Why do people want Mythic Dungeons to be queuable?

[Thage]

It's happening in 7.2 anyway (in that the three current Mythic-only dungeons are getting Heroic queues), and the 7.2 dungeon is shipping with Normal and Heroic versions as well as Mythic, so that tells me the Mythic-only test wasn't as successful as Blizzard would have liked, despite name-checking the large number of Kara groups formed in 7.1. Which I think is a fine middle road; if anything I would close what difficulty gap there is between Heroic and Mythic, make level 110 Normals the current Heroic difficulty, and add extra side-bosses to Mythics as an incentive to keep running it on Mythic/Mythic+ when the queues come out.

[Osmeric]

Sorry but im unable to understand your point, probably there are other reasons behind this "is too hard for lfd" because its not....but whatever, i guess we can live with different opinion on the matter

My point was that your statement that "most of the Mythic dungeons are not challenging at all" is simply wrong, because it is possible for them to be even easier, and because as designed they are likely over the difficulty limit for LFD to work at the intended gear level.

Your statement there can only make sense if you have defocused your mind's eye so much that all lesser difficulty levels merge into a single blur. Don't do that.

[primalmatter]

My point was that your statement that "most of the Mythic dungeons are not challenging at all" is simply wrong, because it is possible for them to be even easier, and because as designed they are likely over the difficulty limit for LFD to work at the intended gear level.

Your statement there can only make sense if you have defocused your mind's eye so much that all lesser difficulty levels merge into a single blur. Don't do that.

I have to admit I don't really understand the desire to lets be honest here lower the difficulty of mythic to accommodate the lfg system.

Who wins with this change? With titanforge it isnt even really keeping up with other people anymore since so long as you keep playing you will get upgrades.

What drives this desire to have everything lowered into a almost level difficulty across the game as a whole?

[Jtbrig7390]

What drives this desire to have everything lowered into a almost level difficulty across the game as a whole?

Accessibility.....

[Osmeric]

I have to admit I don't really understand the desire to lets be honest here lower the difficulty of mythic to accommodate the lfg system.

I think it comes from people frustrated from not getting into mythic 5 man runs. LFD solves this problem, but at a serious cost.

What is needed is better tools for avoiding the problem. They appear to be adding more automated tools for forming groups with players in your social circle. This could be the way to go.

[Jtbrig7390]

I think it comes from people frustrated from not getting into mythic 5 man runs. LFD solves this problem, but at a serious cost.

What is needed is better tools for avoiding the problem. They appear to be adding more automated tools for forming groups with players in your social circle. This could be the way to go.

That is one way to go about it, A more simple way is just having another que system designed for mythic dungeons. Make it have some requirements to que for (For example a gold medal)

Hell I would be ok with it unlocking once you have beaten it via a manual group.

Want to use LFD for Mythics, Then you must clear all base level mythic dungeons before using said tool.

[Dys]

I guess it's a matter of future plans for Blizzard. Why would they waste the time to make mythic0 queue-able if they aren't sure they're even going to keep the mythic/+ system intact?

As it stands, it makes sense to make mythic0 queue-able because of how braindead easy they are. But, it's not as simple as flipping a switch. So, if they're still up in the air about the system, they shouldn't waste time and effort making it more convenient until they're sure they want to keep it this way for future expansions.

[primalmatter]

I think it comes from people frustrated from not getting into mythic 5 man runs. LFD solves this problem, but at a serious cost.

What is needed is better tools for avoiding the problem. They appear to be adding more automated tools for forming groups with players in your social circle. This could be the way to go.

I am not sure better tools would help... if anything tools have made this worst (the exception being cross grouping).

LFD worked really well when it was new and it didn't contain vote to kick rules. People had the same standards as tbc and they policed themselves. Slowly tools were added to protect people who shouldn't be protected and it lead to the group can never wipe in lfd mentality.

At think at some point players need to be told no. We will not make the game easy at every difficulty level to appease you. You have your content let others have theirs.

- - - Updated - - -

I guess it's a matter of future plans for Blizzard. Why would they waste the time to make mythic0 queue-able if they aren't sure they're even going to keep the mythic/+ system intact?

As it stands, it makes sense to make mythic0 queue-able because of how braindead easy they are. But, it's not as simple as flipping a switch. So, if they're still up in the air about the system, they shouldn't waste time and effort making it more convenient until they're sure they want to keep it this way for future expansions.

People wiped in normal wod dungeons...

I want that to sink in.

You are massively overestimating the average wow players skill level. This isnt tbc.

[Jtbrig7390]

I am not sure better tools would help... if anything tools have made this worst (the exception being cross grouping).

LFD worked really well when it was new and it didn't contain vote to kick rules. People had the same standards as tbc and they policed themselves. Slowly tools were added to protect people who shouldn't be protected and it lead to the group can never wipe in lfd mentality.

At think at some point players need to be told no. We will not make the game easy at every difficulty level to appease you. You have your content let others have theirs.

No those tools was added because people abused the fact there was no tools.

So many runs of getting to the final boss just to be kicked so they could invite a guild mate or they did it just for giggles. It wasn't to protect anyone, it was to stop people abusing the shit out of the system.

[primalmatter]

No those tools was added because people abused the fact there was no tools.

So many runs of getting to the final boss just to be kicked so they could invite a guild mate or they did it just for giggles. It wasn't to protect anyone, it was to stop people abusing the shit out of the system.

It was to protect people. Yes what you said did happen but the player being kicked for not picking up add, barely healing, or doing less then 2k dps at the time was far,far more common then that.

[Jtbrig7390]

It was to protect people. Yes what you said did happen but the player being kicked for not picking up add, barely healing, or doing less then 2k dps at the time was far,far more common then that.

Got some proof to back up such a claim?

Bottom line was no system was worse then the current system.

[primalmatter]

Got some proof to back up such a claim?

Bottom line was no system was worse then the current system.

Do you have any proof to back up that claim?

The old system allowed a myriad more levels of difficulty to thrive at the same time. Tbc dungeons had tiers of difficulty between each other on heroic.

You are trying to pass a baseless claim off while asking for proof from another person.

[Jtbrig7390]

Do you have any proof to back up that claim?

The old system allowed a myriad more levels of difficulty to thrive at the same time. Tbc dungeons had tiers of difficulty between each other on heroic.

You are trying to pass a baseless claim off while asking for proof from another person.

Ya the proof is the fact people abused the shit out of it and blizzard had to stop it.

Are you ok with a system people can abuse? A system you can't abuse is better then a system you can. That is the proof, so now that I have proved mine prove yours.

You even admitted to such things happening....

Yes what you said did happen

[primalmatter]

Ya the proof is the fact people abused the shit out of it and blizzard had to stop it.

Are you ok with a system people can abuse? A system you can't abuse is better then a system you can. That is the proof, so now that I have proved mine prove yours.

You even admitted to such things happening....

Now you are strawmanning...

All systems can be abused. You really, really hve to go out of your way to get kicked these days with all the bs tied to removing a player.

[Jtbrig7390]

Now you are strawmanning...

All systems can be abused. You really, really hve to go out of your way to get kicked these days with all the bs tied to removing a player.

Kinda the point, So once again prove your claim.
You said

but the player being kicked for not picking up add, barely healing, or doing less then 2k dps at the time was far,far more common then that.

You have yet to prove that is true.

Stating fact's isn't strawmanning, sorry that you don't have a better argument.

[primalmatter]

Kinda the point, So once again prove your claim.
You said

You have yet to prove that is true.

Stating fact's isn't strawmanning, sorry that you don't have a better argument.

You have no proof but you are asking for it in a post about opinions...

You do not have the position of strength you think you do.

[Polarthief]

Mythic dungeons are 3 man-able. If I don't need 5 bodies, I want to be able to just get extra bodies and a teleport to the dungeon.

^

It's just faster. Not to mention anyone who gives a damn about dungeons with the exception of Karazhan does M+ anyways, and even low M+ like 2-3 is stupidly easy with the gear the game throws at you.

I don't really care because I don't do Mythic 1 (Non-Keystone Mythics) besides Kara, but w/e.

[Darshana]

It's kinda boring refreshing the group finder addon over and over until there's a group suitable for you to join. Sometimes you can sit browsing the available groups for half an hour. But if you just joined a queue you can do other stuff whilst you wait. Same if you're the group leader, you have to stand there and watch the sign ups until you get a full party, which can take time unless you're a tank/healer duo.

[Jtbrig7390]

You have no proof but you are asking for it in a post about opinions...

You do not have the position of strength you think you do.

I gave you proof champ, also you are the one who made the original claim. Be a adult back up your claim or drop it.

Here is some history for ya as well. Every single time blizzard adds a new grouping system people abuse the shit out of it.

LFD - Kicking people just for giggles before the protection system was put in. (Blizzard had to add a protection system)
LFR(Cata) - Rolling on gear that was not needed just so others couldn't get it. (Blizzard had to force PL)
LFG (WOD) - Ninjaing Gear (Blizzard had to force PL for LFG)
Mythic + - Joining Groups just to leave after it starts. (Still needs to be fixed)
The community has shown time and time again if it can it will abuse systems even if its just for giggles. The community can't police itself because there is way to many shitheads in the community.

Is all of the Wow community bad? Nope but enough of it is to warrant system changes.

[clevin]

As someone who mained healer since day1 of playing MMO's in 2003, I disagree. CAT was the only time healing was well designed, fun, rewarding, and good in WOW. Still is the only time, and probably always will be. Healing has been lame since then.

Disagree all you want... I healed too. Early Cata healing sucked for challenging content since 1) your spells hit for crap in the gear you likely had and 2) DPS and tanks were supposed to manage their health after an expansion where healers could just heal through anything. AS people got gear it was less of an issue but for the first few months, it was a major change and nerf to healer power. YOU may have liked it.... but that doesn't mean it wasn't a huge change

- - - Updated - - -

I think it comes from people frustrated from not getting into mythic 5 man runs. LFD solves this problem, but at a serious cost.

What is needed is better tools for avoiding the problem. They appear to be adding more automated tools for forming groups with players in your social circle. This could be the way to go.

It's not even that. It's that I'm given quests by the game that are only completable in mythics which means that people are forced to either run mythics somehow or not do those quests (some of which are profession quests). Queuing allows you to get that stuff done with minimal hassle and time. Group finder means you can, if you're under geared or certain DPS classes, spend 1-2 hours dicking around with forming a group for a mythic that you might not even really want to bother with aside from the quests you have there.

TBH, if the quests called for heroics, I'd probably side with the 'why add mythics to queuing' side of this since then it would be just people who didn't want to form groups for totally optional content.