I like to raid - I do not like beeing forced to do other content to be viable

[Deleted]

I guess that's the answer to your question. Why does the best gear for raiders come from mythic +? Because the developers wanted to create a system to provide an alternative to raiding and they've succeeded at that goal and it should not be modified even the slightest.

No its because all the casuals cry since wotlk that they want the same gear then the good players! That is the only fucking reason in my opinion....

[Glorious Leader]

No its because all the casuals cry since wotlk that they want the same gear then the good players! That is the only fucking reason in my opinion....

Yes well now look whos crying.

[Deleted]

Yes well now look whos crying.

Of course iam crying cause it kills the game

[saeros]

Short of gutting it the only other response would be to make it so only dungeon gear applies in dungeons and world gear applies in world etc etc. I mean this argument is a little rich I'm sorry. The best EVERYTHING gear came from only raiding for years. Usually when you bring this up people would argue that it's pve gear that's fine. That just means your question is fundamentally incorrect. The best PVE gear now comes from two sources.

You are begging the question in this case. That is the best raiding gear comes form other content ergo the answer should be in some fashion to modify that particular situation in some way. Now short of gutting that content the only other option would be to narrowly define gear so it would only function in one sphere of content over another. Both options are unacceptable as far as I'm concerned. Ergo the answer to your question is because that's how it is. Sorry. The best gear for dungeon farming was in raids. The best gear for world content was in raids. The best gear for pure characther progression was in raids. The best PVE gear was in raids PERIOD and I'm guessing you weren't complaining about that. Now raids have some competition and too bad so sad.

I guess that's the answer to your question. Why does the best gear for raiders come from mythic +? Because the developers wanted to create a system to provide an alternative to raiding and they've succeeded at that goal and it should not be modified even the slightest.

the best raiding gear was from raiding.
the best pvp gear was from pvp.

really wtf was wrong with that?
and stop, there was no other meaningful content for which you need gear progession.

there is no "world content", you didn't need to be full bis to go fishing or farming herbs, neither to be full epics to do heroics.
on the contrary, if anything, you needed to be full pvp to avoid ganks if on a pvp server. otherwise you didn't need anything beside the basic gear.
have you ever seen someone crying because pvp gear was only in pvp content? really.

and again you fail to understand the word "alternative". it is not an alternative if bis are mostly in the other content.
it is not an ALTERNATIVE if you most people have to run BOTH.
it looks like you can't even read what i write.

[ComputerNerd]

Ahh those nebulous concepts of "feel forced" and "viable"

What a joke.

I very much agree.
Is that other content an actual requirement ?
No, you aren't forced.

"viable" does not equal optimal.
If you are meeting Blizzard's requirements for it, then you are viable.
So that is utter rubbish too.

[Deleted]

you really can't see how you argument invalidates itself?
really wtf.
and no, YOU are jumping to the conclusion that we are asking to gut that content, really, if you can't imagine other solutions is not my fault. also, even if a solution is not clear, there is no reason to not accept that there is a problem.

and i'm asking again, why the best raid gear NEEDS to be from another content?

you can't answer.

Why does it NEED to be from the SAME content?

[Deleted]

@OP I'm totally with you. I unsubbed because of it. Sure, being a mythic raider always entails some grind outside of the actual raid. But the rng element is keeping me away. Let me farm M dungs for valor or anything that is not pure luck, and the entire situation changes. Now, it's just "go waste hours per week in M+ for the off-chance of getting upgrades".

They got lots of things right in Legion, don't get me wrong. But it is Blizzards responsibility to curtail the min-maxing demands of players. For most mythic guilds, there is no "middle ground". So either grind or be stuck with heroic difficulty.

[saeros]

Why does it NEED to be from the SAME content?

so if someone don't like a specific content he can completly avoid it with no impact on the contet he cares about.

like pvp and pve in most of the seasons. it works fine when the are no conflict in the gear. (and when it happens that some pve trinket or weapon is bis in pvp everyone complained about it.)

[Deleted]

so if someone don't like a specific content he can completly avoid it with no impact on the contet he cares about.

like pvp and pve in most of the seasons. it works fine when the are no conflict in the gear. (and when it happens that some pve trinket or weapon is bis in pvp everyone complained about it.)

You can avoid it? Don't want it, don't do it.

[saeros]

You can avoid it? Don't want it, don't do it.

oh, another one that can't read.
try again.
"he can completly avoid it with no impact on the contet he cares about."
with no impact
on
the content
he cares about

really wtf is wrong with all of you, it is getting ridiculous trying to argue .-.

[bromanbro]

They made raiding more competitive in Legion. If you wanna raid, you have to keep your AP relatively current. Rewards people who play more, but AK fixes that somewhat.

[Relapses]

While I don't particularly care for this being the 739,934,485th time this gripe has been posted, I do agree with you. In fact, I quit the game because of it. I do not like WQs, I do not particularly enjoy M+ dungeons, I hate the stupid Legendary RNG, and I am completely turned off by a system that practically forces me to do content I do not enjoy. c'est la vie, Legion just has not been my expansion. I hope Blizzard reconsiders their fascination with repeatable content at some point while developing their next expansion.

[araine]

While I don't particularly care for this being the 739,934,485th time this gripe has been posted, I do agree with you. In fact, I quit the game because of it. I do not like WQs, I do not particularly enjoy M+ dungeons, I hate the stupid Legendary RNG, and I am completely turned off by a system that practically forces me to do content I do not enjoy. c'est la vie, Legion just has not been my expansion. I hope Blizzard reconsiders their fascination with repeatable content at some point while developing their next expansion.

They got a LOT of things right with legion the fact that we have content to do everytime you log in is a big change compared to before and thats a great change

[Notdev]

You aren't forced. You chose to be in a guild that requires you to go full turbo-grind.

The guild doesn't require anything. Raiding does. Progression raiding, at least. Blizzard designed progression raiding this way. Its not a person issue. Wanting raid members to put some effort in outside of raid, explicitly or not, is no fault of any guild, guild master, raid leader, or raider.

So, choose another guild.

So, the "choice" is break social bonds people have made for up to 12 years, or quit. This isn't really a choice.

I am utterly unsympathetic to the concerns of mythic raiders and/or those who push mythic 5mans to double digits. You are a small, small, small minority. The game should not, indeed can not be built/tuned/designed around your type.

Doesn't have to be. All most of them are asking is some middle ground.

Again, this doesn't apply to me. I am just making observations. I love Legion and will keep playing. I have 35 traits. I am free to criticize an aspect of the expansion though.

[araine]

They made raiding more competitive in Legion. If you wanna raid, you have to keep your AP relatively current. Rewards people who play more, but AK fixes that somewhat.

It is there to filter out the wannabes and the pretenders, good job from Blizzard on that one. even thou it is more of a side effect than a design decision but good non the less for the health of the game.

[Notdev]

Maximizing something that is light years behind current content is like i need to make sure i get all the upgrade to my 2001 Nissan superduper ultra awesome RX when really no matter how much you put into it, it will still be outdated and well behind current progression

Hello? A new raid was released 2 weeks ago. How is that "light years behind current content"?

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It is as we have pointed out again and again and again the player and the guild that is at fault for demanding these grind fests for marginal at best improvements. the big elephant in the room that they constantly ignore is that the race ended 2 months ago 7/7M is done and gone if you are in a race to that right now and need these marginal benefits to help you, you should look on that fat elephant in the room that says get better the race ended 2 months ago.

Hey, you again. ToV was released 2 weeks ago. We've been done with Xavius for like 4 weeks.

[Relapses]

They got a LOT of things right with legion the fact that we have content to do everytime you log in is a big change compared to before and thats a great change

You can feel it's a great change, that's fine. Maybe for a portion of the WoW playerbase, it is. But that's not me. I work 40 to 60 hours a week and I dislike coming home to a game that makes me spend another 40 to 60 hours a week worth of maintenance just to do something that I spend 8 to 10 hours a week doing. It bothers me. I never had a problem with this in previous expansions but Legion just feels like an endless treadmill of boring inconsequential content that ultimately results in a very unfun experience for me.

[Notdev]

This. /thread

middle ground

[Uselessrouge]

its just sad that mythic + 880 gear with perfect stats just shit on all the raid gear atm... but i HOPE it will stop with the next raid when mythic + items dont scale up anymore

[Usagi Senshi]

Of course iam crying cause it kills the game

Nah, it really doesn't, but maybe in your own little unimportant world it does.

Anyway, other good MMOs and games out there to play, take a break from WoW and have fun.

- - - Updated - - -

its just sad that mythic + 880 gear with perfect stats just shit on all the raid gear atm... but i HOPE it will stop with the next raid when mythic + items dont scale up anymore

LOL, I have some bad news for you......