[HOLY] Holy Sh*t!: Legion Edition

[Deleted]

I beacon myself and LotM the shit out of everyone. Ezgame

[fabonaut]

I beacon myself and LotM the shit out of everyone. Ezgame

LotM does not trigger your Beacon.

[Deleted]

LotM does not trigger your Beacon.

Yes it doesn't

[Rorschachs]

Lotm is really good on Il'gynoth mythic. You gotta be fast at healing yourself with well times bestow faiths, holy shocks and LOD but it pays off.

[Gilthresa]

Lotm is really good on Il'gynoth mythic. You gotta be fast at healing yourself with well times bestow faiths, holy shocks and LOD but it pays off.

That just sounds extremely counter productive.

[Michelis]

Hello everyone, i just dropped "Ilterendi, Crown Jewel of Silvermoon" but i have no clue about this item... there is something i need to know about this ring? a rotation? if it is worth only the item lvl it gives? if i should use the talent " judgment of light" instead the Avenging Wrath's talent?
Would be great if you guys could give me some information about this item.
Sorry for my horrible english i hope all of you could understand my questions.
thanks you in advance for the help!

[Deleted]

Hello everyone, i just dropped "Ilterendi, Crown Jewel of Silvermoon" but i have no clue about this item... there is something i need to know about this ring? a rotation? if it is worth only the item lvl it gives? if i should use the talent " judgment of light" instead the Avenging Wrath's talent?
Would be great if you guys could give me some information about this item.
Sorry for my horrible english i hope all of you could understand my questions.
thanks you in advance for the help!

"Judgement of Light" only if no other Paladin (Tank/Holy) got the Talent.
Judgement should alrdy be part of your rotation if u got the "Knight of the Silver Hand" trait from your weapon to get the x% reduced dmg buff for 4sek.
Be sure to have Holy Shock rdy to get the most out of the 20% Healing boost, just try to plan the 5sek buff. Judgement only got like 10sek cd, so be sure to use it a lot when u get the chance.

[Hawg]

Okay, quick gear question if someone doesn't mind answering real quick.

1. Wracksoul girdle- (835 ivl) 621 crit, 304 haste, 846 int.

2. Arcane defenders belt- (865 Ilvl) 429 haste, 606 mastery, 1,119 int.

My current stats: 33% crit, 42% mastery, 5% haste, 2% vers.

I know Ilvl usually trumps everything but I go from 33% crit to 31% crit. I also go from 42% mastery to 45%.

Need help here. Not really sure what to roll with. And yes, I know my crit is odd compared to mastery, but I've been somewhat unlucky with gear.

I would use the higher ilvl only on stacked fights cause 45% mastery is a bit overkill. Ursoc is a good example if you stand close to the melee and tanks. Also, do you have the darkmoon trinket? Cause you also have to factor crit from there too.

Okay yeah, gonna go with the 835. Not enough Ilvl to disregard stats.

I'm pretty sure you guys are high, right? ;P

Our stat weights are not yet settled in stone yet but even taking a conservative* weighting like these (see below) its clear the higher ilvl trumps unless you are already maxed on crit:

Hi,

I'm in search for stat weights for holy paladins in Legion, so far I have found this: Intellect [9.07] > Crit [7.57] > Mastery [6.07] > Versatility [4.57] > Haste [3.07] taken from http://www.noxxic.com/wow/pve/paladi...stat-priority/

Since I sort of insulted you (in good spirit) I'll do the math for you:

1. Wracksoul girdle- (835 ivl) 621 crit, 304 haste, 846 int.

(621*9.07 = 4701) + (304*3.07= 933) + (846 * 9.07= 7673) = 13,307

2. Arcane defenders belt- (865 Ilvl) 429 haste, 606 mastery, 1,119 int.

(429*3.07= 1317) + (606*6.07 = 3678) + (1119*9.07 = 10,149) = 15,144

So in relative terms item #1 is worth 13,307 vs item 2 at 15,144 meaning item 2 is 12.2% better with those stat weights.


*I say "conservative" with these stat weights because most of the other attempts I've seen at valuing our stat weights value them even closer together than the noxxic weights, so that would value the higher ilvl even more.

[Taeldorian]

@Hawg I got an 885 heroic titanforged vial of nightmare fog last night, so I was able to go for the higher Ilvl belt since the crit gained from the vial still gave me a good amount (34%) without the crit from the 835.

So I went with the higher Ilvl belt anyway. But where are you getting 6.07, 3.07, and 9.07 from? Are those the weights?

I still don't know which is better between vial of nightmare fog (1,062 crit and chance to apply 203.9k shield) or the trinket with 1k int and 882 mastery (835 Ilvl). Not sure which to go with. I'm assuming vial, but I'd still like a second/third opinion.

[EzG]

@Hawg I got an 885 heroic titanforged vial of nightmare fog last night, so I was able to go for the higher Ilvl belt since the crit gained from the vial still gave me a good amount (34%) without the crit from the 835.

So I went with the higher Ilvl belt anyway.

I still don't know which is better between vial of nightmare fog (1,062 crit and chance to apply 203.9k shield) or the trinket with 1k int and 882 mastery (835 Ilvl). Not sure which to go with. I'm assuming vial, but I'd still like a second/third opinion.

The vial will pull ahead whenever the players are going to take a continuous amount of damage like on cenarius. The only issue is getting a bubble on someone and them not taking any damage for the duration in turn wasting the bubble. It's kinda like the old mastery in the sense a great shield can be wasted to taking no damage, but the extra crit will be nice as you inch your way towards the soft/hard cap!

[Taeldorian]

The vial will pull ahead whenever the players are going to take a continuous amount of damage like on cenarius. The only issue is getting a bubble on someone and them not taking any damage for the duration in turn wasting the bubble. It's kinda like the old mastery in the sense a great shield can be wasted to taking no damage, but the extra crit will be nice as you inch your way towards the soft/hard cap!

Yeah I think Vial is what I'm going to go with. Seems like it's better overall and spirit fragments (the shield) does 5%-7% of my healing on most fights so I feel like that's pretty good.

Thank you for the answer!

[Hawg]

Yes those were the stat weights given by noxxic. For dps it's easy, you just sim to get your current stat weights, makes it easy to compare. I'm not sure how they arrive at stat weights for healing, so I just picked noxxic for a demonstration.

- - - Updated - - -

I see I made an error in typing the math, corrected below in red, the totals were correct I just typed it wrong.

I'm pretty sure you guys are high, right? ;P

Our stat weights are not yet settled in stone yet but even taking a conservative* weighting like these (see below) its clear the higher ilvl trumps unless you are already maxed on crit:



Since I sort of insulted you (in good spirit) I'll do the math for you:

1. Wracksoul girdle- (835 ivl) 621 crit, 304 haste, 846 int.

(621*7.57 = 4701) + (304*3.07= 933) + (846 * 9.07= 7673) = 13,307

2. Arcane defenders belt- (865 Ilvl) 429 haste, 606 mastery, 1,119 int.

(429*3.07= 1317) + (606*6.07 = 3678) + (1119*9.07 = 10,149) = 15,144

So in relative terms item #1 is worth 13,307 vs item 2 at 15,144 meaning item 2 is 12.2% better with those stat weights.


*I say "conservative" with these stat weights because most of the other attempts I've seen at valuing our stat weights value them even closer together than the noxxic weights, so that would value the higher ilvl even more.

[LedZeppelin]

where do you stand in the raid in regards to devo aura? do you just stand close enough so 1 tank gets the 10% damage reduct and then move into the raid when you use aura mastery?

[Gilthresa]

where do you stand in the raid in regards to devo aura? do you just stand close enough so 1 tank gets the 10% damage reduct and then move into the raid when you use aura mastery?

You shouldn't be using devo aura?

[EzG]

where do you stand in the raid in regards to devo aura? do you just stand close enough so 1 tank gets the 10% damage reduct and then move into the raid when you use aura mastery?

Why are you using devo aura. In terms of throughput hps the other 2 are much better. Devo aura is only good if your raid plans to use it as an actual defensive raid cd in conjunction with aura mastery.

[Nedralixx]

I'm pretty sure you guys are high, right? ;P

What exactly did I say that you concluded I was high? When you have 45% mastery, it means that you may have been neglecting other stats. Also mastery is a bit tricky and to be honest all these hps comparisons do not take into account that you won't be getting the full increased healing buff out of mastery because they don't factor the noise of imperfect play.

If you're not in a fight where your raid stacks, you can get all the mastery and ilvl you like but still your heals will hit like a wet noodle.

[Genzen Han]

Flask of the Solemn Night any good? I have stat sticks at the moment, one crit, one vers, both 845.

[Deleted]

If you're not in a fight where your raid stacks, you can get all the mastery and ilvl you like but still your heals will hit like a wet noodle.

Only fight I can think of is Il'gynoth, and even then BotL and proper positioning with RoL makes it fine. If something is better, it's better. Pretty simple.

[Hawg]

What exactly did I say that you concluded I was high? When you have 45% mastery, it means that you may have been neglecting other stats. Also mastery is a bit tricky and to be honest all these hps comparisons do not take into account that you won't be getting the full increased healing buff out of mastery because they don't factor the noise of imperfect play.

If you're not in a fight where your raid stacks, you can get all the mastery and ilvl you like but still your heals will hit like a wet noodle.

Because with the stat weights that have been published so far, its a one in a million time when a 30ilvl difference between gear is going to be ignored (excluding set bonuses, hitting a hard cap, or trinkets) with the the lower ilvl difference being better. The math I put above demonstrates why the lower item level in this particular case is the wrong decision.

When we see our stat priority written similar to this int>Crit>Mast>Vers>Haste in many ways that is misleading. Without stat weights we don't really know if that is true for a given piece of equipment. Take for example an equivalent ilvl piece of gear that has 1 int 1 crit 1 mast 1 vers 1 haste vs a piece that has 1 int 3 mast 1 haste. Without stat weights we don't really know which is better.

And as far as mastery, its not a binary function, the bonus it gives degrades the further you get, so it is still giving a bonus (although less) as you get further away. I haven't been in a fight yet in EN (I'm only doing normal and heroic so don't know about Mythic) where 80% or more of the raid wasn't either covered by my mastery or the mastery from the tank due to BoL.

TLDR version: it will almost never be right to say a lower ilvl by 30 ilvls is better, so if you are going to say that you should have concrete proof demonstrating why its the exception to the rule.

[Rorschachs]

That just sounds extremely counter productive.

Not really, you heal people fast - including yourself when you heal with lotm. It's less effective healing in general as you are damaging yourself; but it's really good at saving people. https://www.warcraftlogs.com/ranking...=hps&boss=1873 a lot of top holy paladins on Il'gynoth mythic are doing about %5-10 of their healing with lotm.