A guild I was in for seven years disbanded today

[prwraith]

It's just as childish to outright dismiss female raiders on the basis of their gender. Grill gamers have it hard enough without people formulating opinions about them as a player before even playing with them. That's not to say there aren't females who are toxic to a male-dominated raid environments but I'm against outright sexism based off of "prior negative experiences."

Exceptions can certainly be made for women who are married and or are not in the least bit flirty. It's hard enough finding a good raiding guild without the drama though. When the drama repeatedly comes from the same place it's hard to live through it again.

[Samuraijake]

might seem mean, but i usually start fights with them and call them tramps straight up. its up to us as individuals to call out skanks like that and not let it be so "passive"


Here is a 6 second video from family guy.. i hope you all enjoy


https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ByWo0txlbBU

[TEHPALLYTANK]

Hrmmm, interesting. So the men who could only think with their little heads instead of the big heads weren't responsible for their parts in the drama at all?

Yeah, I read that post as well and wondered how they came to the conclusion that only the women were the problem. He goes on about white knights, then acts as if all the blame should be placed on the women. It seems he almost understands that several of the men were at fault as well, but refuses to admit that individuals are responsible for their own behavior regardless of gender.

[Strakha]

the guild i am in is run by a woman and the percentage of women in the guild is close to 60%, no real problems.

just gkick ppl and stop whining, relationships are built on common needs and wants, sounds like you guys lacked the relationship to continue as an organization.

probably a troll post tho.

[Spinster]

Oh, it was the chick. It wasn't the dimwit guys who were willing to act like complete idiots for the VIRTUAL attention of a female human being? She couldn't have done a thing to your guild if nobody would have played along. The guys didn't contribute to the drama at all, right?

Gentlemen, let Mama Spinster tell you something true. Both men and women often enjoy drama, and they enjoy it in equal measure. They create it, read about it online, and watch it on television. Each gender fools itself into thinking it is superior by labeling the other gender's chosen forms of drama as "stupid" and declaring their own drama as "important" and "real", but that's silly. Guys will declare the "Twilight" movies and women's widespread devotion to them as "stupid" but will then spend hours debating the details of a comic book movie or checking the lore of an MMO. Chicks will swear that guys are so "stupid" to watch professional wrestling and talk about the plots and subplots of wrestling, but then they declare that their obsessing over the shows they watch is superior, somehow. Well guess what: It's all pretty stupid, but so what? Having a stupid hobby isn't a crime.

OP, blaming the chick is ridiculous. Don't pretend that all these guys in your guild were victimized by this crafty vixen who broke up the fellowship, lol. I'll bet that there was drama and gossip and shit flying in that guild from many sources. You know, blaming the woman is a really outdated and stupid trope that comes straight out of Christianity and has been used to abuse women for ages and ages. So knock it off, already. You sound like some Puritan weirdo.

Hot news flash: Yoko didn't break up The Beatles, either.

[Deja Thoris]

Oh, it was the chick. It wasn't the dimwit guys who were willing to act like complete idiots for the VIRTUAL attention of a female human being? She couldn't have done a thing to your guild if nobody would have played along. The guys didn't contribute to the drama at all, right?

Gentlemen, let Mama Spinster tell you something true. Both men and women often enjoy drama, and they enjoy it in equal measure. They create it, read about it online, and watch it on television. Each gender fools itself into thinking it is superior by labeling the other gender's chosen forms of drama as "stupid" and declaring their own drama as "important" and "real", but that's silly. Guys will declare the "Twilight" movies and women's widespread devotion to them as "stupid" but will then spend hours debating the details of a comic book movie or checking the lore of an MMO. Chicks will swear that guys are so "stupid" to watch professional wrestling and talk about the plots and subplots of wrestling, but then they declare that their obsessing over the shows they watch is superior, somehow. Well guess what: It's all pretty stupid, but so what? Having a stupid hobby isn't a crime.

OP, blaming the chick is ridiculous. Don't pretend that all these guys in your guild were victimized by this crafty vixen who broke up the fellowship, lol. I'll bet that there was drama and gossip and shit flying in that guild from many sources. You know, blaming the woman is a really outdated and stupid trope that comes straight out of Christianity and has been used to abuse women for ages and ages. So knock it off, already. You sound like some Puritan weirdo.

Hot news flash: Yoko didn't break up The Beatles, either.

Enough of your logic witch! Back to the kitchen with you!!!

[Jotaux]

Shuffering succotash!

This is the most offensive post in this thread. Daffy Duck does not say that. Sylvester does.

- - - Updated - - -

Enough of your logic witch! Back to the kitchen with you!!!

We don't blame the mentally ill when they are taken advantage of why would we blame these guys. Loneliness and depression can have a horrific effect on a person.

[Ahovv]

And you're not arguing over nothing yourself? Hell, I'd ARGUE that we're all arguing over nothing here, including you.
To you it seems like it's more often caused by women for whatever reason. To me it seems like it's just caused by humans. Hell, I'd argue it's very human to lose sight of friends when finding that special someone. No intent from one party to cause it needed.

If I told you more black people are violent than white people, proportionally, you would likely attempt to avoid this fact by mentioning poverty, as if it changes the inherent truth. Be it cultural differences or whatever you want to claim, groups of people tend to be different.

Trying to blanket humans as precise equals is an absurd premise because you know damned well it's not true. If this *was* true then you would see more even distributions of behaviors.

- - - Updated - - -

OP, blaming the chick is ridiculous. Don't pretend that all these guys in your guild were victimized by this crafty vixen who broke up the fellowship, lol. I'll bet that there was drama and gossip and shit flying in that guild from many sources. You know, blaming the woman is a really outdated and stupid trope that comes straight out of Christianity and has been used to abuse women for ages and ages. So knock it off, already. You sound like some Puritan weirdo.

It's pretty telling that rather than analyze a specific series of events such as the OP's story (or anyone else's story for that matter, like mine), you would resort to comparing the accusation to archaic religious texts.

That's a definitive sign of not having an actual argument, just so you are aware.

So we're clear: in my story of the woman lying about officer harassment to persuade others to leave, you are blindly tossing around the idea that blaming the woman is inherently wrong. So it's the men's fault for believing her? Sounds like victim blaming to me, if I've ever seen it.

[Allarius]

OP, blaming the chick is ridiculous. Don't pretend that all these guys in your guild were victimized by this crafty vixen who broke up the fellowship, lol.

Women are worse than sauron obviously. Sauron has the decency to come right out and tell you he's going to kill you and everyone you know. Women are devious, sauron could learn a thing or two from them.

[Taeldorian]

What's even more unbelievable is that we cleared SWP before WoTLK launched. We did the entire raid without voice chat.

I have two girls on my raiding team. I was recently recruited into the raid team after a few trial runs as a holy paladin and honestly, these girls cause 0 drama at all. We have a heroic raid team (back in the day this guild had a lot of server firsts) and a normal raid team, one girl is on the heroic team because she's good and the other is on the normal team. Both are pretty cool as is the rest of each team. A lot of the heroic raiders help the normal raid team as well when they need it so everyone tends to see each other a lot.

What I meant to say is, I agree with you. I don't see mature women (both are in there early 30s) being an issue at all. Then again this is only my second time being in a guild with women. It's also my first time dedicating a lot of my time to a guild.

[TEHPALLYTANK]

We don't blame the mentally ill when they are taken advantage of why would we blame these guys. Loneliness and depression can have a horrific effect on a person.

Being a drama queen isn't considered a mental illness, afaik.

[Jotaux]

Being a drama queen isn't considered a mental illness, afaik.

How often do you make it a habit to blame the mentally ill and then insult them instead? These are vulnerable people being taken advantage of.

[Alvito]

Sadly these things happen. If it is a guy or girl wanting some awful love interest, whatever that might be, to raid when they have no business ever doing that. You see it with friends too, it seems almost every group of 4 or more real life friends has one person in the group that is such a dummy you wonder how they can even turn their computer on.

[TheSerialSniper]

It's pretty shocking how much people are blaming the guild for this. I don't particularly thing it's solely the chick's fault or anything, but all that needs to be done to break apart a guild is for one person to come into it and divide the guild into an "us and them" for the entire thing to just collapse.

This is just one of the true downfalls of a social guild that....well, isn't full of douchebags, and unfortunately, I think you just witnessed yourself why guilds are so no-nonsense and even go so far as to avoid recruiting women at all. A guild needs to have a no-nonsense precedent and a hard set of rules to avoid something like this because it's a fatal flaw of so many open, social guilds. I've seen this happen about three times now in my history on WoW simply because I usually go for guilds that seem more welcoming, and it's genuinely shocking how many times they fall apart because an officer or GM invites their girlfriend.

Also, to people saying "just kick them!" That can actually have a very negative impact and cause the guild to fall apart as well. I witnessed it happen myself with one of the aforementioned guild experiences, where these two people openly acted like insufferable douchebags and in an act of revenge they sat and whispered and harassed the guild members to leave, badmouthing the GM incessantly. It eventually caused the guild to collapse as well.
Worst part is, that isn't the first time I've heard of that happening because frankly WoW's harassment policy is so lenient that reporting someone will only get them a light slap on the wrist before they are right back at it.

Wow's harassment policy is actually pretty brutal, if someone messages you after you used their ignore functions they will get a 3 day ban for first offense and perma ban if its not the first. I know because I have had to report many people for harassment when I was a gm for doing what a gm is supposed to do and snipping nonsense in the bud. I have had people cuss me out, get their 3 day ban, circumvent their ignore system again, then disappear after the next report more than once.

P.S. if you do NOT use their ignore system blizzard will not punish the other person as hard because the onus is on YOU to use the systems they have in place to protect yourself.

[TEHPALLYTANK]

How often do you make it a habit to blame the mentally ill and then insult them instead? These are vulnerable people being taken advantage of.

Do you know that all squares are rectangles, but not all rectangles are squares?

[CactusDisco]

Rule numer 4: Don't have a bipolar bitch as a guildmaster.

[Deleted]

If that was in our guild our GM would've gone Hitler on her ass. Shit like that isn't acceptable.

Why would you keep the boyfriend in the guild? Wasn't he responsible for the relationship at all? You are talking like she cast a spell on him.

[tj119]

Honestly to the OP, you can only give partial blame to the girl in the situation, if the guys allow a female to become a problem within a guild then they were just as much a cancer to your guild as she was. Your guild was better off without all of them. No matter how good they were at playing their class, chemistry and good vibes is what matters. This is an MMO, I've played with top 100 guilds, and guilds that wiped for months with shitty skilled pure determination and I endured it all based on the people I was around and how much I enjoyed communicating and raiding with them.

Even if a guild is terrible at raiding, can only clear normal by the time mythic or top end raiding has been nerfed into the ground or surpassed by the next tier, raid with people you love playing the game with, no drama and positive people who just enjoy trying to progress and get better.

[Skaiya]

Sooner or later the thirst always wins.

[Deleted]

Yes, i usually avoid guild with girls unless they are married and/or are married

My bc guild 'twilight empire' had a married couple as leaders, some of the nicest people you could meet. I had to quit wow for a few months due to rl stuff but when i returned 3 months later (after sunwell plateau) I had learned they did a rl meeting at the gm's home over the summer.

During the meet one of the officers and the gm's wife 'fell in love' (wasnt there so dont know the details). What i do know is that they ran off together and neither of them ever logged in again. I felt so bad for the guy remember his char name to this date, maltuvion. I hope hes slright, he was a legit good guy.

Anywayy op, yeah ive seen it happen (in other instances too). Obviously its a two eay street but some lads are -weird freaky controlly- with their relationships.