[Legion] Shadow Priest Discussion

[Zungate]

Yay, change to artifact points. /s

We now need 1million+ to reach all 3 gold traits.

Havoc DH only needs 358k.

I'm just feeling the love.

[Apero]

The last page of this thread is literally the biggest wine fest i have ever encountered in the mmo champion forums.

Shadow has its issues, but fun is for sure none of it, its ridicously fast paced with a higher skillcap then most speccs. Which is pretty nice. Everyone i know (pretty much only mythic raiders that is) enjoys it as much as i do. I even reroll from warlock to shadow, just because warlock in legion is the biggest annoying boring clusterfuck known to man. (how can someone seriously consider to reroll from legion shadow to legion affliction, even saying "better talents" seems like a joke for me as a 7 year warlock veteran) I can understand whats not to like if you are a clicker though, or like switching off your brain while playing.

I dont get the route blizzard is going though, but we havent seen any raid data with a fully developt artifact.

The optimist in me thinks that the nerfs to voidform , mb and vb indicate getting mind flay and mind sear being buffed big time, which would help our biggest (pve) weakness. (apart from questing, but who cares about that anyway, let it take 2 hours longer to get to 110, whatever)

[l33t]

Me too. Right now, Affliction looks like a distilled and refined version of what I loved about shadow in WoD (ie, everything before RoW).

Yeah, and for me clunky and unfun gameplay is just one side of a coin. Shadow lost too much utility in a prune. I really really really really really really can't play without feathers, without life grip, without void tendrils, without 20sec silence, without desperate prayer, without fear ward, without psychic horror...

(how can someone seriously consider to reroll from legion shadow to legion affliction, even saying "better talents" seems like a joke for me as a 7 year warlock veteran)

Legion affliction reminds me of TBC draintanking warlock, which gameplay style I loved.
I also tend to love how everyone who disagree with you are either clickers or braindead. So full of constructivism, eh. I am neither clicker, nor braindead, and I am mythic 13/13 since February 2016. I played shadow since end of BC, and I hate all the changes in Legion, absolutely all of them.

[RsinRC]

PTR is up with the Legion changes guys. Indulge and enjoy!

Sent from my SM-G935P using Tapatalk

[Deleted]

What the-....why did we get nerfed again?!?! Blizzard!!

[Kretan]

The last page of this thread is literally the biggest wine fest i have ever encountered in the mmo champion forums.

Shadow has its issues, but fun is for sure none of it, its ridicously fast paced with a higher skillcap then most speccs. Which is pretty nice. Everyone i know (pretty much only mythic raiders that is) enjoys it as much as i do. I even reroll from warlock to shadow, just because warlock in legion is the biggest annoying boring clusterfuck known to man. (how can someone seriously consider to reroll from legion shadow to legion affliction, even saying "better talents" seems like a joke for me as a 7 year warlock veteran) I can understand whats not to like if you are a clicker though, or like switching off your brain while playing.

I dont get the route blizzard is going though, but we havent seen any raid data with a fully developt artifact.

The optimist in me thinks that the nerfs to voidform , mb and vb indicate getting mind flay and mind sear being buffed big time, which would help our biggest (pve) weakness. (apart from questing, but who cares about that anyway, let it take 2 hours longer to get to 110, whatever)

Heh. The last page is pretty much the theme for the whole thread. What's funny to me is the overwhelming majority of people outside of this thread consider the new design to be fun (not saying it has no problems mind you), but as soon as you step in here people hate shadow legion with a passion.

As for tuning I really don't have an opinion because no one has a solid understanding of where we are at all anymore since raid testing hasn't happened in a while. It's hard imo to be upset or happy with any nerf or buff if you have no context.

[Smothered Hope]

That's not how charges work; the two charges do not have independent cooldowns. Once you blow through your stored charges, you can only cast one every twelve seconds.

Oh. Well that's kind of a moronic system, especially with no haste scaling. I think I'm almost to the point of switching to an afflock for my main in Legion, which sucks because I really had high hopes for our spec's development back in the alpha (but only vicariously experiencing the actual gameplay).

[Scottokemon]

Shadow has its issues, but fun is for sure none of it, its ridicously fast paced with a higher skillcap then most speccs. Which is pretty nice. Everyone i know (pretty much only mythic raiders that is) enjoys it as much as i do. I even reroll from warlock to shadow, just because warlock in legion is the biggest annoying boring clusterfuck known to man. (how can someone seriously consider to reroll from legion shadow to legion affliction, even saying "better talents" seems like a joke for me as a 7 year warlock veteran) I can understand whats not to like if you are a clicker though, or like switching off your brain while playing.

And nobody here who is unhappy with the direction of Shadow is a mythic raider, nosiree! I genuinely don't understand why you have to insult people that don't like shadow. Why are you so insecure? Maybe just accept that some people don't like the new Shadow (yes, even mythic raiders *gasp*) just as some people do. It's ok for people to have differing opinions.

Yeah, and for me clunky and unfun gameplay is just one side of a coin. Shadow lost too much utility in a prune. I really really really really really really can't play without feathers, without life grip, without void tendrils, without 20sec silence, without desperate prayer, without fear ward, without psychic horror...

I think I will feel the loss of DP and the self-heal as well. I am trying to keep an open mind about Shadow, but I'm gearing a Mage and a Warlock. Given the history of Shadow it just seems sensible to be prepared for disappointment.

What's funny to me is the overwhelming majority of people outside of this thread consider the new design to be fun (not saying it has no problems mind you), but as soon as you step in here people hate shadow legion with a passion.

Come on, that's hyperbole. I don't think anyone in the thread hates new Shadow 'with a passion'. People are concerned because they want to like shadow, but have concerns about how it will perform in all areas of the game. You have to acknowledge that the developers have let the spec down in the past as well, and that plays into how people react.

[l33t]

I think I will feel the loss of DP and the self-heal as well. I am trying to keep an open mind about Shadow, but I'm gearing a Mage and a Warlock. Given the history of Shadow it just seems sensible to be prepared for disappointment.

Yeah that's the best you can do, in a given circumstances.

[deviantcultist]

The combination of PTR not working and the nerfs to Shadow is seriously getting on my nerves right now.

[Ilir]

Lol.

"nerfing Voidform makes us stronger outside of it" LOL. No it doesn't. Since they nerfed mind blast damage. Having one of our dot deal a little more damage is garbage when levelling. Having voidform being nerfed aswell as insanity gain/depletion rate increases => less stacks => less haste => less outside of VF damage.

"it's a whinefest" yeah, getting nerfed isn't really the issue. Getting nerfed with no reason whatsoever is annoying. Still having shitty talents that are made even more useless each nerf, having a shitty stat that's below versatility is really alarming.

Shadow Legion is fun on ST with a mob doing nothing. That's pretty much it.

[Scottokemon]

"it's a whinefest"

Aw, I thought he said it was a 'wine fest'! *hic*

[Kretan]

Lol.

"nerfing Voidform makes us stronger outside of it" LOL. No it doesn't. Since they nerfed mind blast damage. Having one of our dot deal a little more damage is garbage when levelling. Having voidform being nerfed aswell as insanity gain/depletion rate increases => less stacks => less haste => less outside of VF damage.

"it's a whinefest" yeah, getting nerfed isn't really the issue. Getting nerfed with no reason whatsoever is annoying. Still having shitty talents that are made even more useless each nerf, having a shitty stat that's below versatility is really alarming.

Shadow Legion is fun on ST with a mob doing nothing. That's pretty much it.

Actually nerfing voidform at his stage is a buff to non voidform if you hold the assumption that the spec will be balanced to other dps in the end. Nerfs and buffs at this point in tuning serve more to rebalance where damage is rather than your standing really.

[Ilir]

Aw, I thought he said it was a 'wine fest'! *hic*

Well maybe that's what happening at blizzard ! would explain a lot about this alpha/beta experience !

Just to be clear : i'm not whining about shadow specifially. Nearly every spec got ignored/left with stupid designs that made no sense except for the devs. The "we would have too much to say" is such a bullshit excuse like lmao.

Ìf you don't wanna fucking talk then don't make fucking class feedback forum, don't invite a lot of people in the beta. Do a very closed under NDA beta testing with a few people and that's it.

[Kretan]

Come on, that's hyperbole. I don't think anyone in the thread hates new Shadow 'with a passion'. People are concerned because they want to like shadow, but have concerns about how it will perform in all areas of the game. You have to acknowledge that the developers have let the spec down in the past as well, and that plays into how people react.

Yeah the hyperbole is probably fair. Regardless of how you describe it though, a lot of people on here seriously dislike shadow priests design in legion as a stark contrast to the general opinion outside of this thread.

[Ilir]

Actually nerfing voidform at his stage is a buff to non voidform if you hold the assumption that the spec will be balanced to other dos in the end. Nerfs and buffs at this point in tuning serve more to rebalance where damage is rather than your standing really.

Lol, yeah if you hold the assumption. They buffed SWP direct damage and VT direct damage. I guarantee you we'll still be shit outside of Voidform.

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Also I don't think we "dislike" it (such a strong word) it's just a "wth are they doing nerfing spells when we have talents that are literally pure garbage and those are left untouched"

[Kretan]

Well maybe that's what happening at blizzard ! would explain a lot about this alpha/beta experience !

Just to be clear : i'm not whining about shadow specifially. Nearly every spec got ignored/left with stupid designs that made no sense except for the devs. The "we would have too much to say" is such a bullshit excuse like lmao.

Ìf you don't wanna fucking talk then don't make fucking class feedback forum, don't invite a lot of people in the beta. Do a very closed under NDA beta testing with a few people and that's it.

This seems like a strong reaction to not being given a seat at the dev table. You are a game tester not a game designer....that's not to say good ideas can't from testers, but to get upset they don't include players opinions in the majority of the design cycle is a little silly to me. They are professional game designers, and we aren't. On top of that we can't even agree to a lot of things I this thread......which testers do they listen to? Let the game designers design.....give your input and feedback let it be that...feedback not a design opinion which needs a conversation.

- - - Updated - - -

Lol, yeah if you hold the assumption. They buffed SWP direct damage and VT direct damage. I guarantee you we'll still be shit outside of Voidform.

- - - Updated - - -

Also I don't think we "dislike" it (such a strong word) it's just a "wth are they doing nerfing spells when we have talents that are literally pure garbage and those are left untouched"

The point is that you are less shit outside of voidform with a reduced voidform.

Nerfing a spell and not touching another are two mutually exclusive items. It's not like they ran out of time and didn't buff the spell you want lol.

[l33t]

Yeah the hyperbole is probably fair. Regardless of how you describe it though, a lot of people on here seriously dislike shadow priests design in legion as a stark contrast to the general opinion outside of this thread.

I feel like I have to ask: what's the origins of "general opinion" outside of this thread? Because I've seen no massive legion shadow appreciation thread or something like that. You and your guildie liking legion shadow are by no mere the "general opinion".

[Ilir]

But no ? We're still shit(tier) as ever outside of Voidform.

I know that you're trying to put a positive perspective to it by saying like "if voidform gets nerfed, the power gap between VF and non-VF will be lower"... except that doesn't work at all because it just means we're still shit outside of voidform but now even more.

They nerfed the amount of stacks you get (since you lose more insanity) while nerfing the insanity gain => less VF stacks => less haste => LESS OUTSIDE OF VF DAMAGE.

They nerfed Mindblast => less outside of VF damage. (i'm talking levelling/solo content on mobs that shouldn't live for a full dot duration).

I'm not saying they have to take what we offer and apply it. I'm saying they have to TALK, be COMMUNICATIVE.

"Yeah we're nerfing X because our goal is Y". That would be enough for me even if I don't agree... at least I know they explained WHY.

That's the least they could do, imo.

[Deleted]

Doing some cool questing in Suramar. Accidentally pull 2 mobs, pop vamp embrace, voidform, mindbender, the works. End up having to spam some shadow mends to try and keep myself afloat anyway, scrape through with ~15-20% health left, try to top myself up but run out of mana, sit down to eat the rest of my hp up. Look over to my right, a warrior has pulled 5 of the same mobs and killed all of them in less time than it took me to deal with the 2 mobs I pulled. He has 70% hp left.

For the love of god, give us some sort of self heal buff or survivability so I can be free from this hell.