BREXIT - leave or remain?

[Ulmita]

Yes and i've stated in this thread many times:

I ALREADY KNOW THAT. I VOTED REMAIN BECAUSE I KNEW THAT IF WE VOTED TO LEAVE WE WOULD END UP IN THE EXACT SAME SITUATION AS WE ARE IN NOW ONLY WITHOUT A POLITICAL SAY IN EUROPE.

BREXIT MEANS THAT WE WILL HAVE TO ACCEPT FREE MOVEMENT OF LABOUR, IT MEANS THAT WE WILL BE SUBJECT TO EU LEGISLATION WITH REGARDS TO EXPORTS AND IT MIGHT EVEN MEAN THAT WE HAVE TO JOIN SCHENGEN, SOMETHING WHICH WE AREN'T EVEN A PART OF ATM.

I KNEW ALL OF THIS, SO I VOTED AGAINST IT.

SO ONCE AGAIN, WHAT THE FUCK IS YOUR POINT?

THAT EFTA IS OUT OF THE TABLE FOR UK. Thats my point.

I didn't ask what the fuck you voted nor what you knew. I am counter arguing your belief that you will be in the single market. Did you get it now?

[Deleted]

Our point is that we all consider you slightly naive/dillusional for thinking the UK can leave the EU without any form of consequences and can keep all the benefits of EU without any of the responseabilites that comes with it.
And you're biggest argument seems to be that the EU needs the UK trade to survive and will magically keep bending over and give you what you want...

lel ?

[Deleted]

The consequence is that we lose all of our political power within the EU.

You know, the whole reason the EU exists beyond a free trade market?

The UK voted out, so they can't decide what the EU exists for or not. If you want the benefits, you also get the consequences, simple as that. Schengen is one of such consequences, the main argument of the Brexit.

[Deleted]

THAT EFTA IS OUT OF THE TABLE FOR UK. Thats my point.

I didn't ask what the fuck you voted nor what you knew. I am counter arguing your belief that you will be in the single market. Did you get it now?

Why is it off the table?

The EU gets the most benefit out of the UK being in the EFTA. They retain free movement to the UK, they will still get membership fees from the UK for access to the EFTA, they will still dictate there laws to the UK in return for access to the EFTA, and they might even be able to force Schengen on the UK. All the while they are also keeping a lucrative market.

Your entire argument boils down to "THEY MUST PUNISH THE UK FOR LEAVING, AGAINST THE BETTER INTERESTS OF THE EU", my argument is "WE ARE ALREADY BEING PUNISHED, THERE'S NO NEED TO CUT OFF YOUR OWN NOSE TO SPITE YOUR FACE".

[Butler to Baby Sloths]

http://www.reuters.com/article/brita...-idUSB4N16V022

Merkel's Chief of Staff has said that Britain's politicians should be allowed a rethink. #Brethink perhaps?

[Deleted]

Our point is that we all consider you slightly naive/dillusional for thinking the UK can leave the EU without any form of consequences and can keep all the benefits of EU without any of the responseabilites that comes with it.
And you're biggest argument seems to be that the EU needs the UK trade to survive and will magically keep bending over and give you what you want...

lel ?

The UK voted out, so they can't decide what the EU exists for or not. If you want the benefits, you also get the consequences, simple as that. Schengen is one of such consequences, the main argument of the Brexit.

So when do the other 4 members of the EEA/EFTA who aren't members of the EU get kicked out for reaping the benefits without the responsibilities?

[Deleted]

They retain free movement to the UK

Why the Brexit then, when the Schengen agreement that was the main campaign issue?

[Deleted]

So when do the other 4 members of the EEA/EFTA who aren't members of the EU get kicked out for reaping the benefits without the responsibilities?

You choose to leave.
They didn't.
You also cant get "kicked out"...you can only leave.

Why would you get the same trade deals as those four countries when you literally gave the finger to whole of EU ?

[Deleted]

Why the Brexit then, when the Schengen agreement that was the main campaign issue?

I don't know, ask the retards who voted to Leave.

[Deleted]

So when do the other 4 members of the EEA/EFTA who aren't members of the EU get kicked out for reaping the benefits without the responsibilities?

They all had to sign the Schengen agreement.

- - - Updated - - -

I don't know, ask the retards who voted to Leave.

Don't care what the others voted, it's you that are on this forum telling that the UK won't get consequences of the Brexit. You get what the EU decides it's the best deal for them.

[Deleted]

You choose to leave.
They didn't.

Why would you get the same trade deals as those four countries when you literally gave the finger to whole of EU ?

Yes but that isn't your point.

Your point is that we shouldn't be allowed access to the EEA/EFTA without accepting responsibilities when there are already 4 other countries that do that.

So when are they going to get kicked out?

And we didn't give the finger to Europe, we give it to the European Union.

[ranzino]

Why the Brexit then, when the Schengen agreement that was the main campaign issue?

Hmm, as was pointed out earlier often: they did not expect to get their "death wish". There was no brexit scenario ready to pull off the shelves, they never had one.

"YOU ARE NOT PREPARED !!!"
/Illidan

[Deleted]

They all had to sign the Schengen agreement.

Yep and the UK will probably have to as well.

Don't care what the others voted, it's you that are on this forum telling that the UK won't get consequences of the Brexit.

I'm not arguing that we won't get the consequences of a Brexit. We are already feeling the consequences of the Brexit, or have you not looked at the news for the past 2 days?

My argument is that the EU denying the UK access to the EFTA or the EEA goes against the best interests of the EU.

My argument is a logical one based on facts. Yours and Ultimas and Santa666s is based on emotion.

Ultimately logic will win out, especially with the bureaucrats in the EU.

[Deleted]

Your point is that we shouldn't be allowed access to the EEA/EFTA without accepting responsibilities when there are already 4 other countries that do that.

No, his point is that your leaders don't want to accept the responsibilities of the EEA/EFTA, mainly the Schengen agreement.

[Deleted]

No, his point is that your leaders don't want to accept the responsibilities of the EEA/EFTA, mainly the Schengen agreement.

I don't think the leaders have much of a choice, do you?

[Stumps]

He's pointing out that schengen will be part of that deal, which inforces freedom of movement, which was on of the racist selling points of the vote for leave.
Get the point now ?

Anyone throwing around terms like "racist" needs to understand what they are talking about otherwise they risk looking like a halfwit who cherry picks what he believes from mainstream media. Despite what ill-informed knowalls will tell you, the majority of leave votes (and the leave campaign) were not made to "get the nasty foreigners out". Any claim to such is disingenuous, misrepresentative and willfully dumbing down the issue. You think over half the country voted to leave because they dislike foreigners? get a grip!!

The sheer volume of mandated immigration is a concern for a lot of Brits, especially when we cannot look after our own citizens properly. But here is the revalation...it's a concern for a lot of real people across the EU too!! Wherever you are in the EU, immigration is an issue that is on the minds of the people. Dismissing those concerns as "racism" and dismissing those worried about it as "uneducated" and "xenophobic" is part of what led the UK to where it is now. Despite all of this, I voted to stay in, but I can see that among all the bullshit spouted by both sides, both sides also had serious merits and real concerns driving them.

Are there racists and idiots living in the UK? of course there are, the same as there are hate-peddlers and idiots living across much of the globe. Are they to blame for what happened this week? Not a bit of it.

Maybe engaging your brain before your fingers is a way forward?

[Deleted]

Yep and the UK will probably have to as well.

Sorry for the question, but are you joking? The Leave camp built their campaign against the Schengen agreement.

[Deleted]

Your point is that we shouldn't be allowed access to the EEA/EFTA without accepting responsibilities when there are already 4 other countries that do that.
.

My point is that its impossible for the EU to give you any form of deal that actually benefits you.
It would be committing political suicide of the EU as a whole.

Basically yes, you wont be allowed access.
Had you done like those four countries and voted no to EU but signed schengen, it would be totally fine.

But you didnt... what you did was:
Use the EU to build your economy, paying in slightly more then you got out of it money wise, but was paid back in trade deals.
Try to hinder most of the EU decision trying to be a special snowflake.

Then you vote out of the EU saying you dont want anything to do with it and its hurting your sovereignty and country as a whole, fuck the eu.
Suddenly you realize, ohh shit, we fucked up, we need actually need the EU to survive.

And instead of trying to void the brexit vote, you actually think the EU will give you a better deal then you previously had?
But most importantly you dont think that would cause a shitstorm troughout the whole EU ?

It simply cant happen for political reasons and UK is truly fucked in all of this.

[Deleted]

Sorry for the question, but are you joking? The Leave camp built their campaign against the Schengen agreement.

And as we finding out today, the Leave campaign had no fucking plan for if they won.

The Leave campaign has spent all the time since it won backtracking on the claims it made during the campaign.

[Deleted]

Anyone throwing around terms like "racist" needs to understand what they are talking about otherwise they risk looking like a halfwit who cherry picks what he believes from mainstream media.

Google brexit voters real reason for leave.
You'll see plenty of people saying it was all about immigration and racist beliefs.
Now does that mean everyone who voted leave had the same reasons ? Of course not... But im sure it was a big motivatior for ages 50+.