[Speculation] I wonder how the Nightborne will regard the Night Elves post Elisande

[Wildmoon]

Isn't she hiding under her goddess dress her entire life ? Also, not one but two strong males around her, so tyrande is last person to judge anyone.

Tyrande risked everything just like everyone else. The nightborne didn't bring down the shield because they just thought everything was lost which could be translated into cowardice and selfishness. They didn't even consider the chance that their people were out there needing help.

[Combatbutler]

But if they start to drink arcwine the nightborne will probably become manaddicts again. Also, night elves dont want a super powerful magic well, if they wanted so, they would have burned Nordrassil.

I don't see a reason of why commoner night elves would want to have a giant arcane well (the only ones that would want that are the shen'dralar highborne since they're already manaddicts)

The night elves have come to love the new well of eternity and are quite distressed that the legion almost destroys it, not to mention they plaster their territories with founts of arcane power, the moonwells.

[Orquitis]

But that well didn't worked like the original woe, thats the purpourse of Nordrassil, to contain the unstable arcane energies of the well. Night elves bless the moonwels with elune light and nature magic they use them to heal wounds and purify stuff. Not that they're addict to its water just because they have a drop of woe water.

[Enthralled]

I agree on points 1 and 3,

but it feels right they should have a nightwell, they and their night elf kin - sort of like at long last, the Well of Eternity they lost, they get a second chance, corruption free to do the right thing with such power - they've had 10k years of discipline. It should be a joint night elf/nightborne thing too, it's almost poetic, has a nice symmetry being the night version of the Sunwell.

The nightborne despite having to overly rely on the nightwell, did use it responsibly and for good for the 10k years they employed it. Now with the resistance showing it's worth by fighting the Legion, and by being cured by the arcan'dor, add that to the night elves tie to the world tree and 10k years of discipline to not use the arcane, I think there would be no better stewards.

Even though I don't like the Night elves nor the nightborne much, and I'd prefer the blood elves to be running Suramar, if I put that aside for a moment and consider it from a night elf perspective.. why would I destroy the Nightwell instead of cleanse it so I can use it for good, now in responsible hands? Would be an amazing end to see Night elves get a proper power source back after 10k years, and Tyrande of all people should understand that you don't destroy the Emerald Dream because of the Nightmare corruption, you destroy the corruption that has made the druids and even demi-gods all mad, once you fix it you use it for good. Corruption of the nightwell made a lot of bad happen, with healing achieved now, they can now use it for good.

That's an interesting line of speculation. Illidan gave the night elves a second Well of Eternity, for which he was vilified as we all know, but which turned out to be a great blessing in disguise. Despite the fact that the night elves other than the Highborne were scandalized by its presence, they wound up using it over the millennia for several important things (the creation of moonwells not least). And as we see in one of the druid class hall campaigns (resto I think?) the Legion finally gets to the second Well and almost drains it dry. So -- some sort of long-term allegiance or arrangement with Elisande (or whoever remains in charge of Suramar) to somehow get access to the Nightwell after all is said and done would be a very smart thing for Tyrande to do.

She has no reasonable justification to call for it to be destroyed. In ancient times, the reasoning was that such power sources worked as beacons for the Burning Legion. That ship sailed a looooong time ago.

If I am being 100% honest though, I'm thinking that the Nightwell should be available to all elves. The above was speaking just about night elves, but I could write a similar paragraph on why and how the high/blood elves need after-war permanent access, and actually they have an even better justification for working directly with the Nightborne on how to manage the well in the open world without a shield.

I wonder if the nightwell would turn night elves who use it into nightborne? minus the addiction because that has been cured now

The comic gave me the strong impression that the physical changes to the Nightborne happened over a long period of time and had more to do with a combination of the fact that under the shield, it was a nocturnal-like atmosphere all the time; and the constant exposure to the arcane not just from Nightwell's presence but even as sustenance.

Edit: fixed a horribly mangled sentence at the end

[Combatbutler]

But that well didn't worked like the original woe, thats the purpourse of Nordrassil, to contain the unstable arcane energies of the well. Night elves bless the moonwels with elune light and nature magic they use them to heal wounds and purify stuff. Not that they're addict to its water just because they have a drop of woe water.

That is not really relevant, if the arcane source is powerful enough and you are close to it you will become addicted at one point, which is why most of the high elves became addicted to the sunwell, despite the fact most of them were not casters, they were nearly exposed to its power.

[Zulkhan]

Sayeth wat? Are you telling me there's a difference? What's next, you'll try to argue there's a difference between these two and canon lore or obvious truths? Well, let me tell you something. If speculation was Night Elves and fanfiction was Shen'dralar, then following this analogy canon would be Nightborne (in more than one way), and obvious truths would be Night'dorei. All part of the larger family of descriptive nocturnal night elves of the night, that are just in varying states of night. But their night elven(n)ess is undeniable. Just like both canon and fanfiction are valid pieces of descriptive canon lore (but remember, it's not actually a term, I'm just describing a point here).

But I think the problem here is that someone didn't notice the link between Khadgar and khaleesi first and is putting the more perceptive users down. Take a chill night elven(n)ess pill Zullan.

But what if I say they're all different terms in the same manner Night Elves and night elves are blatantly different? Is your world starting to crumble, isn't it?

[Combatbutler]

The comic gave me the strong impression that the physical changes to the Nightborne happened over a long period of time and had more to do with a combination of the fact that under the shield, it was a nocturnal-like atmosphere all the time; and the constant exposure to the arcane not just from the even as sustenance.

Well according Thalyssra and Chonicle the nightwell is responsible for their change, not to mention Arcane power has quite the effect on mortal beings, hence why tauren and elves exist today.

[Zulkhan]

That is not really relevant, if the arcane source is powerful enough and you are close to it you will become addicted at one point, which is why most of the high elves became addicted to the sunwell, despite the fact most of them were not casters, they were nearly exposed to its power.

Are we sure that a Nordrassil-contained mini-WoE can actually cause addiction to those merely standing around? Sure, Night Elves exploit the Well's powers but I doubt they were ever dependent from it as Blood Elves were towards the Sunwell. In WC3 their biggest concern was losing immortality and all the boons cast by the Aspects on Nordrassil.

[Enthralled]

Well according Thalyssra and Chonicle the nightwell is responsible for their change, not to mention Arcane power has quite the effect on mortal beings, hence why tauren and elves exist today.

What I am saying is that I don't think it would happen immediately, which was the question. Chronicle states outright that it didn't happen immediately with night elves and with tauren -- they evolved as a result of exposure.

Pretty sure Dath'remar Sunstrider and his followers immediately changed into High Elves upon creation of the Sunwell -- that's the difference I am thinking of.

[Combatbutler]

Are we sure that a Nordrassil-contained mini-WoE can actually cause addiction to those merely standing around? Sure, Night Elves exploit the Well's powers but I doubt they were ever dependent from it as Blood Elves were towards the Sunwell. In WC3 their biggest concern was losing immortality and all the boons cast by the Aspects on Nordrassil.

Since it is rather mufffled with the tree on top of it and we don't know just how potent moonwells are, it is possible the arcane radiation so to speak is not enough to cause an addiction, not that it really matters anymore with the introduction of the Arcandor, which cures magical addiction

[ravenmoon]

I wonder how the Nightborne will actually regard the Night elves, who are actually the group that left Suramar to fight Azshara, and they won. Will they be ashamed that they hid under a shield? Woud they venerate them? The Nightborne Thaedris Feathermoon seems to indicate that the Nightborne venerate the night elves who lost their lives defending the city. Which makes me wonder if they'll actually view the current night elves with awe - post Elisande ofc.. cos currently under Elisande, the loyalists seem to be the ones with the voice and they just look down on every one, like everyone. Therefore thsoe who oppose them have been humbled and had to put away whatever arrogance they may have had to accept help, and as such will have more of an open and less judgemental mind especially after others have seen them grovelling for mana on the brink of death and have helped them. Thalyssra and the nightborne alongside the rebels will never have that undiluted arrogance the loyalists and especially the felsworn bunch have.

I know how the Night elves view them, Valewalker Farodin, The Moonguard and Tyrande's views are being shown, and it seems to be endearing, the Valewalker really likes them and is confident they can be fully saved and are worht the efforts, the Val'sharah night elves and the Moonguard remnant have also found refuge under Thalysrra's wings and help the rebellion - Tyrande is upset with them, but it seems the kind of upset of a person who deeply cares and has been disappointed with a well loved family member they expected much better from is, it doesn't come off as a hate or disdain, but rather anger at a sibling who's been behaving foolishly - at least that's how it comes off to me.

What I wonder is how the nightborne populace will view their kin.. no one has really celebrated the Night elves victory over the Legion, twice - I wonder if the Nightborne under Thalyssra will find new heroes in thier ancient kin who are from their city afterall and probably have relations. I wonder if their memory is the stuff of Legends - The young High priestess who was thought killed before her time - the novel should be interesting. I wonder.. do you?

They should get along quite well. At least that is my hope. They are smart enough to realize their need for each other. Night elves are desperately in need of an arcane power source and arcane magic wielders being quite weak in that department, and the few dozen Shen'dralar highborne nowhere near enough. They only a few years ago started embracing their ancient heritage again, because of the need, and that need has increased, the nightborne have both the expertise and the power they need to supplement and complete them, making the arcane a strong aspect of their society. And this time in balance, with the nightborne able to be balanced by the influence of the night elves.

The nightborne ofc, we see have need for the balance from nature, they are getting via the Arcan'dor with the druids help, this is their greatest need. Not to mention the corruption of the Nightwell seems like a job for Elune, seeing how a Naaru cleansed the Sunwell, how amazing it would be if we saw Elune in action here. Lacking faith and a priesthood, it makes sense also that they reconnect to with their faith here too, something that would be an encouragement to them. I'm sure it would also delight Tyrande to see her home city return to the fold of Elune. Not to mention being night elves now with a tree to help and after being couped up in a city for 10k years, I'm sure there will be nightborne yearning to enjoy the forest and enhance their re-connection to nature.

They seem a perfect fit for each other. It doesn't mean they'll enter an alliance or anythign like that, although that is my hope, what it does at least hint at is a good relationship. Afterall if the Bronzebeards can have a good relationship with the Wildhammers, separate, but in good terms, I can't think why even more so the night elves and the nightborne elves cannot - especially since both groups are from the same place, one group left to fight Azshara and won, saving the world, the other group remained and their actions helped make the victory possible even though they didn't know that. Though they've become different peoples, they would have friends and family amongst each other, which should also help the reconnection once the Legion business is done.

- - - Updated - - -

So Nightborne becoming one with themselves? I'm confused.

But what if I say they're all different terms in the same manner Night Elves and night elves are blatantly different? Is your world starting to crumble, isn't it?

oh dear, another thread tinged by your sour tones

what is wrong with you guys, are you jumping on every night elf or nightborne thread just to stir up trouble and mock? Is that the best use of your time? Hey lets pop on every thread and try and spoil it.

@Aucald you not going to censure these guys, they seem to be doing this on several threads now, meaningful contribution seems a secondary concern, mocking and aggravation primary. It's stinking up the place a bit.

- - - Updated - - -

Since it is rather mufffled with the tree on top of it and we don't know just how potent moonwells are, it is possible the arcane radiation so to speak is not enough to cause an addiction, not that it really matters anymore with the introduction of the Arcandor, which cures magical addiction

maybe the tree itself and connection to nature creates the necessary balance for them. But it isn't really tested as they weren't using arcane magic. But it doesn't matter any more, the Arcan'dor provides a powerful enough remedy to cure the nightborne who've been using the arcane quite intensely for millenium, it would certainly do the same in arcane Night Elves who become imbalanced. Perhaps the Hyjal group's balance was restored by being linked to Nordrassil, allowing a similar fusion of Nature with the arcane to balance them - WotA did say they were in withdrawal when they lost the first Well. But despite being suffused by the second, they've never been out of balance, and that may have had nothing to do with not using the arcane for spellwork, and everything to do with the tree.

Besides we know the principle reason they don't use the 2nd Well or the arcane for spellwork is because they thought it was a sure bonfire signal for the Legion, and would bring the destruction of the world, not because they may or may not have been able to control their usage. But the point is irrelevant now, they have a solution.

It is nice too, as the blood elves also found a solution to their well troubles, and what a story that was, a dying Naaru...I really enjoyed that in TBC, it was magical. I hope they re-create even give more of the same wonder in this night elf based expansion.

[Aucald]

oh dear, another thread tinged by your sour tones

what is wrong with you guys, are you jumping on every night elf or nightborne thread just to stir up trouble and mock? Is that the best use of your time? Hey lets pop on every thread and try and spoil it.

Aucald you not going to censure these guys, they seem to be doing this on several threads now, meaningful contribution seems a secondary concern, mocking and aggravation primary. It's stinking up the place a bit.

My preference is for open discussion and debate so long as it is polite and constructive. I won't censure or otherwise minimize anyone's opinions on a given matter, regardless of which position I personally agree or disagree with. However, if I get the feeling that this is a personal vendetta that is beginning to form across multiple threads I will take action to prevent it from derailing a given topic - action that will effect *all* parties in question.

[Mehrunes]

But what if I say they're all different terms in the same manner Night Elves and night elves are blatantly different? Is your world starting to crumble, isn't it?

Considering that the manner in question is "same-same, but different, but still the same", not particularly, no Oo

Are we sure that a Nordrassil-contained mini-WoE can actually cause addiction to those merely standing around? Sure, Night Elves exploit the Well's powers but I doubt they were ever dependent from it as Blood Elves were towards the Sunwell. In WC3 their biggest concern was losing immortality and all the boons cast by the Aspects on Nordrassil.

Can't think of any mentions of addiction, but then again can't think of any Night Elves being severed from new WoE for it to become apparent (since if the addiction is present, the World Tree erupting didn't seem to do anything here). But as Combat said, the World Tree is dampening it.

What I am saying is that I don't think it would happen immediately, which was the question. Chronicle states outright that it didn't happen immediately with night elves and with tauren -- they evolved as a result of exposure.

Suramar introduction cinematic mentions that the Nightwell changed them slowly. How slowly is unknown I think. The previous sentence mentions something about centuries but it was in regards to how long they were beneath the dome. But perhaps it's also an implication of the length of the changing process.

Pretty sure Dath'remar Sunstrider and his followers immediately changed into High Elves upon creation of the Sunwell -- that's the difference I am thinking of.

Hmm, did they? I recall reading in a recent thread there may have been some retcon in how fast they changed lately but I can't recall which way it went.

oh dear, another thread tinged by your sour tones

It's almost as if there was a cause and effect link between appearance of fanfiction and said sour tones. Hmm, I wonder what could have been done to prevent them from appearing

what is wrong with you guys, are you jumping on every night elf or nightborne thread just to stir up trouble and mock? Is that the best use of your time? Hey lets pop on every thread and try and spoil it.

Of course it's not the best use of my time. I could be spreading fanfiction about unspecified franchise on a forum dedicated to said unspecified franchise's actual lore. Alas, I don't feel particularly productive today. The bit about jumping every Night Elf or Nightborne thread sounds familiar by the way. But it wasn't in relation to mockery or stirring up trouble (just lol). Hmm, what was it? Ah, yes, this picture pops into my mind:

Aucald[/MENTION] you not going to censure these guys, they seem to be doing this on several threads now, meaningful contribution seems a secondary concern, mocking and aggravation primary. It's stinking up the place a bit.

And here I thought that it's Northem and his fanfiction.net escapee squad that stinks lore forums up. My bad. I'd still go with their kind in regards to people that require censuring though. Then again it appears one needs to deliberately spread misinformation knowing it is false, like the Lich King fan with a knack for numbers. Northem's teammates convinced of their righteous path seem to be acceptable lately so if any of them happens to be in this thread they can sleep untroubled.

That aside, I do not understand your concern. You just quoted my post in which I finally accepted night elven(n)ess of Nightborne and as such expressed confusion about a post saying that Nightborne have to become Night Elves (since they already are, hence the confusion). How is you convincing me with the strength of your arguments and logic also a bad thing

[Faroth]

I wonder how the Nightborne will actually regard the Night elves, who are actually the group that left Suramar to fight Azshara, and they won. Will they be ashamed that they hid under a shield? Woud they venerate them? The Nightborne Thaedris Feathermoon seems to indicate....

I'm not as far along in the rep build (started the expansion a week or two late), but....

Thaedris Feathermoon?

Any relation to Shandris Feathermoon?

[purebalance]

The nightwell corrupts the nightborne it should be destory, what the hell do you think we are doing right now, have you played the legion, the whole time you are helping them find a cure to the corruption the nightwell brings

Lol what? It does not corrupt. By that logic the Sunwell and the Well of Eternity corrupts. Have you not been playing WoW this whole time? Elven society lived around the WoE and grew dependant on it. The Nightborne closed themselves off and needed something to sustain themselves or they would become wretched. They used nightwell energy to stop that from happening which now instead of wretched they will become withered if they don't keep a supply of it. The blood elves had been draining living things to stop the very same thing until the sunwell was fixed.

We are not finding a cure for the "corruption" of the nightwell. We're finding a cure for what has ailed ALL elven kind on Azeroth, but has affected this group currently.

[Life-Binder]

dunno how the elv relations will go, but Im sure Tyrande will still find a way to bitch at someone

[Mehrunes]

I'm not as far along in the rep build (started the expansion a week or two late), but....

Thaedris Feathermoon?

Any relation to Shandris Feathermoon?

He's actually called Thaedris Feathersong, so nope. Unless there's an additional Thaedris in 7.1 only that I missed, but Blizzard doesn't really use same names for different characters all that much.

[Faroth]

He's actually called Thaedris Feathersong, so nope. Unless there's an additional Thaedris in 7.1 only that I missed, but Blizzard doesn't really use same names for different characters all that much.

Thanks for the correction. I was wondering what was up there.

[Enthralled]

dunno how the elv relations will go, but Im sure Tyrande will still find a way to bitch at someone

Already taken care of, don't worry. ^_^

[Beloren]

If I am being 100% honest though, I'm thinking that the Nightwell should be available to all elves. The above was speaking just about night elves, but I could write a similar paragraph on why and how the high/blood elves need after-war permanent access, and actually they have an even better justification for working directly with the Nightborne on how to manage the well in the open world without a shield.

I don't think they'd want it, they got the sunwell, renewed and very improved now - Rommath is saying they've found their own solutions/path, their glory is their own.

Besides, I'm just itching to see a nightwell v sunwell fight, I hope we get a bit of that in the struggle for all elf love. Nightborne - arcane+nature vs Blood elves arcane+light. as Light >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> Nature, even with the nightwell as a more powerful arcane source than the initial sunwell was, the new Sunwell is more than just arcane, let's just say I'd love to see a fight - before they kiss and make up.

I'm must say Elf lore is exciting again, this new expac really had me intrigued, but I wasn't sure why, as fascinating as night elf/nightborne are, my interest in them is only as the origin of the blood elves - I have concluded I really don't like any of them. I don't like night elves and I like nightborne even less. If I had my way, Suramar would become a Blood elf run city, the nightborne chucked out for their crimes and irresponsible usage, and the night elves exiled to skulk around in the forests they love so much, yes pay back's a bitch.

But I very much doubt that would happen, looks like they'll be sticking around, so I'll settle to see a nightwell v sunwell episode, you can imagine what will be going on in the back of their minds:
BElf "My Sunwell is better than your nightwell."
NbElf "no, my nightwell is superior to your sunwell".
NbElf "My people also have nature of the earth, moon and stars on our side now - so stick it"
BElf "oh yeah, my people have the Light added to the arcane now, the divine power of creation trumps nature, and Sun greater than Moon so hah!"

Truth is they should be working together to defeat fel and death, but who doesn't like a good fight aye!