Make LFR the only difficulty

[Jtbrig7390]

Just because many people do LFR doesn't mean it's compelling and fun content.
I believe people do LFR for the easy rewards and easy accessibility via a queue.

It can be both for some.

I know shocker people like things you don't, but we have already talked about this many times before.

[Saradain]

You're right. There's elitism inside LFR and it's something plaguing it from within for a while now.

My vision for the future of LFR is elitism free, where players can enter and do whatever they wish and play however they want and face no criticism for it.

Your problem is something called "humanity", which means there'll always be people who complain, criticize or otherwise act negatively. If you want the least negativity, perhaps you should aim to perform at decent level. Or perhaps this could be the core of your next thread, being able to recruit 24 NPCs to fight with you in a raid, that way you will never have to leave your safe space?

[Mifuyne]

Hello OP.
stop dodging pls.
Remove all combat.

[Xires]

It's a myth that an MMO has to be social by nature. We can have an MMO with heavy RPG elements that doesn't force players to interact with each other

A failed MMO. I think you just need to move on and play another game. Clearly any social elements or anything that makes you critically think is a "no no" in your world. The "walking dead" are already among us I see.

[Twdft]

You are either an epic troll or an epic daft pleb ;D

Troll obviously. Anyone as dumb as that would need someone standing next to him saying "breathe in - breathe out" at all times.

[Mifuyne]

Troll obviously. Anyone as dumb as that would need someone standing next to him saying "breathe in - breathe out" at all times.

Hey man, breathing in and out is really hard and difficult.
It should be removed for the greater cause.

[Deleted]

I cannot tell, if this is just a major troll post.
So, you are telling me, more people clear LFR than mythic?
Is that a surprise to you?
You do realise, everyone who cleared mythic also cleared LFR, but not everyone who cleared LFR cleared mythic, right?
Ofc the number is higher the less dificult something is.

LFR is a runaway success

Is it now? Placing a NPC in Dalaran, that gifts you a legendary every day will most likely give you a rate of 100% usage by player base.
Do you consider that a success aswell? Or is maybe the takeaway here, that, if you offer someone an easy way to obtain gear, players are likely to use it?

They feel overwhelmed by how many difficulties they will have to go through before they can be considered "Raiders"

I consider someone who goes in a normal difficulty raid with a guild or group of friends already a raider. It's a normal raider then. Heroic Raider and Mythic Raider are the other tiers.
But regardless, you are suggesting that the amount of difficulties is relevant to how they feel about what they are labeled. Which is ridiculous already.

This issue is further amplified by the fact that the other difficulties forces you to be social in order to participate in them, LFR does not, hence another argument in favor for it.

This comes with progressing through challanging group content, where communication and coordination is important. Raiding is supposed to be a challange. For people, who don't like the challange, but still want to experience the content (lore/transmog/loot), they can go LFR.

something they should be building on, not running away from.

What do you mean? There is an LFR version for every raid so far. Why should they build on it? It's fine the way it is. Are you proposing anything?

we don't need more than LFR in order for WoW to be a successful

What makes you think that? Considering that half the people, who raided LFR, went into normal, already suggest, 50% of the LFR quota are normal raiders. That's 30% of the player base you would take traditional raiding away from.

in fact LFR’s participation rate is often times higher than other raid difficulties COMBINED.

You can't combine other difficulties, that doesn't make any sense. every player that raided mythic, also did hc. You are double-counting them.
If normal is already just 50% of peeps, that go LFR, ofc you won't go over 100%.
LFR atracts both raiders and casuals, because it's quick and easy, but offers loot for alts and even mains.

But let me finish my post off with this:

What makes you even think, that we have to get rid of other difficulties? You have not mentioned any reason, why it should be removed. You haven't proposed any changes in Favor of LFR or in Favor of other raid difficulties.

So far you only said, that numbers for LFR are higher (duh) and that too many difficulties confuse peoples feelings.
Why are you making this out to be some kind of holy grail discovery? I am really having trouble understanding your point.

[tikcol]

@tikcol

Just because many people do LFR doesn't mean it's compelling and fun content.
I believe people do LFR for the easy rewards and easy accessibility via a queue.

Let me ask you this question:

When you complete LFR you feel like:
A) WoW so much fun, let's do it again.
or
B) Thank god it is over, see you next week.

LFR just isn't fun content. There is no gameplay, there is no danger of failing. It's made to be completed no matter what in one go.
There is no progression. There is no dance to be made or else you die. There is nothing.
People do it because it's the "easy place to farm for rewards". It's just a "loot pinhata". Players do it because it's free epix and not because it is fun.

If you are asking for "normal mode to be queueable" then i agree with you, but don't say "LFR is fun for everybody therefore it should be the only difficulty". That's just not true.

I feel very happy that WoW has got a system in place such as LFR where I can play to my hearts content without feeling forced to speak with other people

Is it hard? Sometimes.
Is it easy? Sometimes...

Maybe up the difficulty a bit and make it queuable. But make everything queuable.

[Xires]

I've never set my foot there. But LFR isn't easy if that's what you are implying here.

- - - Updated - - -



Keep it constructive. This is a very real problem that plagues WoW atm, now something to dismiss as a joke

- - - Updated - - -



How so?

Do you realize that LFR-like tools are the most sought out content blizzard has ever released?

Worst....player....ever, OP. LFR is a snore fest. You die and you get a boost to your raid to help insure that you dont die while standing in the fire. LFR is Booooooooooooooooring and stupid easy. You've got to be a troll....grats. You got a lot of bites from this one.

[darkwarrior42]

Besides the first sentence, I can't really agree with you.

Easier to access? Sometimes I wonder, is Mythic really that good or hard for that matter? I can't understand the obcession people have with it...

Since it seems I must be far more obvious in order for my point to be understood, I was being sarcastic. Participation is one measure of success, but not the only one, and not necessarily the best one.

That you cannot understand the obsession that some people have for it does not mean that there is no reason for it; it simply means you do not share in that obsession. I can't understand how people can enjoy country music, or why some people are fascinated by cars, but they clearly find something of value there which I do not see.

So, let's break it down in a very simple manner.

1) Many people enjoy a challenge. This is obvious just by looking at the world.
2) In terms of PvE content, high-end Mythic+ dungeons and the higher difficulties of raiding are the most challenging content available.

Therefore, it stands to reason that many people will enjoy such content. The fact that it requires a lot of people makes it logistically challenging for some to participate, but that doesn't mean the format is invalidated.... I'm more likely to raid LFR atm, simply because my schedule is inconsistent and I cannot guarantee attendance. If I could, I'd be on a mythic raiding team in a heartbeat. That doesn't mean LFR is better, but it does mean that it's more accessible.

In short, nobody will argue the fact that more people do LFR. It was designed to be accessible, after all. What can be argued is whether that means it's more successful or better, as a result... it's so easy that there is no challenge, and for many (myself included), that means that whether or not a boss dies, LFR does feel like any kind of success.


There's another factor to be considered. The people that prefer heroic and mythic raiding also tend to be some of the more active, prolific players in the WoW community. There are many players who stay with WoW primarily for the raiding scene. Remove Heroic and Mythic Raiding, and most of those players will go away; whether they find another game or simply stop, they'll no longer be a part of the WoW community. Even though it's not a very large percentage of the player base, it's some of the most active and visible players... they're also many of the players that fuel and power so many of the most commonly used fan sites. There are a lot of other good games out there, both multiplayer and single-player, and to be frank, many of them are at least as good as WoW. What keeps going WoW going is a combination of factors but ultimately comes down to a few major points:
1) It supports both single player and group activities, where the group activities actually feel like working in a group.
2) It has some of the best raiding left in an MMO, if not the best.
3) It's been around forever, so has a well established and active community with a lot of fan resources.
4) It's the most popular, which for an MMO based around working with others (even if you do not always do so) is an advantage.

Removing raiding outside of LFR destroys #2 entirely. LFR offers no challenge, so anyone who plays for the raiding is unlikely to be satisfied by LFR only. Once those players are gone, #3 is going to be severely damaged, and the combination will also greatly harm #4.

Guild Wars 2 has a fantastic engine and a solid community, but no real raiding. FFXIV is a lot of fun, but slower paced and not to everyone's tastes. Rift is still going, though it suffers. Star Wars, Star Trek, Aion, and a host of others still exist and are still going. WoW is still on top in terms of popularity, and no small portion of that comes from the very dedicated raider base. Destroying that would be, at best, foolish.

[Mifuyne]

OP,
Why not remove LFR as well?
Stop dodging.

You're a elitist scumbag that thinks LFR is easy or should be the only raid difficulty.
Why don't you think about all the people that can't do LFR?

[LightBR]

Let's not forget the behavior the other difficulties incite on people. But really, explain me, why do I have to be forced to be social in order to be successful in game?

This is an important question that people can't answer. They instead invoke "MMO" as a magic answer. Which it isn't

Why do I have to be anti-social and not play with others because you have social anxiety or whatever? don't like to play with others? Don't, do you LFR and leave the rest of the content for those who enjoy it. And please don't generalize "behavior other dificulties create in people" that is just rubbish.

Oh you kinda forgot a term you are so fond of this time: Archaic Tool.

Honestly LFR is a success but removing the other content is just absurd. Enjoy what you like and let others enjoy what they like.

cheers,
Light

[Xires]

Your post really just argues why LFR shouldn't be removed. As for your point about additional difficulties dissuading people from continuing, it's pretty much bullshit.

Having higher difficulties of raiding can actually make people play longer for two reasons. Either they raid the higher difficulties so it takes them longer to get through the content and thus stay subbed longer or they don't raid the higher difficulties but their existence encourages them to keep playing in the hopes of conquering those difficulties one day.

Removing the other difficulties wouldn't make more players join the game and it would certainly make many players quit soon after new content drops because they've downed the content in 2 weeks.

2 weeks? If it were LFR only it would be more like 2 hours.

[tikcol]

A failed MMO. I think you just need to move on and play another game. Clearly any social elements or anything that makes you critically think is a "no no" in your world. The "walking dead" are already among us I see.

This argument is getting old. I've answered this 100 times before bro.

MMO's only mean there's a lot of people around. It doesn't mean you have to interact with them

[Dizson]

That's good for you, but most people are not playing WoW to have the same experience as you.

[pmkaboo]

remove all difficulties other than lfr and what you end up with is slightly more complex farmville

[tikcol]

OP,
Why not remove LFR as well?
Stop dodging.

You're a elitist scumbag that thinks LFR is easy or should be the only raid difficulty.
Why don't you think about all the people that can't do LFR?

Because we need some kind of raiding and LFR is the only obvious candidate

[-Joker-]

I voted NO. Variety of difficulty makes it interesting for more people. Not everyone plays Duke Nukem on Easy. Some people like Insane Mode.

[Mifuyne]

OP stop dodging posts thanks.

Because we need some kind of raiding and LFR is the only obvious candidate

Why do we need some kind of raiding?
Stop pushing your shit on people that can't do LFR you elitist scumbag.
LFR is unfair for most of the playerbase, remove it please.

[Christhammer]

Ignore him. Obvious troll. Remove LFR if anything.