[7.0] New Paladin Abilities and Talents

[Sandraudiga]

Cept it isn't Colossus Smash? "shrugs"

If you mean it's like colossus smash because it's a attack and it boosts the damage of another attack...than that means Windwalker's new mastery is one big colossus smash...Bolderfist...it improves damage so that is just another colossus smash clone...enrage increases damage of abilities...so it must be a colossus smash clone too! So everything that boosts damage of other things are just all colossus smash clones I guess?

Both abilities increase damage done during the debuff, with the mastery affecting the bonus provided. It is an exact copy, with the only difference being with arms it is all damage and us it is only spenders.

[Ciric-Wildhammer]

Blizzard has been mostly silent, not super active. I wonder what's going on.

They are playing overwatch and goofing off. I am sure they will tune dmg numbers later and live will roll out about how it is now. Ret will get nerfed again after season 1 pvp and stuck down in the middle of the pack dps and unwanted in RBGs and progression raids.

[Aeluron Lightsong]

They are playing overwatch and goofing off. I am sure they will tune dmg numbers later and live will roll out about how it is now. Ret will get nerfed again after season 1 pvp and stuck down in the middle of the pack dps and unwanted in RBGs and progression raids.

That's not even a realistic scenario. Cynical as it may be.

[Ciric-Wildhammer]

Cept it isn't Colossus Smash? "shrugs"

If you mean it's like colossus smash because it's a attack and it boosts the damage of another attack...than that means Windwalker's new mastery is one big colossus smash...Bolderfist...it improves damage so that is just another colossus smash clone...enrage increases damage of abilities...so it must be a colossus smash clone too! So everything that boosts damage of other things are just all colossus smash clones I guess?

What are you trying to say? Re-evaluate that guess.

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That's not even a realistic scenario. Cynical as it may be.

I know but, it sure feels that way.

[Aeluron Lightsong]

It's not unwarranted though(Your skepticism).

[Ulthane]

http://us.battle.net/wow/en/forum/to...21?page=14#274

Went ham

[Temna]

http://us.battle.net/wow/en/forum/to...21?page=14#274

Went ham

Was an interesting read between deaths, still have some reservations about the numbers and names but a good piece.

[ruiizu]

http://us.battle.net/wow/en/forum/to...21?page=14#274

Went ham

Holy hell that was quite a post. As only Ulthane could. I know it's probably more feedback than Blizzard is interested in at this point, but I'm not sad you posted it. If nothing else it shows there is discontent with their changes.

[Taeldorian]

@Ulthane Your compilation on the alpha forums of everything we've said here gives me a giant nerd boner. Good shit man, felt great to read all of that. Hopefully they really see some of those ideas and decide to incorporate them in some way. Good work dude.

[Ciric-Wildhammer]

I hope the felt every ounce of discord from that page of words

[Ulthane]

Thanks honestly you all need a voice here, we all do. FFS its our class, its our spec and we damn well want it to work.

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Was an interesting read between deaths, still have some reservations about the numbers and names but a good piece.

The numbers can be tweaked but its acceptable for those numbers and the reason is many things.

Sword of Light is 5%
No more raid buffs
Most trinkets wont have Str on it
Rings and Neck wont have Str on it

As it is... it hits like a wet noodle and its sad :<

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@Ulthane Your compilation on the alpha forums of everything we've said here gives me a giant nerd boner. Good shit man, felt great to read all of that. Hopefully they really see some of those ideas and decide to incorporate them in some way. Good work dude.

Me as well, did all I could to compile what has been said.

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Holy hell that was quite a post. As only Ulthane could. I know it's probably more feedback than Blizzard is interested in at this point, but I'm not sad you posted it. If nothing else it shows there is discontent with their changes.

Considering it's a feedback forum I hope they read it.

[Temna]

@Ulthane Its more I still have reservations about flipping things from one damage type to another, I personally feel as if those kinds of damage swaps need to carry a bit more weight attached to them. Thats just my personal thought on the design, seldom more then that.

[Ulthane]

@Ulthane Its more I still have reservations about flipping things from one damage type to another, I personally feel as if those kinds of damage swaps need to carry a bit more weight attached to them. Thats just my personal thought on the design, seldom more then that.

The fact it adds a cleave mechanic makes it the middle ground.

Fires of Justice: Physical damage, no damage type change, has a lower CD, has a proc.

Zeal: Would be physical, has the cleave (that is reduced) but since its a 4.5 second CD vs the CS 3.5 it would see less procs of the suggested AoW thus the holy damage here is needed to balance it out.

With the suggestion to Greater Judgment well that Holy damage on Zeal isnt as op as presumed.

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Also, gotta laugh how the Ret feedback has the most views and most posts. In a way it makes me damn happy people are going ham in there.

[Deleted]

Also, gotta laugh how the Ret feedback has the most views and most posts. In a way it makes me damn happy people are going ham in there.

I was foolish enough to consolidate my main concerns and instantly regretted it as I was waylaid by one of these players who thinks the painful mechanics distinguish a good player from a bad one, while a cursory look at their armoury and logs reveals them to be a serial underachiever and way below the performances of another Ret in their own way behind the curve raid guild.

But I don't think it matters - the time to let Blizzard know in force what people thought was many months ago; admittedly before most got to try these things out for themselves. But people could have kept themselves up to date with changes and posted en masse in the normal access forums. But it didn't happen and now it is too late. There are other specs that were left later to work on and those are what Blizzard are spending their time on.

[Morally Grey Storm]

I was foolish enough to consolidate my main concerns and instantly regretted it as I was waylaid by one of these players who thinks the painful mechanics distinguish a good player from a bad one, while a cursory look at their armoury and logs reveals them to be a serial underachiever and way below the performances of another Ret in their own way behind the curve raid guild.

But I don't think it matters - the time to let Blizzard know in force what people thought was many months ago; admittedly before most got to try these things out for themselves. But people could have kept themselves up to date with changes and posted en masse in the normal access forums. But it didn't happen and now it is too late. There are other specs that were left later to work on and those are what Blizzard are spending their time on.

you pessimistic naysayer how dare you !
you must focus on positive side, you must be happy !
this time Ret is much closer to a true Paldinn archetype of fantasiye - an melee fighter with holy supports!

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That Bryah guy on the Beta forums he knows what is what!

I like a spec that takes thought, and rewards you for playing correctly. I love having a spec that gives me questions that I have to answer, and they make me as a player think out to get more out of it.

This isn't what ret paladins want though. The last two who weeks I have learned people don't want a hard spec, or a spec with choice they just want a spec that tops numbers. People throughout this beta have asked for the judgement window to be removed or made 100%, many have asked for holy power to be removed as well. The very things that allow players to push themselves and require more then just button mashing anything that isn't on CD people want removed. The mass of ret paladins that post here don't care about a spec they have to think about, they want a spec that is just button mashing and feeling strong because their numbers are really high. Ret does have it's problems, mobility and talents are just a few. To me however the rotation is fun but to most ret paladins it isn't.

Well said, well said.

[Morally Grey Storm]

What else you ask????
An ENGAGINg gameplay, one that requires thought!
How to utilise your supports, whom to GBless!
Low mobility means you have to be a step ahead and plan your movements!
That's what makes a spec INTERESTING and DIFFICULT!
Want to faceroll? Go Fury!

I like difficulties! Insurmountable, meaningless, spec-devastating difficulties!
That is fun for me!

[Deleted]

Well, after reading that huge swarm of posts that is summary of all "good" feedback from here, seems like i need to stop playing ret.

Our baseline is terrible, our talents are mostly terrible and our Artifact traits are by far the worst of them all and do absolutely nothing other than 15% and 20% dmg buffs to 2 abilities (major ones), and only good one being "Ashes" ones. Tempest is terrible and is not "skill shot" at all... and all it will do is make you pay attention where you are facing not to pull more packs with it, as using it from range is not viable way of using it at all because we dont have so many ranged builders anymore (good thing). They do absolutely nothing for the gameplay, you still press same buttons at the same time as you did before, they just do 15% or 20% more damage, terrible.

Talents still dont do anything to gameplay, everything is just damage and a bit more damage and doesnt interact with anything at all. Baseline is still terrible, no synergy and if anything, its even worse now with terrible "pooling" gameplay that doesnt work with CD based class that has nothing to pool or has nothing to use as filler when you have to wait and cant use builders or spenders as judgement cooldown is coming too soon to build HP back up if you use finisher and you dont want to waste builders because of... well, cooldown on them so you sit there and wait like an idiot.

The only spec that play pretty much the same no matter what talent you pick or artifact traits have unlocked, have 0 synergy and interaction within the spec.

Ret is a catastrophe... bunch of terrible baseline design, trash can for terrible ideas and talents and by far the worst designed artifact. But somehow all would be fixed if judgement had 100% uptime and would spread to aoe, and equality and greater blessings are slightly tweaked and so on. As long as damage meters are fine to us...

Whoever designed ret is either a massive idiot or pure hater of ret. Luckily, fury and unholy look great and are very fun too. Sadly, to me it feels wrong to play anything other than paly... thanks blizz for making me hate playing the class i play in every game that has them.

[Ulthane]

I was foolish enough to consolidate my main concerns and instantly regretted it as I was waylaid by one of these players who thinks the painful mechanics distinguish a good player from a bad one, while a cursory look at their armoury and logs reveals them to be a serial underachiever and way below the performances of another Ret in their own way behind the curve raid guild.

But I don't think it matters - the time to let Blizzard know in force what people thought was many months ago; admittedly before most got to try these things out for themselves. But people could have kept themselves up to date with changes and posted en masse in the normal access forums. But it didn't happen and now it is too late. There are other specs that were left later to work on and those are what Blizzard are spending their time on.

The sad thing is I just now for myself got access. I could not even post only post here and hope MAYBE it would reach. And its dreadful, just plain dreadful. Like I was hoping when I was saying stuff before I was 100% wrong because I had not played it yet <.< nope... its bad. The thing is they wont have to change much but ffs its like they need to fix this or else this spec wont be viable at all.

And speaking for myself, someone tries to waylay me its going to backfire considering its a consolidation of everyone's voices. Its like telling me: Please take my so called pedestal and shove it up my fething ass!

[Daralii]

The sad thing is I just now for myself got access. I could not even post only post here and hope MAYBE it would reach. And its dreadful, just plain dreadful. Like I was hoping when I was saying stuff before I was 100% wrong because I had not played it yet <.< nope... its bad. The thing is they wont have to change much but ffs its like they need to fix this or else this spec wont be viable at all.

And speaking for myself, someone tries to waylay me its going to backfire considering its a consolidation of everyone's voices. Its like telling me: Please take my so called pedestal and shove it up my fething ass!

It's pretty funny to me that they spent 4 years trying to make ret more than a joke spec, and now they're bringing it back there. lolret is dead, long live lolret.

[Ulthane]

It's pretty funny to me that they spent 4 years trying to make ret more than a joke spec, and now they're bringing it back there. lolret is dead, long live lolret.

Yea : / the only way this could work with keeping it as it is: Damage needs a HUGE buff across the board.