No racial bias in police shootings, new study finds

[Themius]

Can I get you on record saying socioeconomic issues and poverty are the problem, rather than systemically racist cops? Because then I would agree with you.

Black lives matter isn't trying to fight black on black crime or poverty.

socioeconomic issues and poverty are the problem. I've always said that most of the crimes are down to these issues.

[Hana Song]

Really? You want to blame their skin color instead of things like socioeconomic status?

It's not socioeconomic status that makes you commit a crime, it's your own choice to be a scumbag

[Themius]

The fact that you're poor doesn't make it okay or even understandable to commit crimes that you might not otherwise commit.

Who said it makes it okay? Urban poor whites commit crimes almost to the exact same degree as urban poor blacks.

[Bollocks]

This study doesn't take into account population sizes. When you account for the relative populations of whites & minorities it makes minorities still more likely to be shot. Takes about 30 seconds to figure that out (or to not just link the first article you read).

On that regard it says that their data is flaws. So the statement by the OP is misleading.

[TheMediator]

At the end of the day, it's really a non issue. Yes, criminals die to cops, and yes there is a very, very small chance of a wrongful police death. Unless the United States is willing to revoke the second amendment, then that fact isn't really going to change. If they want to ratify the Second amendment to only protect the right to shotguns and hunting rifles, then by all means, do it, but good luck getting the millions, if not billions of handguns and semi automatic rifles off the street, especially from criminals. Law abiding citizens will comply begrudgingly, but criminals will continue to carry guns, no matter the laws.

30,00 people die every year in automobile accidents. Your argument, then, is that we shouldn't care when people are intentionally run over or look into potential bias if certain racial groups were targeted by vehicular homicide more often because automobile accidents are proportionately a much larger cause of death on the road?

No. You fix what you can fix. You can't stop cars from traveling the streets and can't stop the tens of thousands of yearly automobile accidents, but you can investigate vehicular homicides and clamp down on the underlying causes of them.

[Kank]

As a cop I can say I shoot first ask race later..... pew pew!

[Rooflesstoofless]

Fact 1: African-Americans are stopped by police much more often.

Is this due to them being black or because they are living in crime riddled areas where the police pull more people over in general? Do you know who else gets pulled over a lot in these areas? Out of place white people because they are probably looking to buy drugs.

Fact 2: African-Americans have violence used against them much more often.

By other blacks.

[petej0]

There's actually a post making the rounds on Facebook by a black cop suggesting just that.

Personally I've always said that the core of all this "racism" stuff is really an issue of income inequality and how difficult it is for the majority of people at the very bottom in America to rise to a decent standard of living. (and don't bring up anecdotal "bootstrap" stories, those are very much not the norm and take an exceptional person)

Anecdotes aside, "I am poor, so I will rob the 7-11" is not an excuse and will not fix your position in life. All that aside, what do you want the cops to do? Should they not enforce the laws?

But unfortunately every single large scale program that gets proposed to do something about that is labeled "socialism" and gutted or destroyed.

NO, NO, NO....This is the result of raising taxes.

When you raises taxes, the people who can afford to, leave. Leaving those who cant left behind to pick up the slack. So what happens, in the great wisdom of politicians, they raise taxes again. This continues the outward migration into the cheaper 'burbs. This is how you decimate a tax base. Now all you have left are those who cant afford to leave, poverty and crime. Then you look around and wonder why no new businesses open up. You cant get businesses to open to serve the local community because of cost, crime and the people who live there cant afford what your selling anyways. So there will be no jobs, on top of all that.

[Slant]

http://www.nytimes.com/2016/07/12/up...ings.html?_r=0



Interesting read. It does say that blacks are more likely to face non-lethal methods of force when confronted by the police as well, but when it comes to lethal use of force blacks were either less likely to be shot or there was no difference between blacks and whites.

Isn't Florida like the whitest state of the south? If so, this study seems to be looking in the wrong place.

[Naxere]

Did anyone actually read the article? I feel like most people here didn't even bother to read the article.

Here is an excerpt from the article:

Official statistics on police shootings are poor. James Comey, the F.B.I. director, has called the lack of data “embarrassing and ridiculous.” Even when data exists, the conditions under which officers decide to fire their weapons are deeply nuanced and complex."

Which is why jumping to the immediate conclusion that "the police are out there killing black folk" is beyond retarded. Every situation involving an officer shooting a suspect is different.

[Bollocks]

Isn't Florida like the whitest state of the south? If so, this study seems to be looking in the wrong place.

Its not even that, but the data that the study uses, when it comes to lethal force is insufficient. So the statement of the OP is misleading in this regard.

[shimerra]

It's not socioeconomic status that makes you commit a crime, it's your own choice to be a scumbag

Sure, maybe in herp derp land where instead of thinking you herp and derp. No one said it MAKES you commit crime, but to say that it doesn't influence people/provide incentives to commit crime is stupid. Whichever side of the debate you fall on about police and race the relationship between crime and poverty is not disputed. No matter how much moralistic hand waving you want to do.

[Hana Song]

Sure, maybe in herp derp land where instead of thinking you herp and derp. No one said it MAKES you commit crime, but to say that it doesn't influence people/provide incentives to commit crime is stupid. Whichever side of the debate you fall on about police and race the relationship between crime and poverty is not disputed. No matter how much moralistic hand waving you want to do.

You are wrong, it is disputed and is only one of many theories

[Themius]

What does that have anything to do with it. Being poor does no excuse you to murder someone. Being poor does not excuse you to commit any crime. The fact that they are committing crimes and those crimes are committed within a geographically small and racially segregated areas causing for a larger police force and more police vs public encounters is cause.



I bet they are out there, but for some reason they dont make the news coverage. For some reason blacks killing other blacks and blacks killing whites goes largely unnoticed and un(der)reported. However if it is a White person or a Police officer, it is a vastly different story. Then we are SOLD on the notion that we are a racist country and race relations are strained, when it really isnt. It is just crime. Because a white person (even better a cop) killing a black person equals ratings. It is a news cycle boom!

Many rapists were once abused as children... does that statement suddenly mean that rape is okay and excusable? Stating a reason for something, doesn't mean you're excusing it. What's wrong with you?

- - - Updated - - -

The study controls for the # of acts. Nobody is denying that police mistreat blacks, we are denying the narrative that cops walk around the city ready to shoot blacks. Every cop in the US knows if they shoot a white guy it'll be a case open, case closed situation. A cop will most likely put themselves in danger more to avoid shooting a black guy because they know that shooting a black guy is going to get them in a lot of trouble and their city/precinct/etc.

Plus who is to say that it isn't African Americans who are more violent than other races which leads to more violent reactions from the police. Everyone knows blacks have got attitude, talk to a cop like they are a punk and don't be shocked when they slam you down a bit harder when they are putting the cuffs on. Not saying its right, but don't poke the bear if you don't want the paw.

Blacks have got attitude? What the fuck is this?

[shimerra]

You are wrong, it is disputed and is only one of many theories

Fine I'll rephrase. It is disputed by idiots with no knowledge of statistics. Much in the same way other idiots dispute that the earth is round and claim it is flat.

[Hana Song]

Fine I'll rephrase. It is disputed by idiots with no knowledge of statistics.

No, it is just one theory among many others and has not been proven true
That is why it's called a theory, yet people like you insist that it's not just a theory and that it's true

[TheMediator]

You are wrong, it is disputed and is only one of many theories

Disputed by who? There's a massive base of evidence that links economic status and likelihood of criminal activity. Can't tell if serious.

[bladeXcrasher]

https://youtu.be/jmE990-eUiw

Pretty relevant in these discussions.

[Hana Song]

Disputed by who? There's a massive base of evidence that links economic status and likelihood of criminal activity. Can't tell if serious.

It's just a theory among many, search for crime theories on google and you will see all the others
It's all on the criminal who chooses to commit a crime, poverty doesn't make it, he makes the choice himself

[Deleted]

No, it is just one theory among others and has not been proven true
That is why it's called a theory, yet people like you insist that it's not just a theory and that it's true

A theory still has to stand a certain metric of attempts at being disproven, to even get past a Hypothesis.

It's not as gradient as "Not true" or "Just plain true".

You regularly go out of your depth in terms of what you can handle, when it comes to logical discussions - This time, you are insanely far out, just so you know.