France bans child beating

[Crissi]

I've found being upfront with kids and explaining why something is dangerous works more effectively than hitting or blackmailing a child

Wasnt aware really young kids could grasp fully why something is wrong.

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There are leashes for kids that can't understand to not run out into the street as well.

Heh, my sister often darted before the leash could be put on. So basically that 5 seconds between getting out of the car and having it put on.

[Deleted]

People don't know how to help other people naturally sometimes. Then what?

Then you direct them to someone, that can help them. Ideally.

Either that, or well, one can also do the more pragmatic but also more tragic choise, of simply making the judgement call of where something is out of your hands,
and leave the case to be where it is.

I've seen people be abusive to children, i've seen problematic kids first hand. And even as much as it scarred me, to break ties with thoose kids, i was left with not much choise - Due to that the mother had her own issues.

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Wasnt aware really young kids could grasp fully why something is wrong..

For the case of very young kids, it's more about approximation, more than anything.

You make em understand it's bad, but you don't relate it to pain or the idea of physically laying punishment upon them.

You could do it through tone, through body language, through showing that you are upset with them ; Just as long as you do it controlled (as in, don't
completely abandon them or start barking at them. Just imprint into them, that on a fundamental level, they did something really bad.)

Moderation, really. Kids have a deep emotional, intuitive understanding - So much so, that it comes to define them - That's why kids are so moldable in younger ages.

[Total Crica]

Wasnt aware really young kids could grasp fully why something is wrong.

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Heh, my sister often darted before the leash could be put on. So basically that 5 seconds between getting out of the car and having it put on.

I am not trying to say that accidents don't happen.

I am trying to say there are always other ways to deal with children then by hitting them.

I am the product of parents that hit me and when that didn't work (it never did) they tried other methods.

The other methods wound up not working either.

Today I realize none of the other methods worked because I was refusing to care about what they wanted me to learn or do because they hit me and I could not do anything about being hit but I could refuse to do what they wanted, I had control over that.

A child will either give up and do as the person who hits them wants them to do, or they will wind up like me and never care about anyone they see as a threat.

[Crissi]

Then you direct them to someone, that can help them. Ideally.

Either that, or well, one can also do the more pragmatic but also more tragic choise, of simply making the judgement call of where something is out of your hands,
and leave the case to be where it is.

I've seen people be abusive to children, i've seen problematic kids first hand. And even as much as it scarred me, to break ties with thoose kids, i was left with not much choise - Due to that the mother had her own issues.

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For the case of very young kids, it's more about approximation, more than anything.

You make em understand it's bad, but you don't relate it to pain or the idea of physically laying punishment upon them.

You could do it through tone, through body language, through showing that you are upset with them ; Just as long as you do it controlled (as in, don't
completely abandon them or start barking at them. Just imprint into them, that on a fundamental level, they did something really bad.)

Moderation, really. Kids have a deep emotional, intuitive understanding - So much so, that it comes to define them - That's why kids are so moldable in younger ages.

yeah, but I was really more directing that toward the "blackmail" part of her sentence. Punishment of some type is necessary at some point, and that punishment needs to be communicated. Yeha, when they;re oldert and can comprehend why somehting is wrong then explanations on WHY is good, but what good will that do to a 2 or 3 year old?

[Gilgemesh]

It should not be an option, period. Or do you not care about setting the example that it's acceptable to use violence to correct undesirable behaviour?

That's a highly generalized thought. Do you think that spankings just happen no matter the bad behavior? Don't you think those parents tried to rationalize...tried other forms of correction first? So. The example should certainly be if you push far enough, you will have a bad time.

[ImpTaimer]

France? Man, I would've thought this was another crackpot Canadian/Quebec ruling.

This is no different than enforcing "tradition for tradition's sake". Blanket laws/generalizations like this are regressive (not to mention unscientific). Things have to be treated contextually.

"No pain, no gain" isn't just a saying, it's biologic fundamentalism. Cause and effect.

Threatening parents on how to parent can create lazy parents and spoiled children. Irrational fear becomes irrational pride.

Rather than blanket telling parents they're not allowed to discipline their children physically, they should also educate children on what the consequence of THEIR actions will be.

Just say "No" to nanny states. It's just a hypocrisy.

Teaching children that violence is a solution for daily life issues is a terrible idea, and usually leads to the child using violence later in school or even adult life. It is easy to see when you look at children with a middle eastern background, where it's perfectly normal to spank your kids for the most minor shit.

Then don't teach your children that violence is the only solution. Teach them about consequence and spacial awareness.

Violence is an answer, but the consequences must be acknowledged before initiating it.

And whether anyone likes it or not, everyone does not share the same entitlements of consequence. Some people will get away with things others cant. This is where spacial awareness comes in to make sure one your "seven sins" doesn't blind you from reality.

The world is not flat. It has hills and holes. Some will rise and some will fall. Those who climb wish to be looked up upon, but those who descend don't wish to be looked down upon.

The important point is that it's her body.

That is a scary though to place on this thread.

At what point does "it's my body" becomes "it's my kids and I can do what I want"?

I've found being upfront with kids and explaining why something is dangerous works more effectively than hitting or blackmailing a child

France banning child beatings is just a form of blackmail then, by that context.

[Total Crica]

Kids have a deep emotional, intuitive understanding

Not all do. There are those that lack this.

[Deleted]

yeah, but I was really more directing that toward the "blackmail" part of her sentence. Punishment of some type is necessary at some point, and that punishment needs to be communicated. Yeha, when they;re oldert and can comprehend why somehting is wrong then explanations on WHY is good, but what good will that do to a 2 or 3 year old?

For a child, the mere neglect of attention or a stern voice, is enough to impart emotional understanding that they did something bad.

For a 2 or 3 year old, you put the communication on the level of ;

impart a emotional message (As in, make it clear that something bad occured)

Do not overdo this (i.e, don't go out of composure or react extreme)

You are their parent, they depend upon you, in almost every single aspect. Around the age of 2-3, they might be in a stage of rebellion, they'll try to push their limits. You should try to discern when they are just messing with you, and when they are actually just being stupid to the level of doing some real harm.

To impart a mesage, you can do several things ; Deprave them of attention for a short moment, show a serious composure, speak to them in a sharp tone, etc.

The general gist is just to convey the emotional message of "Something is serious, and it's bad".

To recover from the punishment, you have to show that your state is not permanent ; This is the danger of "discipline" - it's internalized. With this in mind, if you show that you come back, after you get angry, or once everything is fine, then the child will understand that it's related to that isolated event. (Causing a stimuli to that specific situation)

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Not all do. There are those that lack this.

Well, if you lack a emotional and intuitive understanding in young ages, that's signs of deep disturbances - That's cause for alarm, if anything.

[Total Crica]

Well, if you lack a emotional and intuitive understanding in young ages, that's signs of deep disturbances - That's cause for alarm, if anything..

My point is, there is not one size glove fits all kids because not all kids brains come out of the womb wired the same

[PosPosPos]

Not all do. There are those that lack this.

That's when you want to ring up the friendly child psychologist. I know you don't necessarily imply that we should beat children who fall into this category, just saying in case.

[Murderdoll]

If people are going to complain about how my children act, dont interfere with how/remove options to discipline them.

Ill smack my kids on the arse if the situation warrants it.

[Gilgemesh]

No, you're obviously not. We know who the most selfish self-entitled generation is and its clearly the boomers. On metrics too numerous to mention this is clearly the case, but I can spell it out with data for you if you'd like.

Are we going to blame the economy for job hoppers? For these people who can't find happiness anywhere? The generation of victims. No doubt the boomers made mistakes, many of which will hurt for centuries. But i stand my ground. This generation is weak, and the things that society was built on will crumble beneath their feet.

[PosPosPos]

Are we going to blame the economy for job hoppers? For these people who can't find happiness anywhere? The generation of victims. No doubt the boomers made mistakes, many of which will hurt for centuries. But i stand my ground. This generation is weak, and the things that society was built on will crumble beneath their feet.

It's ironic that baby boomers would ask the millennials to take responsibility for the societal and economic problems the former caused, then label millennials as the most selfish generation.

[Deleted]

My point is, there is not one size glove fits all kids because not all kids brains come out of the womb wired the same

There are a lot of characteristics that are globally defined for humans, overall, outside of conditions and disturbances.

We can't do more than to adhere to those - And as for the case of children, there has been a loooooooooot of studies about 'em, their phases, etc.
It's pretty well documented. I'm pretty much just reciting sources that i heard from proffesionals etc.

Not that i believe in a totalitarian way of doing with only one solution (Like i said, can be many ways) - But behaviorism is something more akin to hardwiring stimuli to the brain, which makes it a global thing.

[Wyrt]

Are we going to blame the economy for job hoppers? For these people who can't find happiness anywhere? The generation of victims. No doubt the boomers made mistakes, many of which will hurt for centuries. But i stand my ground. This generation is weak, and the things that society was built on will crumble beneath their feet.

Are millennials the first generation to get blamed for everything wrong with society before they've even had a real chance to make a significant influence on society or does this happen for every generation?

[PosPosPos]

Are millennials the first generation to get blamed for everything wrong with society before they've even had a real chance to make a significant influence on society or does this happen for every generation?

Nope, only with baby boomers. They comprise the majority of the alt right movement after all, which preaches taking personal responsibility - for everyone except their own clique.

[Varjo410]

Good.
And to those who proclaim a spanking is sometimes necessary, if you need to resort to physicality in order to prove your authority you are always in the wrong.

[Total Crica]

There are a lot of characteristics that are globally defined for humans, overall, outside of conditions and disturbances.

We can't do more than to adhere to those - And as for the case of children, there has been a loooooooooot of studies about 'em, their phases, etc.
It's pretty well documented. I'm pretty much just reciting sources that i heard from professionals etc.

Not that i believe in a totalitarian way of doing with only one solution (Like i said, can be many ways) - But behaviorism is something more akin to hard-wiring stimuli to the brain, which makes it a global thing.

I wish I could trust that - my mind thinks it's mind control, I won't go get any of that help, I would rather be homeless and starve to death - ain't that some wiring up there? =P

[Gilgemesh]

Are millennials the first generation to get blamed for everything wrong with society before they've even had a real chance to make a significant influence on society or does this happen for every generation?

No. The old generation blames the new one...and the new one blames the old.
The solution for youngsters is to out all the old folks...and the old folks want to box up all the youngsters till they're old.
I suppose its a matter of perspective. Mine being different than yours. I suppose time will say we both did what we had to.

[Frolk]

If u as a parent have to spank ur child, YOU failed as a parent.