Turkish President Tayyip Erdogan 'has EVIDENCE US is supporting ISIS'

[stomination]

ISIS sports tons of American gear. The theory until now is that they were getting them indirectly from Syria opposition.

That is still the theory being no one has said otherwise.

[Zelk]

Not where you think they are from.

I actually know where they're from thanks to their terrible moderating of the Football thread thanks to their ignorance to the world outside North America.

[Slant]

I think you are looking for evidence of the wrong thing. Rhetoric that is against the west works. When US elects an isolationist who bemoans the UN, how is this rhetoric not working? The evidance of it working is undeniable.

If it wasn't for thanksgiving, I'd build a wall around turkey. /rimshot

I think if it was just the isolationism of Trump, the rest of the world would be relieved. Alas, it's his non-expansionist, cowboy side that worries everyone. The allies and foes alike.

[PickleballAce]

I actually know where they're from thanks to their terrible moderating of the Football thread thanks to their ignorance to the world outside North America.

I don't know what you're complaining about. Do you think the moderating around here is sensitive toward nation bashing the US? That was pretty much a textbook infraction...nation bashing and conspiracy theory.

And I'm not really sure what being North American has to do with poor moderating of a Football thread considering that -- unlike England -- North American sides actually advanced past the group stages at the World Cup.

[Deleted]

We all have seen ISIS with American gear. We all knew the story was that ISIS got them from Syria opposition, aka they got them from US indirectly.
However, Erdogan is accusing US of arming ISIS directly, which is big news.
What do you guys think? I have a feeling that Turkey is on the verge of getting some freedom and democracy. [/FONT][/COLOR]

"I've got evidence but I aint gonna show ya!"

Ok Erdodumb. You just wanna slam the drums.

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If hes referring to the US weapons that the State Department basically handed to ISIS, thats not news to anyone.

Yeah they just steal all that stuff.
They also salvage everything the Iraqi army leaves behind.

[The Stormbringer]

It doesn't change that right now his bombs are raining on Aleppo and his security apparatus is funding ISIS. Even if he stops the funding right away, the weapons already delivered there will keep destroying lifes all throughout his presidency which means it'll leave a bloody mark on history from the get go.


All of this is solely character assasination towards Erdogan. You are judging him and Turkey from an outsiders perspective and an assumed position of moral superiority. You might not like what he is doing but he is very much doing what the mayority of the Turkish people want as they keep supporting him.

Just because you do not like the culture and religion doesn't mean these people aren't well within their rights to decide for themselves what they want to do or to assume either of these to be in any kind of way worse than the alternatives. You have to remember that these things are very much relative.

"The majority", yes. When he only won the vote with not even a third of the population backing him.

And no, it's not relative. Once a society starts using a religion's rules as their actual laws (beyond the obvious 'killing is bad, don't steal, mmkay?'), things do not end well, especially for practitioners of other religions.

[Notchris]

It would be for the US, if they had to face NATO. And they would have no other choice, because Art.5 is clearly defined.

The rest of NATO would get their shit pushed in.
Europe has next to no real force projection and relies almost entirely on the U.S. to supply logistics.

It'd be a damn massacre.

[Ulmita]

The rest of NATO would get their shit pushed in.
Europe has next to no real force projection and relies almost entirely on the U.S. to supply logistics.

It'd be a damn massacre.

Relax there sport we invented and perfected the art of war. Don't confuse our choice for not spending on military with weakness, if Europe decides to militarize fully ww2 style, nothing would be able to stop it.

[Forogil]

A couple of things.

First off, NATO would never go against the US like that. Just wouldn't happen, since the US is the main driving force of NATO both economically and militarily.

Second, it would take all of the world powers combined to even have a chance at taking on the US. I'm being srs, that's how much more advanced we are than everyone else. BUT...give china 5-10 years and they may have a chance in a war with the US...but that's going way off topic.

Thirdly Turkey is primarily in Asia, not Europe - and that part is (as far as I se) outside the scope of the North Atlantic Treaty Organization.

The attack on the Falkland Islands was not an attack on NATO.

[Deleted]

The rest of NATO would get their shit pushed in.
Europe has next to no real force projection and relies almost entirely on the U.S. to supply logistics.

It'd be a damn massacre.

As if. The US never had the courage to fight Countries with the means to retaliate. When was the last time the US fought a country with the cabalility to strike back? Some half diseased Native Tribes and the Mexican Bandits and thats it?

They only dared fight the Brits while they were busy with Napoleon and other Rival Powers. Same with the Spanish American war. Fact is the US never fought anyone who could retaliate and they wont start now.

They sure as hell wont start shit with 2 Nuclear Powers and some of the most industrialised Countries in the world.
Besides who in their right mind would ever Allign itself with the US ever again if betrays its Allies?

[Viconia]

One would think USA was smart enough to provide third party gear instead of American if they were indeed in bed with such a controversial party as ISIS.

[Forogil]

We all have seen ISIS with American gear. We all knew the story was that ISIS got them from Syria opposition, aka they got them from US indirectly.
However, Erdogan is accusing US of arming ISIS directly, which is big news.

After the "coup" Erdogan accused Gülen of behind it; and wanted him extradited.
The US does not trust that alleged evidence - and instead of presenting that evidence Erdogan is now adding another accusation.

That seems connected.

[Wells]

As if. The US never had the courage to fight Countries with the means to retaliate. When was the last time the US fought a country with the cabalility to strike back? Some half diseased Native Tribes and the Mexican Bandits and thats it?

They only dared fight the Brits while they were busy with Napoleon and other Rival Powers. Same with the Spanish American war. Fact is the US never fought anyone who could retaliate and they wont start now.

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Pacifi...f_World_War_II

[Yuyn]

YPG and PYD are Kurdish forces that the US does support. Turkey, and especially the right-wing party in power, consider them terrorists, as well as considering everyone who is ethnically Kurdish a terrorist, basically.

They fight against ISIS to protect their homes and for their ultimate goal, to have a country of their own (parts of Syria, Iraq, and Turkey is what they consider their homeland). Turkey has been accused of attempting genocide against the Kurds in the past, so they get a bit touchy whenever anyone points out that they're actually not horrible people.

[Deleted]

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Pacifi...f_World_War_II

Oh you mean the War were the US was attacked and had no choice but to fight? Hardly was the US choosing to go to war on its own free will.

So my point that you cut out still stands. The US still wont start conflict with anyone that can retaliate.

[Wells]

Oh you mean the War were the US was attacked and had no choice but to fight?

Oh, we're moving posts. Fun.

[Nathreim]

Didn't we already find out that we were selling weapons to ISIS out of Libya?

[Deleted]

Oh, we're moving posts. Fun.

How is stating the obvious moving posts? The US did not choose to enter WW2 on its own. It was forced into it by being attacked.

[Cybran]

How is stating the obvious moving posts? The US did not choose to enter WW2 on its own. It was forced into it by being attacked.

You underestimate the rose tinted view on War that Americans have. They haven't felt the same destruction and bloodshed as Europe on their own soil and as result think that they can get away with everything.


Their recklessness could have started a few wars under Obama and Clinton. Fucking McCain and Rubio were calling for shooting down Russian planes just 7 months ago.

[Torto]

Why would anyone believe a guy who stages a coup against himself just so he can suppress opposition parties?