Day1 of raid - "know the fights" required

[Deleted]

Get rid of the dungeon journal and stop hosting public tests of content before it is released.

That will never happen as too many people have grown dependent on having their hands held through content these days. Today there are a few guilds that figure everything out, the rest of us just walk in their footsteps.

Wiping all night in HSlabs or Karazhan for just even a bit of progression was quite the norm back then, with today's generation it is unthinkable.

Because having bosses being completely unkillable like pre nerf C'Thun, because he was never tested is such a good idea.

[shadowmatrix]

It's a damn sight better than going in knowing absolutely nothing about the fight. You know what the mechanics are and have an idea of what to do, then it's just execution.

I've watched people who tested the raid and even they didn't really know the fight. They had to go in and wait to see what had changed since beta. There is a difference between knowing the mechanics and knowing the fight.

[Ryxxi]

I'm gonna watch a walkthrough of zelda before I play it.

you comparison is not logical.... how do you even compare a single player game to boss that requires 20 people to coordinate , in order to kill it ?

OP is qqing cuz he cant be lazy and get carried.

[Glyngaris]

Yeah let me look up a walkthrough of mega man before I play the game!

You need to take a short drop from a tall tree you stupid cunt. Your analogies are some of the most idiotic shit I have read on this forum and that's saying a lot. If you are too much of a dumb piece of shit to look at the dungeon journal before wasting a group's time you should uninstall the game.

infracted

[Vargas]

I don't know. Why do you feel unable to read a guide? Why is your convenience more important than the time of others you would raid with?

Watching a video isn't the same as "knowing the fight". Not remotely.

Why are you guys so stupid and impatient?

[Acww52]

it has to do with ptr/beta. FF14 doesn't have beta/ptr so when new raids come out people have to spend time learning them. Usally takes a week or 2 before a decent guide is out.

[Hotmail]

Yes, that is fine. But if the solution was already out there, would you still be trying to reinvent the wheel?

Yes, I would. Reinventing the wheel is often a plausible idea in certain fields i.e. programming. Down the road it will tend to result in having a stronger grasp on what you are doing.

[ShiyoKozuki]

Isn't being handed down guides done by other players and all the basic information required in-game spoonfed, not the other way around?

Yeah.
These people calling us "lazy"and "incompetent" and "griefers" and "horrible players" are basically running around with their pants on their head. They are literally those things, it makes no sense.

[Hctaz]

What went wrong with this games community? How can we fix it?

This is literally how the game has been since I've been raiding in Wrath of the Lich king. You are always required to know the fight. You look up how to kill it before you go in. You don't go in and figure the fight out as you go along. It's literally never been that way.

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Watching a video isn't the same as "knowing the fight". Not remotely.

Why are you guys so stupid and impatient?

"know the fights" just means look up a guide. They aren't asking you to have done them before.

[Tharkkun]

Good thing I don't pug!

Nor do you actively raid. So I guess your statement is true. You don't need to watch videos if you never raid.

[purebalance]

What went wrong with this games community? How can we fix it?

People like you is what went wrong.

The fights have been available for learning for months now.

Every guild I had been in made it mandatory in the past to watch videos and read guides for bosses before we started working on them. You are the outlier.

[ShiyoKozuki]

This is literally how the game has been since I've been raiding in Wrath of the Lich king.

That's weird, I raided in ICC during WOTLK with 0 raid gear and 0 raid experience on my holy paladin, and in 1 month I got fully geared and killed heroic arthas 10 man. Never watched a video once.

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Nor do you actively raid. So I guess your statement is true. You don't need to watch videos if you never raid.

I raid?
I cleared heroic HFC the final few months of WOD then quit until Legion. I also quit at the beginning of WOD from disgust so didn't raid until HFC when I was looking forward to Legion and wanted some gear to make leveling easier + bored out of my mind.
I raided in ICC.
I mainly PvP, but I've also raided in games vastly more difficult than this like FF14.

Thanks for the ad hominem attacks though!

[Grimbold of Skullcrusher]

Lfr hero with anime name makes yet another stupid thread.

[Orange Joe]

That's weird, I raided in ICC during WOTLK with 0 raid gear and 0 raid experience on my holy paladin, and in 1 month I got fully geared and killed heroic arthas 10 man. Never watched a video once.

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I raid?
I cleared heroic HFC the final few months of WOD then quit until Legion. I also quit at the beginning of WOD from disgust so didn't raid until HFC when I was looking forward to Legion and wanted some gear to make leveling easier + bored out of my mind.
I raided in ICC.
I mainly PvP, but I've also raided in games vastly more difficult than this like FF14.

Thanks for the ad hominem attacks though!

So what you are saying is that because you join a guild at the end of a expansion pack, and cleared bosses with people that are already geared and know the fights. That people shouldn't expect their raid members to know the fights at the start?

[Ghosti]

Yeah let me look up a walkthrough of mega man before I play the game!

Sounds like you're getting alot of feedback from those who are just looking for achievements/e-peen measuring as opposed to your idea of enjoying a game fully.

[Deleted]

It's a shame we can't quarantine them in their own server.

[Ragedaug]

I understand the desire for a Raid Leader to save a couple attempts by making sure that everyone has an idea of what to expect but I'm an adult with responsibilities and bills to pay, ain't got time to treat a game like it's homework.

The problem I have with this line is that it's not just your time that's under consideration. For this specific scenario in this thread, we are talking about impacting the free time of 9+ other adults with bills to pay and real life responsibilities just like you.

So if you are with a group who all agree that they get better game time efficiency (less of their personal time wasted) by researching the fights before hand, then you are wasting their time for the sake of your time, which you have decided in singly more important than all of their time combined.

IMO, this is a selfish attitude.

Personally, I prefer to learn it by playing it, but that's why I play with people who are the same. When I've run with competitive guilds I researched the fights because they were trying to be competitive and they all researched the fights, and so I wouldn't be wasting their time by causing wipes, I researched them.

[Traveler Voltin]

reading up on a fight only does so much.
experiencing it first hand allows you to better understand the fights.

[Beelzabi]

That's weird, I raided in ICC during WOTLK with 0 raid gear and 0 raid experience on my holy paladin, and in 1 month I got fully geared and killed heroic arthas 10 man. Never watched a video once.

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I raid?
I cleared heroic HFC the final few months of WOD then quit until Legion. I also quit at the beginning of WOD from disgust so didn't raid until HFC when I was looking forward to Legion and wanted some gear to make leveling easier + bored out of my mind.
I raided in ICC.
I mainly PvP, but I've also raided in games vastly more difficult than this like FF14.

Thanks for the ad hominem attacks though!

LoL, then you should give thanks to the guys who take their time to explain the fights before the pull.

[MechaMoose]

how often do you SETUP raids though? have you ever tried to get a raid together yourself for anything serious of just mostly signed up for other peoples raids?