Blood DK vs Vengeance DH - who is the king of soloing?

[Deleted]

Veng DH has more dmg reduction skills and lots of self heals but so do DKs. I have played DH up to 871 and I dare say they have INCREDIBLE self -sustain. Heals hitting 1 million on every 10 seconds or so.... I wanted to ask whether a Blood DK can match that>?

[Deleted]

Veng DH has more dmg reduction skills and lots of self heals but so do DKs. I have played DH up to 871 and I dare say they have INCREDIBLE self -sustain. Heals hitting 1 million on every 10 seconds or so.... I wanted to ask whether a Blood DK can match that>?

Take a look at these (my personal) logs for an M Ursoc fight I did a while back. I chose Ursoc because it's a boss with nice consistent tank damage, so there's plenty of self-healing to be done: www warcraftlogs com/reports/M7NgHYQ9y4X1PtpT#fight=15&type=healing

I averaged 293k HPS, x10 seconds would equate to 2.93 million healing every 10 seconds. So yes, a decent DK can match and beat that. (Sidenote: If you have a good paladin in your raidgroup healing will be lower as they snipe our health back up to full rather quickly.

With the changes being made to Rune Tap, I personally think DKs will be stronger than DHs overall, BUT, I am biased as I've mained a DK for forever and my DH is only 860.

[Deleted]

If we talk about pure healing done it's logical that DK will be higher but taking into consideration damage taken DHs have demon spikes which reduce damage by about 35%. So all in all you have more heals but less reduction.

[Spryte]

World rank 1 Healing by Veng DH on Mythic Ursoc - 284k HPS

World rank 1 Healing by Blood DK on Mythic Ursoc - 604k HPS

[Khiyone]

World rank 1 Healing by Veng DH on Mythic Ursoc - 284k HPS

World rank 1 Healing by Blood DK on Mythic Ursoc - 604k HPS

Around 35% of the healing in the blood DK log you are referring to is Bone Shield and Blood Mirror, so in reality it's not even 400k HPS. Also using healing ranks is quite irrelevant - no one is optimizing for HPS and a rank depends greatly on healer composition as well. In fact the rank 1 DH log uses Burning Alive and got 37M "healing" from LR.

With the changes being made to Rune Tap, I personally think DKs will be stronger than DHs overall, BUT, I am biased as I've mained a DK for forever and my DH is only 860.

This doesn't make sense; Rune Tap isn't something you would take in general as a DK - it's an anti-burst talent. Foul Bulwark is still the default talent that is used there.

[shanthi]

World rank 1 Healing by Veng DH on Mythic Ursoc - 284k HPS

World rank 1 Healing by Blood DK on Mythic Ursoc - 604k HPS

Obviously Death Knights will have higher raw healing--their active mitigation (Blood Shield) counts as healing on the meters. Demon Hunters' active mitigation (Demon Spikes) does not. Death Knight healing minus Blood Shield is very close to Demon Hunter healing. The question comes down to whether Blood Shield and DK cooldowns are better or worse than Demon Spikes and DH cooldowns.

[Deleted]

Obviously Death Knights will have higher raw healing--their active mitigation (Blood Shield) counts as healing on the meters. Demon Hunters' active mitigation (Demon Spikes) does not. Death Knight healing minus Blood Shield is very close to Demon Hunter healing. The question comes down to whether Blood Shield and DK cooldowns are better or worse than Demon Spikes and DH cooldowns.

?!?

Even without Bloodshield Absorb DK healing is still far above DHs. 400k vs 250k ish.

[Littlepwny]

?!?

Even without Bloodshield Absorb DK healing is still far above DHs. 400k vs 250k ish.

That DK has 1 million DTPS while the top DH has 683k DTPS. If you are going to compare them like that, you might want to do DTPS - HPS in order to calculate external healing required.

DK Healing Required: 446k
DH Healing Required: 399k

But even this comparison is pointless considering these guys did not do the mechanics correctly to pad their healing per second meter.

PS: The DH could pad some more by using Soul Barrier

[Saverem]

DHs will never catch up to DKs in the HPS meters because the DKs sort of cheat on the meters. They have Bone Shield AND their mastery, Blood Shield, that counts towards the HPS meter. So a large portion of their "HPS" comes from those.

DH's mastery and their DS don't show up on the meters, so they'll beat the DKs in damage taken (as in take less damage), but they'll never beat them in HPS because of how their mechanics work.

- - - Updated - - -

That DK has 1 million DTPS while the top DH has 683k DTPS. If you are going to compare them like that, you might want to do DTPS - HPS in order to calculate external healing required.

DK Healing Required: 446k
DH Healing Required: 399k

But even this comparison is pointless considering these guys did not do the mechanics correctly to pad their healing per second meter.

PS: The DH could pad some more by using Soul Barrier

This. Guilds with that fight on farm can easily afford to forego mechanics to purposely take more damage so they can heal themselves for more. The more damage the DK takes, the stronger they'll heal. Couple that with a 5 trait point Vamp Blood, that's another 55% extra healing on themselves when they use it.

[Spryte]

All I posted was some extreme examples from logs, people can take whatever they want from that.

[Toore]

All nice and dandy (HPS, DTPS comparissions) but the question was whos better in soloing. Personaly would like an answer from Mione - AFAIK DH now former DK who did a lot of solo kills previously (together with Ragewyn i think - dunno what happened to him) like 10N Garrosh before WoD, Kazzak solo in WoD (or was it Ragewyn? dont remember), etc.

[Yhcti]

I play both and find the DH overall nicer and with the buffs in 7.1.5 will prefer it even more. I love blood, but just find vengeance in general is much nicer to solo with. Both are top tier and clearly the best though..

[Deleted]

Why do you post damage from raids? It's completely wrong comparison for soloing.

DK's base self-healing is much lower than DH.

If you look at logs, 50+% healing from DK is death strike with is 20% of damage taken, ie. the more damage you take, the more selfhealing it will pump. In old raids DK will be stuck getting base 10% heal, whereas DH will heal for full values.

[Saverem]

Why do you post damage from raids? It's completely wrong comparison for soloing.

DK's base self-healing is much lower than DH.

If you look at logs, 50+% healing from DK is death strike with is 20% of damage taken, ie. the more damage you take, the more selfhealing it will pump. In old raids DK will be stuck getting base 10% heal, whereas DH will heal for full values.

Old raids? Do you mean like raids from previous expansions or ezmode raids now like N EN?

In both instances, DKs will be more than fine. Plus they have several other ways of self healing, not just DS. Blood Drinker talent for example got seriously buffed, it now heals my (860 ilvl) DK for 1.3m every 30s, that doesn't even take my +45% healing bonus from VB into account.

If they are getting stuck with 10% heals then that means they aren't getting hit for shit in those raids and could solo tank it. Even in Heroic dungeons my DS heals for more than 10%, so if the damage they are taking aren't enough to even register with the DS heal, the content is trivial.

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Veng DH has more dmg reduction skills and lots of self heals but so do DKs. I have played DH up to 871 and I dare say they have INCREDIBLE self -sustain. Heals hitting 1 million on every 10 seconds or so.... I wanted to ask whether a Blood DK can match that>?

They are both tanks that can pretty much solo anything in old content, so I'd honestly rate them on which one has better AoE so they can pull everything and kill them as fast as possible.

If you are asking which is best to solo hard content, like maybe a N EN boss or a M dungeon or something, then that is probably going to be dependent on the mechanics of the fight. I'd say BDKs will be better for fights with magical spike damage since they have AMS to cheese the mechanic (especially with the legendary that causes AMS to heal for the amount it absorbs) if you are talking about more constant damage, then DHs will probably be better since their self healing isn't dependent on the incoming damage they take. DHs also have better mobility and thus can escape dangerous areas faster and can kite for a bit when required, something DKs can not do. DKs have better overall damage so they'll be able to kill the boss a bit faster.

[Deleted]

Blood dks are the kings of out-gearing content and sustaining themselves forever.

If only that was the case in progress raids.

[Tinary]

For old content, DH is better than DK cause if you run an old raid then mobility is far better than 10-20% more selfhealing. If you cant mount, DH is better.