the natural conclusion that conservatives are fake?

[Thepersona]

"If I don't like your ideas, no one should."

If said ideas are homophobic/racist/sexist/not based on reality and it results on policies that are detrimental to humanity and our biosphere, then no. No one should hear them.

[Felya]

If said ideas are homophobic/racist/sexist/not based on reality and it results on policies that are detrimental to humanity and our biosphere, then no. No one should hear them.

That’s the mistake NAMBLA made... they should have argued they are conservatives.

[Thepersona]

That’s the mistake NAMBLA made... they should have argued they are conservatives.

I... just had to search what NAMBLA stands for. I had a laugh. Thank you for that.

[Machismo]

That may be correct, if your opinion on what is the best for the country was a fact. It is also presumptuous to think the Dems would not shift left when they are not under pressure to reach the middle.

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"If you are a conservative you have to be a bigot." is a rather wide brush.

Well, considering how many fake conservatives abandoned conservatism in favor of bigotry... that seems like a choice they willingly made.

[Breccia]

I... just had to search what NAMBLA stands for. I had a laugh.

Indeed, the North American Marlon Brando Look-Alikes aren't as numerous as they used to be.

By the way, the Senate spent all day in law enforcement hearings being told how the murderous insurrection was "coordinated".

Or, there were people bringing climbing gear to a peaceful rally because...uh...of all that famous rock climbing in downtown DC?

[Endus]

"If you are a conservative you have to be a bigot." is a rather wide brush.

Here's the problem; most Republican talking points boil down to some form of petty bigotry. Those that don't are either truisms that literally everyone agrees with and thus aren't actually political stances (fiscal efficiency), or are baseless conspiracy theories. Lies, in other words.

And to be clear; I mean "Republicans", not "conservatives". There's a lot of conservatives among Democrats, for instance. The Conservative Party of Canada used to be fine, though they're falling more under the spell of the Republican-lite Reform types more than the solid Progressive Conservative types lately.

If you hold views that are rooted in bigotry, those views are indefensible and you should be publicly maligned and shamed for holding them, should you dare express them. If your political outlook cannot survive in that kind of environment, your political outlook is nakedly abusive and demeaning and inhumane, and deserves as much support and consideration as others of its ilk, like Nazism. In short, less than none. It should be actively worked against by all thinking, decent people.

If you think that's a problem for "conservatives", you're exposing that what you're actually defending isn't "conservativism", it's fascism and bigotry and so forth.

There's room for people to be conservative without being bigots. It's not even hard. But every time you start opposing Mexican and South American immigration while keeping your mouth shut about European immigration, you're being a bigot. Every time you oppose transgender protections and health care support, you're being a bigot. Every time you push voter ID laws without also ensuring every citizen gets free voter ID with minimal fuss, you're being a bigot. Every time you push for defunding social support programs that proportionally benefit people of color, you're being a bigot. And so on.

That's not "because those views are conservative". It's because those views target the disadvantaged for abuse and mistreatment, for no justifiable reason other than petty brutality and hatred. There is no value to those views. If your political theory can't exist without bigotry, you don't have political theory. You just have empty, petty bigotries.

[Bodakane]

"If you are a conservative you have to be a bigot." is a rather wide brush.

The narrower the mind, the broader the brush needed to paint it.

[Kellhound]

The narrower the mind, the broader the brush needed to paint it.

Then you are painted with a wide brush.

[Bodakane]

Then you are painted with a wide brush.

Yes. That was the point of what I said.

Please explain the nuance we should be applying to the situation. What Trump policy/talking point was not bigoted?

[Felya]

Then you are painted with a wide brush.

You are arguing that violating social media TOS, is a conservative identifier. You do realize that?

[Breccia]

Our second-favorite lawyer lets us know that, while our backs were turned, SCOTUS denied all remaining lawsuits releated to the election.

We'd discussed one or two, the Pennsylvania case specifically, but just in case you were wondering, any remaining flecks of dust have been swept under the rug.

[gondrin]

Indeed, the North American Marlon Brando Look-Alikes aren't as numerous as they used to be.

By the way, the Senate spent all day in law enforcement hearings being told how the murderous insurrection was "coordinated".

Or, there were people bringing climbing gear to a peaceful rally because...uh...of all that famous rock climbing in downtown DC?

Yep, you have to climb the tallest peak in DC, the Washington Monument. You haven't lived until you get to the top.

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Our second-favorite lawyer lets us know that, while our backs were turned, SCOTUS denied all remaining lawsuits releated to the election.

We'd discussed one or two, the Pennsylvania case specifically, but just in case you were wondering, any remaining flecks of dust have been swept under the rug.

And just like that, the Kraken became a Scooby Doo villain, its mask was removed and it turned out to be a crackhead instead.

[D3thray]

If said ideas are homophobic/racist/sexist/not based on reality and it results on policies that are detrimental to humanity and our biosphere, then no. No one should hear them.

Best argument against the Democratic platform I’ve heard in a long time.

[Poopymonster]

Yep, you have to climb the tallest peak in DC, the Washington Monument. You haven't lived until you get to the top.

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And just like that, the Kraken became a Scooby Doo villain, its mask was removed and it turned out to be a crackhead instead.

The villains tended to be older white males. I believe most times with money.

[Shadowferal]

Best argument against the Democratic platform I’ve heard in a long time.

Name those policies that are "homophobic/racist/sexist/not based on reality" that "results on policies that are detrimental to humanity and our biosphere" please.

[gondrin]

The villains tended to be older white males. I believe most times with money.

Well, the I guess they just proved that Trump was the villain all along.

[Thepersona]

Best argument against the Democratic platform I’ve heard in a long time.

Please explain. Because i can only recall one major political party in the western world that still denies AGW, and is the one with the evil turtle at the helm of the minority on the senate

[Breccia]

So let's talk about Richard Michettii.

"He's fucked?"

Quite the opposite. He texted his soon-to-be ex-girlfriend pics of himself breaking into the Capitol. She dumped him and turned him into the cops within 24 hours.