Day1 of raid - "know the fights" required

[lazorexplosion]

Seriously, I don't know how anyone is surprised that the modern MMORPG market has moved towards easy and unsocial games when it is so blindingly obvious from player behavior that the majority of people hate wiping and don't want to talk to other players.

[Cosmophile]

Yeah let me look up a walkthrough of mega man before I play the game!

I'm gonna watch a walkthrough of zelda before I play it.

You keep using this argument, but it's faulty. No one is telling you to look up a leveling guide; raids are a test of execution. A better analogy would be looking up traffic rules before taking a driving test.

[lazorexplosion]

You keep using this argument, but it's faulty. No one is telling you to look up a leveling guide; raids are a test of execution. A better analogy would be looking up traffic rules before taking a driving test.

That is the most idiot analogy I ever heard, because learning traffic rules is mandatory because car accidents kill people. The fact that you're putting PUG raids in a goddamn video game on that level of mandatory importance is embarrassing.

[bubbadubba]

What went wrong with this games community? How can we fix it?

Knowing a fight is pretty simple if you watch a guide. Are they asking for actual experience?

[Factoral]

I think of it a bit like cooking.

Some people, enjoy following the recipe to the letter, so they look the recipe (mechanics) up and follow it to make an enjoyable dish (encounter).

Others, like to have a quick look at the ingredients, then make the dish.

Others maybe know the general ingredients and what may go into the dish, but dont look it up and they enjoy finding out if they are wrong.

Each method is viable, each method has its advantages/disadvantages.

The important thing is finding people that enjoy the same method as you.

I personally like having a quick look at the ingredients of a dish (mechanics) and learn how to complete the dish (encounter).

For example, I know that X boss is going to fire Y ability on my position, but what I don't know exactly is how long can I leave it before Y lands on my head, how far do I need to run before getting out of range of the explosion etc.

[Nicolicious]

There is some lazy ass people in here. How hard is it to read the dungeon journal, or even watching the videos, ONCE. Just to get the idea, if you dont know the fights after that, you are shit. Simple as that. People dont have 100 hours a week to play this game like some do, some of us WORK EVERY DAY, and we want to be as efficient as we can when we are playing. Thats why we require KNOWING the fights. Jesus fucking christ.

[Jewsco]

Yeah let me look up a walkthrough of mega man before I play the game!

People have and do that you know right? Called reading the instructions or reading Nintendo magazine it was a big deal back in the day for that exact reason or did you miss that?

[netherflame]

SE does it with FFXIV and their raids are pretty well balanced...actually their balance is overall better then blizzard(I still like how when one class was too of they instead buffed the others. Or how they do wait and do more precise buffs/nerfs)

I remember walking into BWL and being like.".....uh????? Eggs?" then killing Razorgore and going "hrm cool a big red friendly dragon to help us......NEEEOOOOPPPPPEEEEEEEEEE"

I miss that.

[Molis]

It is not unreasonable to know positioning, know what boss spells are GTFO, know what to cleanse when etc

This has been a thing since Molten Core. If I didn't trash my old PC I could show a word document of the Ragnaros positioning our guild went over.


OP is just answering back to each post with some snarky comment. Nice shit posting in your own thread.

[Airblade]

I guess a doctor shouldn't go to school to learn how to perform surgery and should just walk into the operating room and wing it. He'll learn by experience then.

[Krom2040]

I'm somewhat happy to read the strategies first, but I usually just read about the first three or four fights in a raid before I lose my attention span. It's a lot to ask that somebody read about more than that without actually experiencing it.

[grandgato]

I guess a doctor shouldn't go to school to learn how to perform surgery and should just walk into the operating room and wing it. He'll learn by experience then.

Yes, that's a valid and fair comparison.

I think it's fair to expect players to browse through the Dungeon Journal as it's directly provided by Blizzard, but that's about it.

[Morssoe]

Ok. Enough.

If you read up or watch a video on a fight, you will probably not die (not guaranteed becos, well shit happens).

If you don't, you will not necessarily die (becos depending on personal skill and reaction, you might be able to "wing" it).

Irregardless, researching a fight before doing it will likely increase success chance. Which is probably why some people are making it a requirement.

Should it be a requirement? Of course not. It sure would be nice if everyone in the raid does it though.

Think of it this way, should you always receive a verbal thanks or nod when you hold the door open for a lady? No. Doing a good deed or extending a courtesy does not entitle you to receive appreciation for it.

It sure would be nice though.

Funny thing is that you watching guide and actually doing the fight is different. I have seen so many players fail at mechanics even after watching the guide.

Guide or not, actual results are the same.

- - - Updated - - -

I guess a doctor shouldn't go to school to learn how to perform surgery and should just walk into the operating room and wing it. He'll learn by experience then.

Someone had to start it from somewhere and teach others.

Also, you can't create anything new if you just follow your book.

[Swiftshadow]

Funny thing is that you watching guide and actually doing the fight is different. I have seen so many players fail at mechanics even after watching the guide.

Guide or not, actual results are the same.

- - - Updated - - -



Someone had to start it from somewhere and teach others.

Also, you can't create anything new if you just follow your book.

Yes you are right. Even after watching the fight you can still get the same "dead" result. Watching and doing can easily be 2 different things.

I see it like this. Imagine being a virgin. And of cos eventually watching porn. Of cos when you actually did the deed, it was nothing like what you watched. But at least, you MIGHT get an idea of what to expect before it happened right?

Ok maybe that wasn't a good example.

Just to be clear. I agree that watching strat videos shouldn't be mandatory. I also dislike group leaders requiring ilvl 700 to do content that drops ilvl 700. In fact when I create non+ mythic groups, I purposely state ilvl 825 as "recommended" only (im 848 btw). Sure these people want fast runs, efficiency etc. Be my guest. My group fills up in less than 20 secs. Sure, there may be couple of wipes. But it is definitely less frequent than one would expect from a mostly ilvl 825 pug group.

Ok I digressed with the above but I feel that it is actually related.

[Nakotsu]

get the GTFO addon! You will definitely not stand in shit just to silence that annoying sound.

Thats what DBM is for.

[lazorexplosion]

Every time I PUG I always expect I may have to talk to other people about what needs to be done to not wipe. Because it is easy to do, takes barely any time, is helpful, friendly, social, noticeably improves the success of the group.

Despite that being so unambiguously easy and positive, you people still won't do it. And then people complain that MMORPGs aren't social.

[Molis]

It seems to be harder than it should be to find people who play WoW for fun.

Not sure what that says about the community but I don't think it bodes well.

I would much rather go into an instance with a bunch of friendly idiots than with a group of "serious" players.

It seem like the people who play this game don't have hard enough jobs during the daytime.

Sure with a 5 man and your friends I agree with you, did it last night for VH, but wasting 29 other peoples time because the OP cant take 30 seconds to read the dungeon journal reeks of the I must have it now shit millennial attitude.

The community is not the problem on this one. The OP should take the time to find like minded individuals and go raid with them, and not show up 5 minutes before the raid and say, Hi guys lets kill this boss.....what does he do?

[Siq1ne]

What went wrong with this games community? How can we fix it?

The only thing wrong is people use 1 experience and wrap it up as "the community." Seriously do some research. You'll see why you only remember this one bad occassion and forgot the last 3-dozen great occassions.

[Sorrior]

I remember walking into BWL and being like.".....uh????? Eggs?" then killing Razorgore and going "hrm cool a big red friendly dragon to help us......NEEEOOOOPPPPPEEEEEEEEEE"

I miss that.

Annoying when running for transmog but I bet was fucking epic when fresh. We need more mechanic fights

[Charge me Doctor]

I have no issues with "knowledge required", but "experience required" (in context of already finishing raid on PBE) is dumb as fuck.