Legendary drops

[Fabinas]

Well, we need to make noise so we will NOT have that shitty system next expansion. I have lost faith in Blizzard that they can do something good about the current one. I understand their need to change the way to obtain a legendary, after all those expansions, but THIS system is piss poor fuck implemented. Just imagine. There was this 4 Legendary soft cap (now removed). The system was so poorly made that some players would fail HARD, because their rng was bad, obtaining their least valuable legendaries. With the soft cap in place they would NEVER EVER have a chance of ever recouping from the bad RNG, despite the effort they might have put in obtaining all of them (and possibly their BiS as last). And this soft cap was a HIDDEN feature, which would lead players farming and farming and staying with their 4 shitty legendaries the whole expansion.

What else you want to know to understand this was badly implemented? People with equal effort would have vastly different yields and rewards for it.

[SirCowdog]

If a legendary is going to do that, then quite frankly there can't have been a lot of performance difference between the good and the bad players.

Or maybe you're underestimating how ready raid teams are to swap players based on even minor differences in their gear? This has always been a problem with wow due to its heavy reliance on its Gear-Over-Skill system, and the RNG drop of legendaries(as well as titanforged) has only exacerbated the issue because of how much of a performance boost some of them are.

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Well, we need to make noise so we will NOT have that shitty system next expansion. I have lost faith in Blizzard that they can do something good about the current one. I understand their need to change the way to obtain a legendary, after all those expansions, but THIS system is piss poor fuck implemented. Just imagine. There was this 4 Legendary soft cap (now removed). The system was so poorly made that some players would fail HARD, because their rng was bad, obtaining their least valuable legendaries. With the soft cap in place they would NEVER EVER have a chance of ever recouping from the bad RNG, despite the effort they might have put in obtaining all of them (and possibly their BiS as last). And this soft cap was a HIDDEN feature, which would lead players farming and farming and staying with their 4 shitty legendaries the whole expansion.

What else you want to know to understand this was badly implemented? People with equal effort would have vastly different yields and rewards for it.

This wouldn't even really be an issue if all the legendaries were more or less in line with each other. Unfortunately they're not. It's just more RNG in a system which is already overburdened with too much RNG. A player without ANY legendaries would still be behind, but the difference between a player with one vs a player with 2 or more wouldn't be as huge.

[iky43210]

Which legendary?
And do you have proof for it?

Unholy bracer for DK.

I've also heard the fire mage one also makes a big difference.

[Fabinas]

Or maybe you're underestimating how ready raid teams are to swap players based on even minor differences in their gear? This has always been a problem with wow due to its heavy reliance on its Gear-Over-Skill system, and the RNG drop of legendaries(as well as titanforged) has only exacerbated the issue because of how much of a performance boost some of them are.

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This wouldn't even really be an issue if all the legendaries were more or less in line with each other. Unfortunately they're not. It's just more RNG in a system which is already overburdened with too much RNG. A player without ANY legendaries would still be behind, but the difference between a player with one vs a player with 2 or more wouldn't be as huge.

Dunno about other classes, but the difference of a destro warlock with the belt and bracers (either destro or demo spec bracers, the latter working for all specs), compared to a warlock with ANY other two legendaries, is huge.

[Volibear]

That's actually been shown to be false. The right legendary can boost even a mediocre player above excellent players without. It's stupid, and the entire reason there are complaints in the first place.

If you die because you're mediocre, you do 0 DPS, regardless of what legendary you have.

[Fabinas]

If you die because you're mediocre, you do 0 DPS, regardless of what legendary you have.

Irrelevant to our discussion.

[Runeheal]

Monk Karma cape adds a huge amount of damage while also making it very difficult for you to die, so two mediocre players, one with it, one without can be relevant to the discussion. Don't think that was the point he was going for though.

[Volibear]

Irrelevant to our discussion.

Except the person I was responding to said "Mediocre players will appear better than good players if they had better legendaries"
Entirely relevant. If you're shit, you'll do 0 DPS when you inevitably die, which is considerably less than any *good* player with bad, or even no legendaries.

[Fabinas]

It's irrelevant because we are not comparing dead to alive players. We compare two alive players at the end of a fight, one with his BiS legendaries and one with not. Your statement applies to any situation in general, and thus it's irrelevant to our discussion, as it does not promote the topic of the legendaries impact on a players performance.

Geddit now or shall i pee as well?

[Deleted]

That's actually been shown to be false. The right legendary can boost even a mediocre player above excellent players without. It's stupid, and the entire reason there are complaints in the first place.

That's why I am pulling 95-98 percentile logs as Frost DK without a frost legendary. Good joke m8.

[Deleted]

There should be ONLY utility legendarys. They'd be a decent bonus but not more, also there would be much more variety regarding which legendaries are actually used.

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That's why I am pulling 95-98 percentile logs as Frost DK without a frost legendary. Good joke m8.

Dude, nobody plays frost dk, thus not many frost dks have bis legendaries. Also he said clearly "CAN" boost you above excellent players.

[Deleted]

There should be ONLY utility legendarys. They'd be a decent bonus but not more, also there would be much more variety regarding which legendaries are actually used.

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Dude, nobody plays frost dk, thus not many frost dks have bis legendaries. Also he said clearly "CAN" boost you above excellent players.

Ahem. https://www.warcraftlogs.com/statistics/10#sample=7
Yeah man, 15k logs over the past week. Nobody plays frost, sure.

[Deavane]

I like the legendary system legion has introduced. I think theres alot of people jumping on the bandwagon cause its "cool" to hate it.

Not since TBC have we had that "oh shit" moment when an item you want drops, and you see that orange color and you go omfg. Its a great feeling.

I think a lot of people are passed the "oh shit" moment. Many have moved onto the "shit" moment or the "finally" moment.

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Ahem. https://www.warcraftlogs.com/statistics/10#sample=7
Yeah man, 15k logs over the past week. Nobody plays frost, sure.

You need to realize that many frost DKs started as Unholy. As a result many of them don't have the good frost legendaries that create outliers for the spec.

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Which legendary?
And do you have proof for it?

Look at warrior's execute ring, look at bracers (fire) and ring (mage) for mages. There's a number of legendaries that do provide anywhere from 10-20% of a specs DPS. Without them, that potential isn't there.

[Super Kami Dende]

RNG has been in this game since the beginning.

It's as if you guys are all new.

[Deleted]

Classic: Kill mobs.
Legion: Do something more specific.

That's the difference. Oh also, in classic almost all the openworld epics were crap, lol.

[munkeyinorbit]

That's actually been shown to be false. The right legendary can boost even a mediocre player above excellent players without. It's stupid, and the entire reason there are complaints in the first place.

No it can't. Those mediocre players and excellent players are not mediocre players and excellent players. Its bad players getting smoked by mediocre players, or even to weven players. Stop lying and projecting your saltiness about your bad play.

[Traxwow]

so then post your logs and lets see how "good" of a player you are

[Deleted]

You need to realize that many frost DKs started as Unholy. As a result many of them don't have the good frost legendaries that create outliers for the spec.

Hhahahahaha. Fucking ace man. I hope you realize that legendaries equipped are listed in the logs. Out of a samplesize of 15k, you can be certain that a large part of them already have the good frost legendaries.

A legendary can have a huge impact on dps. But the better player will generally always have better performance. A legendary doesn't fix your positioning during a fight (which is hugely important to be able to squeeze out maximum dps) and proper skill usage during a fight. (ex: Timing Full moon drops as a balance druid for Ursoc add. Knowing which spells you can squeeze in prior to a knockback so you don't waste any cast time. when to dump resources, and when to pool them for specific parts in an encounter. etc). A legendary doesn't compensate for those core parts of what actually makes a good dps player.

Your bis legendaries will only increase your maximal potential output, and in the hands of a mediocre player, the added benefit of those legendaries are diminished because they're nowhere near that maximal potential output in an actual encounter setting.
It's only really in top end that Legendaries really start to play a role. That is, 100-90ish percentile logs, top world raiding guilds, etc. Because those players are reaching their maximal potential output.
For anyone not in that top percentages, your legendaries don't really play a role in your raid spot if your raid leader isn't mentally retarded. And if it affects you, there is a simple solution, leave your bottom end trade chat guild and join one that is managed by people with brains. Or start your own, with blackjack and hookers.

[iky43210]

Hhahahahaha. Fucking ace man. I hope you realize that legendaries equipped are listed in the logs. Out of a samplesize of 15k, you can be certain that a large part of them already have the good frost legendaries.

A legendary can have a huge impact on dps. But the better player will generally always have better performance. A legendary doesn't fix your positioning during a fight (which is hugely important to be able to squeeze out maximum dps) and proper skill usage during a fight. (ex: Timing Full moon drops as a balance druid for Ursoc add. Knowing which spells you can squeeze in prior to a knockback so you don't waste any cast time. etc). A legendary doesn't compensate for those core parts of what actually makes a good dps player.

Worse player doesn't mean dribbling morons. anywhere from 5-10% dps difference are usually the deciding factor between a mediocre and great player, and there are multiple legendaries that does contribute more than 10% dps boost. Last patch's 7-8% dps buff were all that took for frost dk to be viable for instance

Frost bracer is "only" a 5% boost, but still fairly significant. Yes a worse player can outperform better player if he have the right legendary

[Deleted]

Yes a worse player can outperform better player if he have the right legendary

No, they can't. Read my updated post. Positioning and proper execution of a fight is far more important than whatever legendary you have in terms of dps. A few small mistakes in your positioning or ability usage can literally cost you more dps than what a legendary can offer you. You don't have to be a dribbling moron to mess that up either.
There are currently a few problem legendaries, such as the unholy bracers, that have a huge impact on your dps, but if you're now playing unholy, you're a dribbling moron either way. But again, back when Unholy was the better spec, I still outperformed people with the bracers despite not having them.

I'd like to see an actual worse player outperform a better one just by having better legendaries in an actual boss fight scenario. You put forth this claim, please, prove it. Provide me with some statistical evidence. The burden of proof lies with you, not with me.

If you're salty about being beaten in dps just because someone had a legendary, it's most likely because you dun goofed somewhere else.