[BETA] Destruction Warlock Discussion

[Roujeaux]

Destruction is looking more like a victim of chaos currently than a master of it.

[Felpacino]

What's the nerf?

Burning Rush's tooltip on both wowhead and MMOC is the same for both Legion and Live. What changed?

In live, it damages our %4 of max hp, in Legion it deals %5 of max hp.

[sugarfree]

In live, it damages our %4 of max hp, in Legion it deals %5 of max hp.

LMAO, as if the talent wasn't useless enough than walking from the bank to your mail much faster.

On top of that, it is NOT even going to compete with the two other talents in this row. When they did their unnecessary pruning, somehow this trash survived.

[Sylar Hao]

Destruction is looking more like a victim of chaos currently than a master of it.

I gotta agree on this.

- Our mastery is completely random. It evens out over a long fight, but in a PvP scenario where things happen so fast, a difference of +1% Chaos Bolt vs. a +40% Chaos bolt is a big deal... It's gonna be really awkward if for example you cast a 1% Chaos Bolt and then you cast a 40% Incinerate and it deals about or more damage than Chaos Bolt.
- Immolate has a 15% chance to grant a Soul Shard. The chance is doubled if it crits.

- Grimoire of Sacrifice has a chance (unknown %?) to cause extra shadow damage when you deal damage with spells.
- Soul Conduit gives a 30% chance to restore a Soul Shard when consumed.

- Dimensional Rift summons a random portal, each dealing different amount of total damage to your target.
--- Dimensional Ripper causes Incinerate to have a 15% chance to reduce the cooldown on Dimensional Rift.
- Soulsnatcher causes Chaos Bolt to have a 15% chance to refund 1 Soul Shard.
- Devourer or Life gives Drain Life a 45% chance to increase its damage and healing by 45%.
- Conflagration of Chaos gives Conflagration a % chance to cause the next Conflagrate critical strike with increased damage throught critical strike chance.

Add to that
- Magistrike Restraint (legendary): Chaos bolt has a 35% chance to bounce to a secondary target.
- Another legendary: Casting fire spells has a chance to restore a Soul Shard.

And probably tier sets will be also RNG... this is just overkill.

And the worst is that this RNG forces you to react in order to not cap your soul shards. It's cool to be able to cast Chaos Bolt so often, but this is just way too much RNG.

---
I'm gonna miss Burning Embers so much...

[Maleific]

Part of me just wants them to change sac > synergy and just be done with it.

Would also like it if spell lock was baseline.

[gez]

Part of me just wants them to change sac > synergy and just be done with it.

Would also like it if spell lock was baseline.

no, i hate playing with pets, pets are way to squishy now days they are not durable they die with nothing, its better for then to fucking revert sac pac to what it was

[Gnarilex]

how would GoSac work with the artifact trait that buffs the imp's damage?

[Gaidax]

no, i hate playing with pets, pets are way to squishy now days they are not durable they die with nothing, its better for then to fucking revert sac pac to what it was

In Legion your demon minion has much more hp, about half your HP and Soul Leech too.

[Uzkin]

how would GoSac work with the artifact trait that buffs the imp's damage?

The artifact trait should be changed to apply to GoSac, Doomguard, and Infernal as well, in addition to the Imp. Or removed altogether and replaced by some other trait. "Undo all the Legion changes" -trait would be nice.

[Gaidax]

how would GoSac work with the artifact trait that buffs the imp's damage?

Probably the same way they do for mage, where the talent will buff the sac ability instead by 15%

[Tramzh]

I'm very disappointed how the specs damage is so focused around RNG and your pet.
The main offenders to the RNG is the CB regen trait combined with the talent Soul Conduit talent that either makes you spam chaos bolts or flick incinerates forever depending on your luck on top of the mastery.
The spec is overall too heavy on pet damage assuming you run the "forced" imp pet combined with GoServ. Destro, in my eyes shouldn't be seeing 25%+ pet damage. GoSac is overall a big let down.

The standard play style of the spec is still there and seems to be alright, although not as good as the 5.0 through 6.2 one, the major problem is that the spec was previously minimally reliant on RNG and it has now taken a complete 180 being one of the, if not the most RNG reliant spec in the game.

I can also see multiple "trap" talents, almost as many as 1 or more per talent row, the grimoire row in particular has had complaints for years now and the effort put into changing it is minimal. Channel Demonfire has absolutely 0 synergy with anything else in the kit, Roaring Blaze just completely shits on the entire idea of Pandemic dots that was previously a warlock only ability. Reverse Entropy and Mana Tap synergizes very well, but guess what? They are on the same row. Come on Blizzard get your shit together.

[Turturin the Warlock]

I'm very disappointed how the specs damage is so focused around RNG and your pet.
The main offenders to the RNG is the CB regen trait combined with the talent Soul Conduit talent that either makes you spam chaos bolts or flick incinerates forever depending on your luck on top of the mastery.
The spec is overall too heavy on pet damage assuming you run the "forced" imp pet combined with GoServ. Destro, in my eyes shouldn't be seeing 25%+ pet damage. GoSac is overall a big let down.

The standard play style of the spec is still there and seems to be alright, although not as good as the 5.0 through 6.2 one, the major problem is that the spec was previously minimally reliant on RNG and it has now taken a complete 180 being one of the, if not the most RNG reliant spec in the game.

I can also see multiple "trap" talents, almost as many as 1 or more per talent row, the grimoire row in particular has had complaints for years now and the effort put into changing it is minimal. Channel Demonfire has absolutely 0 synergy with anything else in the kit, Roaring Blaze just completely shits on the entire idea of Pandemic dots that was previously a warlock only ability. Reverse Entropy and Mana Tap synergizes very well, but guess what? They are on the same row. Come on Blizzard get your shit together.

A 45% (or more with relics) chance to refund a shard used by CB is not all that random. Profs with a low percent chance feel more random due to higher expected variance over a short time period. As the procchance gets higher this isn't a problem. Fire mages gear scaling impact on hot streak is an excellent example of this : feel weak at bad at low gear level and proc chance, feel strong and pretty consistent at higher proc chance.

[Roujeaux]

In live, it damages our %4 of max hp, in Legion it deals %5 of max hp.

They tested 5% in the MoP beta and the value proved too high, which is why they lowered it to 4% in the first place. I wonder if it's because of synergy with the new Demon Skin talent? Which is stupid if it is.

[Tabrotar]

As someone already mentioned in the alpha/beta-forums it´s retarted to let a spec only work with teir-set bonus and/or artefact traits. It should never even be considered to balance a spec/playstyle arround something like that.

[Roujeaux]

Part of me just wants them to change sac > synergy and just be done with it.

Would also like it if spell lock was baseline.

I'd like the GoSyn buff but keep the sac'ing of the pet for one of its abilities the same.

[Gaidax]

I'm very disappointed how the specs damage is so focused around RNG and your pet.
The main offenders to the RNG is the CB regen trait combined with the talent Soul Conduit talent that either makes you spam chaos bolts or flick incinerates forever depending on your luck on top of the mastery.

Well, from what I see on alpha, there is so much RNG that there is actually a pretty high chance of something you want happening anyway - either more shards gained, or fat Chaos Bolt or shards refunded. It works out pretty well and at least in PvE over an encounter duration, it will pretty surely smooth out.

Basically it so RNG that at some point it is no longer really RNG...

[Kirroth]

Basically it so RNG that at some point it is no longer really RNG...

You could also say it doesn't put all its eggs in one basket. A spec dependent on a single proc lives and dies by the RNG. A spec with six different potential procs where you're almost always getting something good happening will have a more reliable output with a more chaotic rotation. Which is probably exactly the intent.

Right now I'm leaning Demo because a chaotic rotation takes more attention, attention I often can't spare, but it does look kind of fun.

[Tramzh]

I'm sorry but I don't find it "chaotic" at all, either you get to cast chaos bolt or you don't, there is no "reacting" by pressing a certain button whenever you get a proc similar to ret paladin. Sure you get same results over a bigger number of parses but consistency from try to try is very important on cutting edge raiding.

[Gaidax]

I'm sorry but I don't find it "chaotic" at all, either you get to cast chaos bolt or you don't, there is no "reacting" by pressing a certain button whenever you get a proc similar to ret paladin. Sure you get same results over a bigger number of parses but consistency from try to try is very important on cutting edge raiding.

But the point is that it's not black and white, you get to cast chaos bolt for sure in any case, unless literally the impossible happens and all your multiple ways of getting or retaining shards fail, that's the point.

As for consistency, having inconsistent RNG spikes did not really make such classes as mages obsolete with their Doom Nova. If you are eventually consistent, then it's fine really.

[Xandy]

The problem for a lot of us I think is that while it may end up being tuned just fine (and probably will) it just doesn't feel very fun.