BREXIT - leave or remain?

[Deleted]

banks =/= investment banks =/= financial sector

Yes and if my fist punches you in the face my brain had no part of it.

[Grym]

The financial sector is worth nothing other than what it stole from the rest of us. It never contributed anything to Britain and took and took and took. It held back manufacturing and other sector by artificiially inflating sterling.

How the fuck would Brexit help manufacturing and other sector?

Manufacturing will still be sent to 3rd world countries due to their cheap labour, industries that is not successful now will not suddenly be successful after Brexit.

On the other hand, Financial Service is one of UK's biggest sector (and export), now EU can easily set up trade barriers to give you extra hurdles, it will be a dent to the UK's economy.

Banks (HSBC I am looking at you) now potentially moving their HQ out of London, HSBC for example will trade with EU much easier with HQ in Hong Kong or Shanghai compare to London now, if that happens: Many below management level would lose their jobs, people in the executive level won't matter, as they can easily conference their job, so it will be everyday people that loses out. On top of that, with HQ no longer based in UK, UK no longer get the main Corporate Tax from HSBC, so there are quite a bit if lost tax revenue. And even on top of that, those many people that lost their jobs, that is lost tax and national insurance, as well as employer class 1 national insurance, a lot of revenue to HMRC could be lost there.

Many people hates the banks and want them to leave, didn't realise it would cripple the economy much worse than the financial crisis did.

[FluFF]

So I'm not really informed on the whole BREXIT thing, is it correct that the younger generation voted to stay and as it trickled down to the older people they voted to leave?

Scotland, North Ireland, and big cities in England Like London and others voted Remain, same with people aged 18-50 and people with a job or still studying.
Leave mainly consisted of 50+ people, poor cities in England , people without a job and people who think they were bad off in the economy.

So yes in like 10 years most of the leave people will be in their grave leaving behind a mess and the '' omg they took our jewbs '' people will still be poor asses drinking cheap ass beer while complaining how England sucks even more outside the EU.

[javen]

I'll stick to old numbers for argument's sake. The markets are more volatile than a hamster on crack taking a bath in sulfuric acid right now.

Considering that doing business in the UK will become extremely difficult for EU-based companies, not to mention the amount of grants and research that is currently taking place in the UK from EU funding that will all stop, economic projections don't forsee a meaningful rebound anytime soon. And considering the projections were pretty accurate is describing the fallout from a vote to leave, it seems foolish not to pay them any mind now.

[Deleted]

no, i didnt, and thats why i'm fond of regulating the financial sector and keeping it out of politics, not getting rid of it completely. that's the sane thing to do, because a developed country (and any country in reality) cannot sustain themselves without the financial sector. it's a necesary evil, and it must be kept on a leash

If you removed the productive part of the banking sector and destroyed the rest it would be between a tenth and a hundredth of its current size.

[Mehrunes]

I know they are. That is one of two reasons I was convinced to support the EU on this one, my sister made a strong case.

But the whole "Glorious perfect EU is mana from heaven and second coming of Christ!" act is kind of off putting. Pretending the EU is perfect and has made flawless calls on everything isn't exactly helping.

Still can't recall doing that.

I liked the EU for at least fighting off TTIP, and its stances on minority languages. Which for me, the UK leaving puts several of them in danger because I don't trust the UK to keep up on those issues.

Which is the gist of the issue. UK government is worse than EU and had to be put in place by EU multiple times. Unchecked they will balloon up into humongous government (contrary to some leavers that somehow expected a small government afterwards) and will bend over to corporations harder than EU ever did. Especially since they are a smaller entity.

[Thepersona]

Yes and if my fist punches you in the face my brain had no part of it.

banks , investment banks and financial sector (stock market) operates on a different set of rules. i repeat, they must be kept on a short leash, but it's insane to destroy them

[Noradin]

We aren't asking for that, what we want is something similar to what Switzerland or Norway currently have. But people are making out like we won't even get that, and we'll be punished. That is what i'm arguing against.

Se... free movement of people?

[padie]

[Independent voter]

http://www.overclock3d.net/articles/...ck_simulator/1

Britain removed from Euro Truck Simulator lol

[Kalis]

Se... free movement of people?

Similar to does not mean same as.

[Noradin]

And if that happens, it happens. Then we just start negotiations while we are out, instead of having it all sorted while we are still in, which would be better for everyone.

That would be better if the UK does not try to blackmail the remaining member states with sabotage while they still have a vote.
I hope it works out like that, but I'm wary. I cannot see how your politicans could justify not using that tool to your voters.

[Deleted]

How the fuck would Brexit help manufacturing and other sector?

Brexit won't help manufacturing or other sectors. I voted remain.

I'm explaining the thinking behind Brexit. A few days before the vote the head of Goldman Sachs was on TV arguing for remain. That probably cost remain the election. People really fucking hate bankers, understandably. Even I had to think about it after seeing him speak.

Regarding the exodus of the banking sector: absolutely no one cares and many will be glad. The reason is that while they might have improvied the balance sheet of the UK, they had no positive impact on the UK at all in real terms insofar as the general population were concerned. It is like a casino upping sticks and moving across town. Sure, it makes money but it doesn't improve your society or economy so no one gives a shit.

[Theodarzna]

Yes the hysterically vengeful reactions of some eurocracts are the most disgusting thing about this whole sorry issue. They are acting like EU is a gang, not a mutually beneficial compact.

MMOC-OT is a unique place. It brings out often the most intense in people.

[Deleted]

You do realise where that money comes from? It's like me give you 10 pounds and getting 2 pounds back, I'm still 8 pounds down.

For the UK as whole, yes, but not for the farmers, for them its 5p and then + 2 billion.

[Thepersona]

Similar to does not mean same as.

it's kind of weird that i agree on you on this, since i'm very left wing...

[Noradin]

It's rather illogic to present EU as the 1st option and then think anyone would "regret" leaving them, whatever the economic fallout may be.

It is rather illogic to pretend those two options you made up are the only ones.

[Mehrunes]

If the EU acts to punish a former member state for acting democractically, they will only enflame the indepdendence parties in other EU member states "Look they decided to leave and the evil EU sought to punish them! See the EU was evil all along!"

It may be the case, but I don't see the democratic problem. Again, UK's democracy is their problem, them messing things up doesn't have to get a free pass just because they messed things up democratically. And that may a case for evil EU but not so much to leaving it if it's going to stomp on you. I'm not saying they should, I'm just saying I don't view it as undemocratic on EU's part.

The economy was damaged because everyone bet the wrong way.

Even if they bet the right way the economy would hurt because UK just threw a wrench into the biggest economy in the world. There would be such effects even if 100% voted leave and it was known a year ago.

[Deleted]

I know what you're saying advanta. And mind you, bringing physical production back wouldn't be bad but A) you need time to stabilise and B) financial sector doesn't necessarily mean reckless trading.

[Zoranon]

MMOC-OT is a unique place. It brings out often the most intense in people.

If only it were just MMO champ. Some of the leading eurocrats issued rather nasty statements.