This is World of Warcraft - Carbot new video

[Kralljin]

But I don't know that I'm convinced the majority of the playerbase that is against boosts are against the fact that they are paid for.

Let's put it that way, i think the majority of arguments against the boost would still be true without the monetary aspect, but intent of Blizzard would be vastly different.

At end of the day, the value of the leveling aspect is subjective, i'm not going to convince a person that doesn't like leveling that it's important or good, neither are they going to convince me that skipping the leveling process is a net positive for everybody (emphasis on everybody).

But those are design / philosophical opinions, the second however a person has a monetary interest in an option, the dynamic of the discussion becomes vastly different.
A lot of people straight up said that "everybody who dislikes the levelboost is a mage booster who sees their lost profit", essentially stating that they're solely against the boost because it reduces their customerbase.
(A terrible argument by the way, those booster mages made a fortune due to 2 week pre patch).

This is the same story here, does Blizzard believe the "superior" way to experience TBC is straight up skipping to Outland or are they offering the option because they can sell it at 2/3 of the price of a AAA game?

If they believe it's superior option..why not give to everybody?
Why is there an additional paywall?

It's not because they need the revenue to finance the development, don't give me that BS, Classic launched without additional monetization and completely surprised them, TBC was far smaller in scope (Blizzards word, not mine) than Classic and certainly did not cost more to develop on Blizzards end.
Neither is it about character copies of Classic servers, that's a completely seperate service, which isn't even included in the deluxe edition.

It is such a vastly different situation when somebody makes in a subjective debate a given choice when it's clear that they can and will monetize that option.

There's a lot of animosity towards people with boosted characters and the mounts when really that should be aimed at Blizzard and Blizzard alone.

I don't disagree, but the reality is also that those services would not exist without people engaging in them.

I don't hold it against people on a personal level, but i view them as part of the problem and frankly the way this works is that people that do not like MTX their games either have to deal with it or get pushed out, because players that engage in MTX are more valueable to companies than those that don't.

[Akka]

I mean clearly if classic / tbc was so much better than retail then it would have more than 5m+ active players, just like back in the day?

Also people took breaks from classic, not sure where you get the idea that people didn't.

WTF does this has to do with my point ?
Do you even understand what you are reading ?

[Eapoe]

If you can’t see how mtxs is a cancer to videogames and how it can affect games as a whole, we have nothing to talk about.

Gamer friendly is buying a game and experiencing all the content it has to offer without spending more additional money. That includes cosmetics.

In your logic, Witcher 3 was not gamer friendly if CDPR released ALL additional content, including new costumes, for free. Is that right?

That’s not what the other person was stating at all. The difference is that person has a voice. He can earn things in game playing your way, or if he doesn’t have time to unlock everything but wants to enjoy the aesthetic of specific outfits without having to play thru 1-3 times to unlock them.
For instance, I didn’t mind grinding out Mercenaries mode and multiple playthroughs of RE:Village because I enjoyed the game very much and have the time to invest. Some people might not have those luxuries and would also like to have some of the same perks. (RE8 doesn’t have mtx that I know of, I just used this as my example)
MTXs that are actual cancerous to games are those that EA came under fire for. The ones that require you to purchase to be able to play the single player or multiplayer campaign That should have come with the launch. Or having access to specific characters that aren’t just reskins. Those are the ones consumers need to be wary of. Not the ones people can use to not have to level their 4th alt, or used to combat gold sellers (which breaks rules and requires a company to potentially spend hundreds of thousands of dollars on hiring employees to try and manage complaints and investigations to claims of them), or those that give cosmetics that don’t influence player power at all, or even those that lets anew player skip all the leveling in general if they want to dive into endgame solo or with friends.

[Okacz]

Its easy to force people to play through Vanilla to get to TBC.. When you liked Vanilla.

People forget that just because you want to replay TBC it doesnt mean you want to play through Vanilla.

"But thats how it was back then, you play through one to play through the next"

Yes but it isn't back then.

I'd even one up this. When OG TBC released, most players already had at least a single level 60 character. That was the norm, not something to brag about. Therefore, for most players the initial TBC experience looked like:

1) Log in
2) Go through Dark Portal

If TBC Classic is supposed to be the slice-of-game to get people to relive the awesomeness of TBC exclusively, leveling a new character for someone who wants to go back to this expansion only makes no sense. He'd rather go back to how it used to be when TBC launched - capped character ready, let's go. And yeah, I know 2 people who wouldn't even look at TBC classic if not for the option to boost character - people who have leveled to 60 in vanilla back in the days, and proceeded to TBC.

Putting a price tag on that tho is iffy. Same with the mount. I know it's just a "visual", but seeing those mounts in BC feels so out of place.

[ek0zu]

I bought Startcraft I, the remastered package just to get his skins, which are awesome!

On topic, i cried a little, i could relate 100%.

[Mahcake]

I'd even one up this. When OG TBC released, most players already had at least a single level 60 character. That was the norm, not something to brag about. Therefore, for most players the initial TBC experience looked like:

1) Log in
2) Go through Dark Portal

If TBC Classic is supposed to be the slice-of-game to get people to relive the awesomeness of TBC exclusively, leveling a new character for someone who wants to go back to this expansion only makes no sense. He'd rather go back to how it used to be when TBC launched - capped character ready, let's go. And yeah, I know 2 people who wouldn't even look at TBC classic if not for the option to boost character - people who have leveled to 60 in vanilla back in the days, and proceeded to TBC.

Putting a price tag on that tho is iffy. Same with the mount. I know it's just a "visual", but seeing those mounts in BC feels so out of place.

Again, that doesn’t make any sense.

Leveling from 1-60 was PART of that awesomeness you’re talking about. Sure, they went into Dark Portal with their 60 lvl character but they already had a long adventure and memories with that character, which were able to be obtained only through leveling in Azeroth.

Boosted character can’t replicate that same feeling and attachment which they had and played big part of the game.

Sure, not everyone feels that way but that doesn’t mean it’s not true. It is and it’s their problem if they don’t see it.

[Okacz]

Again, that doesn’t make any sense.

Leveling from 1-60 was PART of that awesomeness you’re talking about. Sure, they went into Dark Portal with their 60 lvl character but they already had a long adventure and memories with that character, which were able to be obtained only through leveling in Azeroth.

Boosted character can’t replicate that same feeling and attachment which they had and played big part of the game.

Sure, not everyone feels that way but that doesn’t mean it’s not true. It is and it’s their problem if they don’t see it.

Well, not every player agrees here. Vanilla was the era where leveling was a big part of the experience, TBC was expansion for the ones that already capped. Many people vastly prefer TBC and didn't care much for Classic Vanilla releasing, cause all of their good memories are from TBC. I don't see why giving them the option to go back to the exact slice of the game they enjoy the most is a bad idea. Especially since for many of them having to go 1-60 would be a chore - not something they would wanna play TBC for.

[Ector]

Sure, they went into Dark Portal with their 60 lvl character but they already had a long adventure and memories with that character, which were able to be obtained only through leveling in Azeroth. Boosted character can’t replicate that same feeling and attachment which they had and played big part of the game.

maybe, in the case of a returning player... they could. If they played back in the day, but just didnt come back during classic. perhaps not the SAME feeling, but not one that should be discredited either, imho.

[Prag]

Again, that doesn’t make any sense.

Leveling from 1-60 was PART of that awesomeness you’re talking about. Sure, they went into Dark Portal with their 60 lvl character but they already had a long adventure and memories with that character, which were able to be obtained only through leveling in Azeroth.

Boosted character can’t replicate that same feeling and attachment which they had and played big part of the game.

Sure, not everyone feels that way but that doesn’t mean it’s not true. It is and it’s their problem if they don’t see it.

What you’re not grasping or accepting is the fact that this isn’t most people’s first time, and the industry/genre overall aren’t able to attract large swaths of new/returning players with a re-play.

“Come subscribe for TBC:Classic, and enjoy re-living the content after spending approx 120 hours in last expansion’s content.”

On principal, sure, it’s a romantic tale to believe everyone should want to make that investment. In reality, it’s not the same attraction it once was.

All that’s setting aside the fact that everyone I know who boosted did so for an alt. They were either going to pay for a dungeon boost or a shop one.

[Orange Joe]

Do you know what the number that represents your level indicates? Progression. Purely objective here.

The VALUE of that progression is purely SUBJECTIVE.

[Clozer]

The VALUE of that progression is purely SUBJECTIVE.

Yes, but as long it has any - it proves the point.. And it clearly has value, else not so many would boost.

[Orange Joe]

Yes, but as long it has any - it proves the point.. And it clearly has value, else not so many would boost.

Your progression and how you achieve it means absolutely nothing to me. I could care less if you knew a blizz gm and paid a penny to get a max char. That has 0, literally 0 effect on how I play the game.

[deenman]

I really wonder how anyone can still dare to spout the retarded "nostalgia" bullshit.
It was already a completely idiotic argument years ago. But now after two years of uninterrupted play by a very large audience... WTF ?

People have played the game for two years in a row and we're still down with the "hurr durr it's nostalgia durrrrr" ? Hello, what dimension is this ?

huh?i really dont see the logic in this response...where does it say that playing a game for nostalgia means you dont play it for 2 years?

[Asrialol]

By that same logic, I can say that retail would have 5m+ players too if it were good as before, right?

Absolutely.

People here seem to think that players can only quit wow if the game itself is bad, or another game is better. No other reasons. It's a bit strange..

[Clozer]

Your progression and how you achieve it means absolutely nothing to me. I could care less if you knew a blizz gm and paid a penny to get a max char. That has 0, literally 0 effect on how I play the game.

See, your personal feelings have nothing to do with the fact that boosts devalue character progression.

- - - Updated - - -

Absolutely.

People here seem to think that players can only quit wow if the game itself is bad, or another game is better. No other reasons. It's a bit strange..

True people quit wow because they enjoy it so much and think it's awesome.

[arkanon]

True people quit wow because they enjoy it so much and think it's awesome.

No, but there are countless other reasons that are not related to the game:

Work
Deployment / mandatory service
Family
A loss of interest in gaming in general

In fact, MOST people i personally know who have stopped playing wow have never once said "i dont like the game" or anything of the sort, they just moved on with their life and focus on other things like family, work, health, fitness, other hobbies.

[Clozer]

No, but there are countless other reasons that are not related to the game:

Work
Deployment / mandatory service
Family
A loss of interest in gaming in general

In fact, MOST people i personally know who have stopped playing wow have never once said "i dont like the game" or anything of the sort, they just moved on with their life and focus on other things like family, work, health, fitness, other hobbies.

Yep, because as soon as you have family your life is over and you can no longer do things you enjoy. This mindset.

[Bladesyphon]

I'm kind of split on how I feel about this video. On the one hand, I think the message is really, really impactful and important - That you can never go home again. Those feelings that those of us that have been with the game since launch when we first logged into the game are *never* going to be replaceable. For me it wasn't as impactful as, say, when I first logged into Final Fantasy XI, and first heard that Bastok music play (which still makes me melt with Nostalgia to this day, to say nothing about Gustaberg), but I still do have some really strong, nostalgic feelings about WoW as well.

And I also know those feelings are never coming back, even when I played Classic it just didn't feel the same, because that part of my life is over. Rushing home from highschool to play WoW, looking forward to raiding on the weekends, all that fun stuff that was both part of WoW, as well as part of my life at the time, are gone, and all I can do is look back fondly at it all and smile. It's an important message that the video gives the viewer - Those memories are an important part of our lives, but we can't replace them, even with something like WoW Classic, and sometimes, it's better to let go, than try to force yourself to try to relive those memories, or worst, replace them with memories you think are better.

On the other hand, the blatant use of "Hurr Activision Blizzard boosts everything's awful now OHMERGERD" was just stupid. Yes, WoW is much more streamlined and modernized today compared to what it was nearly twenty years ago, but to try to make it out like anyone who plays the game now are just drooling idiots who want instant gratification is insulting both to the playerbase whose genuinely having fun with it still, and really any new generation gamer in general. While I do agree, fully, that this generation of gamers is WAY too overly sensitive about shit, I don't for a moment think they're a bunch of casual non-gamers who want to just click buttons and get pretty things to pop up on their screen.

The video just feels like it took a really important, heartfelt message, and shat all over it in the last minute of it to push the generic "Retail WoW is terrible, ACtivision-Blizzard are monsters, REEE" message that so many Youtubers vomit out to get revenue.

[Prag]

Yep, because as soon as you have family your life is over and you can no longer do things you enjoy. This mindset.

Because it’s a video game and if you’re used to sitting down for long play sessions, a baby’s going to almost literally shit on that plan.

Also, why would you infer from their post that you couldn’t do things you enjoy?

[arkanon]

Yep, because as soon as you have family your life is over and you can no longer do things you enjoy. This mindset.

That is called a Strawman argument - i never once said "as soon as you have family your life is over" - not once. I also never said it was ONLY that factor. What i said is that there are countless not game related reasons a person might stop playing wow, without the game itself, or the quality of it, factoring in at all. Use all the emojis you want, it wont change the facts that A) you intentionally misrepresented my argument, turning it into an entirely new argument so you could defeat it easily (a strawman) and B) You honed in on ONE of the reasons i gave while ignoring the others. Im guessing this is because you found them a little too hard to dismiss, so you just edited them out.