Is it excessive that mythic 5mans can be looted infinitely and daily?

[Gaidax]

You get two if you succeed. Or at least two. I don't know if it can give more.

You do not get two if you succeed, I'm in Beta and doing these Mythic plenty.

[emilylorange]

Players debated over it, but nobody could find a solution which wasn't also able to be exploited. Split raiding in Legion will be just as "necessary" as it was in WoD.

Well unless you come up with a way that two raids doesn't reward twice as much loot I'm not sure how you would fix that beyond the entirety of high-end raiding agreeing not to do it.

Which is broken as soon as someone starts 'cheating' to get an edge.

I mean I don't have a problem agreeing not to play until I die of exhaustion but w/e

[Relapses]

Well unless you come up with a way that two raids doesn't reward twice as much loot I'm not sure how you would fix that beyond the entirety of high-end raiding agreeing not to do it.

Which is broken as soon as someone starts 'cheating' to get an edge.

I mean I don't have a problem agreeing not to play until I die of exhaustion but w/e

It's not necessarily cheating since you still need to defeat the bosses in order to get loot. The idea of having to have {x} number of gear mules primed and ready for the beginning of progression is mostly what the devs disliked. For example, one of the more common "solutions" was to force personal loot for the first month of progression but then the progression guilds would just clear the instance 6 times with the same classes and bring the toon with the best RNG to progression.

Regardless, it doesn't appear they're at the point where they're ready to implement features which would stop or discourage people from doing split runs.

[emilylorange]

It's not necessarily cheating since you still need to defeat the bosses in order to get loot.

Uh.... 'cheating' was in quotes because it refers to cheating on the agreement, not cheating the game mechanics.

The idea of having to have {x} number of gear mules primed and ready for the beginning of progression is mostly what the devs disliked. For example, one of the more common "solutions" was to force personal loot for the first month of progression but then the progression guilds would just clear the instance 6 times with the same classes and bring the toon with the best RNG to progression.

Regardless, it doesn't appear they're at the point where they're ready to implement features which would stop or discourage people from doing split runs.

Well that's a double edged sword. They like not opening raids until several weeks after release so that everyone can 'catch up' on initial leveling - which, yeah, is going to include 6 or whatever alts for the people who play 8 hours a day.

What you're describing isn't a problem that goes away by 'forbidding' split raids.

If you take out split raids they will spam farm mythic+ dungeons

If you take that ability out they will spend hours farming the legendaries

If you take that ability out the target becomes full titanforge gear

If you take that ability out you find them farming the .05% or whatever artifact power increases

If you take that out you have a group of people who will burn through the content available before raids are released, and a bunch of casuals with no way to increase their character power after they finish heroics.


You can't save people from themselves in a game built on better rewards with greater time investment.

[FenixAU]

failing the run makes the keystone disappear.

No, it doesn't disappear. It just becomes depleted - meaning you don't get an upgrade, you have to run again and beat the timer to energize it.

[Soulfròst]

You can't save people from themselves in a game built on better rewards with greater time investment.

/thread.

People will find ways to be digital masochists in WoW to get the competitive edge. The .001% who are all about that. A number insignificant to the health of the game and its playerbase. No action needs to be taken.

[Bosen]

No. It's not like the content will be easy,especially with all the cool modifiers. Looks like just rewards for the hardcore.

[Kraineth]

People forgetting the fact that Mythic Keystones won't be unlocked until the raids open up? At that point, what is the problem with getting loot from each run? There are only so many hours in the day. And killing raid bosses is going to always be more rewarding than trying to spam keystone runs.

[RedGamer030]

The basic version has a weekly lockout. The keystone version can be run indefinitely. You can keep joining the keystone runs of others.

Mythic+ keystones will eventually run out especially early on in Legion's life cycle.

What NPC/item/other rewards the weekly chest by the way?

World Quests reward a daily chest after you complete four. The gear though is not as good as Mythic+ Dungeons.

You only get one chest, by the way.

[dnis]

You do not get two if you succeed, I'm in Beta and doing these Mythic plenty.

You can get up to 3 (max I got personally), depending on the remaining time when you finish all required objectives.
Good group and chain pulling are required. Pretty similar to challenge mods.

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Mythic+ keystones will eventually run out especially early on in Legion's life cycle.



World Quests reward a daily chest after you complete four. The gear though is not as good as Mythic+ Dungeons.

You only get one chest, by the way.

The world chest quests are not daily. They have 2+ days cooldown.
And you can get more than one chest if your group is good.

Keystones from alts might help. So 4 geared mains + 1 alt rotation can provide plenty of runs.

[RedGamer030]

Keystones from alts might help. So 4 geared mains + 1 alt rotation can provide plenty of runs.

Mythic+ keystones will eventually run out especially early on in Legion's life cycle.

[Tharkkun]

The basic version has a weekly lockout. The keystone version can be run indefinitely. You can keep joining the keystone runs of others.

You get at least 2 chests with a piece of gear if you succeed.

What NPC/item/other rewards the weekly chest by the way?


You get chests to loot at the end. They are even 100% drops for your spec.

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You seem to imply the game in whole will run out of keystones. I doubt it. I imagine there will be a lot of people running keystones only for a few times while others would hoard all the groups of that sort getting for themselves multiple chances.

You're assuming that 1 person will be invited to infinite runs each week. Unless you're running with a key with a + above your item level the reward won't benefit you.

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Well unless you come up with a way that two raids doesn't reward twice as much loot I'm not sure how you would fix that beyond the entirety of high-end raiding agreeing not to do it.

Which is broken as soon as someone starts 'cheating' to get an edge.

I mean I don't have a problem agreeing not to play until I die of exhaustion but w/e

Some of the problems will be fixed by using personal loot. Remember we can now trade items you don't want between those in the raid. Some of the early Mythic guilds used personal loot on the first few resets so you had a better chance of everyone receiving something.

But if people want to burn themselves out doing 3, 4, 5 lockouts a week so they can kill a boss a week before some other guild, knock themselves out.

[Raiju]

It's still not infinite. Someone has to earn those stones and there is a limit to the total number of stones that can be earned.

It's the same thing as when people say that WoW is F2P because you can buy tokens, ignoring the fact that someone else is buying a token for real money and selling it to you. The act of earning still has to take place.

To put it one way, I did over 200 HH runs due to being a tank in one week when this mechanic was in place for the holiday bosses in TBC.

But then you can spam heroics, too, with LFD. Also managed 40 ZA's in one day trying to get one specific piece in cata.

[cFortyfive]

I'm still not sure why it's Blizzard's responsibility to make sure people don't do a recreational activity too much.

It seemingly was their responsibility when they removed realm firsts at least that's what they claimed.

Some of the early Mythic guilds used personal loot on the first few resets so you had a better chance of everyone receiving something.

Those guilds really must hate progression.

[Tharkkun]

Those guilds really must hate progression.

Why? They buffed the amount of personal loot drops per raid size in HFC. You earned more drops per player than master loot. Nearly every drop the first few resets is an upgrade right? All the shitty items were still shit regardless of who got them.

[cFortyfive]

Why? They buffed the amount of personal loot drops per raid size in HFC. You earned more drops per player than master loot. Nearly every drop the first few resets is an upgrade right? All the shitty items were still shit regardless of who got them.

Well matter of taste I suppose I'd still prefer to pump everything into the strongest specs and maybe classes.

[Relapses]

Well matter of taste I suppose I'd still prefer to pump everything into the strongest specs and maybe classes.

That's indeed the entire purpose of split runs. ML is required to make sure you're funneling the right gear to the right people. I don't know any progression guilds who did personal loot split runs even after it was "buffed."

[Deleted]

You do not get two if you succeed, I'm in Beta and doing these Mythic plenty.

I'm pretty sure I got 2 in at least in 3 runs the past few days. I'm not sure if I even got more.

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You only get one chest, by the way.

The end of the dungeon had at least 2 chests on multiple runs I did.

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It isn't. But there have been times when they have stated they wanted to add features which help players save them from themselves.

They said that's that's the whole design of World Quests to say the least. It's supposed to reward minimal stuff if you log in much more than others. Or at least that's what they said they wanted for the expansion and part of it was World Quests.

[RedGamer030]

The end of the dungeon had at least 2 chests on multiple runs I did.

One chest for the weekly.

[Zyky]

You can't save people from themselves in a game built on better rewards with greater time investment.

Somewhat false. You implement gating. An example for everything you've said:

1) Split Raids: Very hard to gate this, so I agree with that.
2) Mythic+: Cap the amount of Mythic Dungeons players can do on the account wide level.
3) Legendaries: Limit 1 Legendary per account per month.
4) Titanforged: Limit the amount of Titanforged items the toon can equip, increasing over time. Think how crafted gear worked in WoD, except it'll eventually be more than 3 equip-able.
5) Artifact Power: Weekly cap on how much you can obtain weekly.

It isn't hard to gate content, they're just doing a fanbase expansion right now to attempt to salvage the shitstorm that WoD was.