[TV] Westworld

[Simulacrum]

This show is terribly boring.

Less boring than 99% of the rubbish on TV though.

[Deleted]

This show is terribly boring.

Couldn't disagree more. Intriguing is exactly what it is. It's no Michael Bay Transformers with explosions every five seconds that's for sure, but it makes you think.

[Grimbold21]

Didn't episode 4 air on sunday night?

[Deleted]

I am impressed by the cast. I hope this series will have an huge success.

I also hope it will move away a bit from the other HBO series, with more action and less sex scenes.

[Feredir]

I find it funny that people find it boring. The biggest thing about this show is that NOTHING, is as it appears. Now I have huge questions based on this week's episode.

1. What is the maze?
2. Is the image of the man in the maze Arnold.
3. If it is Arnold in the maze is he controlling Westworld through a neural interface, or is he an advanced AI.
4. Question 3 brings to mind questions about Dr Ford, is he controlling Westworld with a neural interface or is he also an advanced AI?
5. Is Ed Harris a rogue host that became sentient many years ago and left Westworld?
6. Is Deloris dreaming or she reliving past interactions in that town, or for lack of a better word, hallucinating?

[Deleted]

I find it funny that people find it boring.

Well... I think it's a bit like, there's a certain depth for each person where they find the entertainment in a show, and if it swims in a lot deeper waters, and the viewer can't get there, they'll just end up bored. Some people like the shallowest of shallow action, adventure, romance and so on, and if a show or a movie requires a lot more thought, empathy, and being able to identify with characters, emotions or ideas, and the viewer isn't capable of those things on that level, then they'll just walk away feeling like they didn't get anything out of it.

Plus, not everyone likes everything. I mean, bacon is objectively delicious, but not everyone likes it.

[Simulacrum]

The ability to speculate wildly doesn't mean a show is deep. You can speculate wildly about anything.

Personally, I will be incredibly annoyed if they pull some retarded shit like oh btw this was all a simulation, or a bunch of the people who think they're people are actually robots, or whatever. The twist was fun in fight club. The sixth sense. blah blah. But by now I'm starting to get bored with the shyamalaning.

[Feredir]

The ability to speculate wildly doesn't mean a show is deep. You can speculate wildly about anything.

Personally, I will be incredibly annoyed if they pull some retarded shit like oh btw this was all a simulation, or a bunch of the people who think they're people are actually robots, or whatever. The twist was fun in fight club. The sixth sense. blah blah. But by now I'm starting to get bored with the shyamalaning.

Problem with that line of thought...Westworld did it first.

[Shinzai]

The ability to speculate wildly doesn't mean a show is deep. You can speculate wildly about anything.

Personally, I will be incredibly annoyed if they pull some retarded shit like oh btw this was all a simulation, or a bunch of the people who think they're people are actually robots, or whatever. The twist was fun in fight club. The sixth sense. blah blah. But by now I'm starting to get bored with the shyamalaning.

This line of thought completely pre-dates Shyamalan by a long, long time. Philip K Dick and numerous other sci-fi writers have toyed with these concepts since the mid 1900's, at least. Arthur C Clarke's 2001: A Space Odyssey was one of the first to really bring the idea of a rogue AI to the forefront in the form of HAL 9000, in a way that's never been forgotten. It's not so much a need for a twist as it is a questioning of reality and everything therein.

It's not much of a "What a tweest!" scenario, if the whole concept of the show is about AIs turning rogue, assuming humanity and being used as little more than pleasure slaves for others. This is a subversion, not just a twist.

[RobertoCarlos]

I find it funny that people find it boring. The biggest thing about this show is that NOTHING, is as it appears. Now I have huge questions based on this week's episode.

1. What is the maze?
2. Is the image of the man in the maze Arnold.
3. If it is Arnold in the maze is he controlling Westworld through a neural interface, or is he an advanced AI.
4. Question 3 brings to mind questions about Dr Ford, is he controlling Westworld with a neural interface or is he also an advanced AI?
5. Is Ed Harris a rogue host that became sentient many years ago and left Westworld?
6. Is Deloris dreaming or she reliving past interactions in that town, or for lack of a better word, hallucinating?

1. We don't really know, could just be what he's doing now following the npc trail that now leads to Wyatt. Could be a literal maze created by Arnold to reach the real level design.
2. Dunno maybe
3. Arnold we can assume was human because he's spoken about as a human "he went mad" and had a working relationship with ford. He could have been an AI and ford is more sinister than we are lead to believe but also all the stuff how he didn't like people I think it's more likely he was just a mad scientist that wanted to push the limits of ai
4. Honestly ford could go either way. He seems like a proud dad of his creations and also seems super suspect, thinks he's a god or he could be an ai, he seems very indifferent but that could be the whole genius thing.
5. Need to rewatch it but didn't two of the Cowboys recognize ed as a famous charity owner or something and he tells them to stfu he's on holiday. I think he is human who has spent most of his life in westworld.
6. She's reliving past events like the others but she's also becoming sentient

[Simulacrum]

This line of thought completely pre-dates Shyamalan by a long, long time. Philip K Dick and numerous other sci-fi writers have toyed with these concepts since the mid 1900's, at least. Arthur C Clarke's 2001: A Space Odyssey was one of the first to really bring the idea of a rogue AI to the forefront in the form of HAL 9000, in a way that's never been forgotten. It's not so much a need for a twist as it is a questioning of reality and everything therein.

It's not much of a "What a tweest!" scenario, if the whole concept of the show is about AIs turning rogue, assuming humanity and being used as little more than pleasure slaves for others. This is a subversion, not just a twist.

i wasn't refering to any of that with that comment tho

[Fencers]

Evan Rachel Wood has the most perfectly beautiful face I have ever seen. Show just confirms it.

Fucking genetics, am I right? B*&%$.

- - - Updated - - -

The one rich guy who is there with the dopey guy mooning over Evan Rachel Wood is the only person playing the game sensibly.

I just don't get why any of this shit matters. They are very much playing a 'game'- with god mode enabled.

[RobertoCarlos]

Evan Rachel Wood has the most perfectly beautiful face I have ever seen. Show just confirms it.

Fucking genetics, am I right? B*&%$.

- - - Updated - - -

The one rich guy who is there with the dopey guy mooning over Evan Rachel Wood is the only person playing the game sensibly.

I just don't get why any of this shit matters. They are very much playing a 'game'- with god mode enabled.

She has a face born for the camera. Its symmetrically wonderful.

And shes the PERFECT look for the "Innocent farmers daughter"

Also it would be a completely different show if the hosts/other guests could kill the guests. It would be more hunger games than Jurassic world. I think they are doing it just right.

[Endus]

The one rich guy who is there with the dopey guy mooning over Evan Rachel Wood is the only person playing the game sensibly.

I just don't get why any of this shit matters. They are very much playing a 'game'- with god mode enabled.

I'm gonna keep mentioning this. It's not an MMO-analogue. It's a theme park analogue. The "quests" are a glorified expansion of how you can go on "rides" at Disneyworld to get a certain experience, like being in your favorite movie or whatever. They aren't meant to challenge or threaten the guests, and they've made that VERY clear. Which is also why they're laid out as options, which guests are free to take up or ignore, because it's all about what "rides" the guest wants to experience. The shootout at the corral ride, the kill-a-bunch-of-injuns ride, the bounty-hunter ride, etc. They've connected them into a greater narrative, but it's still basically the guests experiencing a novel, not a "game" of any sort. There's nothing to "win", no markers for "success", no rules other than the barest minimum required for safety.

The only person treating it as a game is Ed Harris' character, and he's apparently the first person in 30 years to realize there WAS a "game" of some sort hidden in the systems. Otherwise, it's like if Disney came up with a Pirates of the Caribbean "world" with similar stuff and let people wander around in there rather than the current ride they have. It's a replacement for the ride, it's NOT a Pirates MMO.

[Fencers]

I'm gonna keep mentioning this. It's not an MMO-analogue. It's a theme park analogue. The "quests" are a glorified expansion of how you can go on "rides" at Disneyworld to get a certain experience, like being in your favorite movie or whatever. They aren't meant to challenge or threaten the guests, and they've made that VERY clear. Which is also why they're laid out as options, which guests are free to take up or ignore, because it's all about what "rides" the guest wants to experience. The shootout at the corral ride, the kill-a-bunch-of-injuns ride, the bounty-hunter ride, etc. They've connected them into a greater narrative, but it's still basically the guests experiencing a novel, not a "game" of any sort. There's nothing to "win", no markers for "success", no rules other than the barest minimum required for safety.

The only person treating it as a game is Ed Harris' character, and he's apparently the first person in 30 years to realize there WAS a "game" of some sort hidden in the systems. Otherwise, it's like if Disney came up with a Pirates of the Caribbean "world" with similar stuff and let people wander around in there rather than the current ride they have. It's a replacement for the ride, it's NOT a Pirates MMO.

The rich guy who was going to shoot Evan Rachel Wood called it a game too. He refers to a 'Easter egg' by breaking the rules of the game narrative.

The entire method in which the narrative the WW creators come up with is functionally a 'game'. It's just a badly designed game- because there is nothing at stake.

[Deleted]

A good theme park analogue might be a roller coaster. You don't get on a roller coaster thinking you might die. You get on it knowing that it'll be absolutely safe. Still, typically you end up screaming your lungs out. Now, obviously, roller coasters do have their glitches, and people do end up dying...which might be exactly what will start happening in Westworld, as well.

Also, if you're identifying with the guests, thinking that none of it matters, then what about when you start wondering if the hosts there are actually "alive", meaning what if their AI is actually conscious? Does it not matter then, when you blow their brains out? Does it not matter when you rape those beings, which might be conscious?

I'm sure the guests have wondered about the level and complexity of the AI, and whether any consciousness does exist. I know I would, if they were that convincing. Plus, as viewers, we already know there are questions rising as to whether several of the AI there are actually starting to be fully aware already. So when you, as a viewer, start recognizing that those robots there aren't necessarily just robots anymore, that's where your empathy should start kicking in, I believe.

because there is nothing at stake.

Except, of course, self-discovery and the humanity of the guests. If you go to Westworld, and the first thing you find yourself doing is murdering and raping the hosts, what does that tell you about yourself? Your decency was at stake, and didn't you just lose any shred of it that was left? Or does it not matter because they're robots? But are they, really, or is their AI conscious?

[SavoirFaire]

I've always enjoyed the theme of an AI slowly coming into its own as it were than the AI that immediately decides to nuke humanity off the face of the earth. That was probably why I enjoyed some of the Animatrix shorts so much as they touched on that theme a few times, but that compilation never seemed to get the credit it deserved. Sounds like I should give Westworld a try.

Soooo is it better to wait until the show is fully released and get whatever HBO streaming (HBO now? go?) has it and just binge watch it? I don't mind paying for it but watching the marvel Netflix series recently was probably the most TV I've watched in 10 years, so I'd rather just be done with it in a few sittings.

[Feredir]

The rich guy who was going to shoot Evan Rachel Wood called it a game too. He refers to a 'Easter egg' by breaking the rules of the game narrative.

The entire method in which the narrative the WW creators come up with is functionally a 'game'. It's just a badly designed game- because there is nothing at stake.

By that definition WoW has always been a bad game because there is no death penalty.

[Shinzai]

i wasn't refering to any of that with that comment tho

So you're not referring to the idea that some of the humans may be unwitting AIs? As that's what I'm commenting on.

[Simulacrum]

So you're not referring to the idea that some of the humans may be unwitting AIs? As that's what I'm commenting on.

I was refering to plot twists being tedious and overused.