[Feral] Legion Discussion

[teddabear]

Brutal Slash went from 18 second recharge to 12 second recharge.

Will this make feral AoE actually good or will it still be crap?

The last time I looked at logs it needed to be 8 seconds to be good but that was many ilvls ago. Not sure if it scales worse or better than the competition but it does scale with haste.

It should at least be in the correct ballpark this time though. Simulationcraft has Feral single target really weak in 7.1.5 though so it seems like AoE could have gotten more love. If logs bear that out it's not a very good trade.

[Deleted]

Well ofc, it's not about feral being in a pretty "bad" spot in Legion, it's about a lot of other classes being in a better one.

[Tradu]

Brutal Slash went from 18 second recharge to 12 second recharge.

Will this make feral AoE actually good or will it still be crap?

It means we can use Brutal Slash in more situations than before. Brutal Slash doesn't have a lot to do with how good our AoE is, because it's trading sustained AoE(and ST) in the form of BT for burst AoE, so it's just changing what kind of AoE you're doing.

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The last time I looked at logs it needed to be 8 seconds to be good but that was many ilvls ago. Not sure if it scales worse or better than the competition but it does scale with haste.

It should at least be in the correct ballpark this time though. Simulationcraft has Feral single target really weak in 7.1.5 though so it seems like AoE could have gotten more love. If logs bear that out it's not a very good trade.

And we all know that the stack ranks on the frontpage of SimC are always accurate and worth looking at.

[Zanzha]

I for one am still simming for 600k on 7.1.5 I would hardly call that weak, granted solid gear and bis legendaries but that's still on the upper end of the spectrum by /alot/

[Loganw]

Hello guys, i am not verry happy about last feral changes. I have a simple question for you, will you keep playing feral?

[teddabear]

It means we can use Brutal Slash in more situations than before. Brutal Slash doesn't have a lot to do with how good our AoE is, because it's trading sustained AoE(and ST) in the form of BT for burst AoE, so it's just changing what kind of AoE you're doing.

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And we all know that the stack ranks on the frontpage of SimC are always accurate and worth looking at.

I will always take Logs over Sims but Feral was simming very high before so comparatively speaking it is unusual. Design-wise Feral is still a single target specialist so if it is not good at single target that would be problematic.

[xuros]

Hey guys. A feral dps druid in my raid was talking about neck enchants and didnt know what he should be using now. Think hes using Satyr. I told him id ask here for some info for him since i had an account. Soooo, what are you guys using as your best neck enchant now?

[Tradu]

I will always take Logs over Sims but Feral was simming very high before so comparatively speaking it is unusual. Design-wise Feral is still a single target specialist so if it is not good at single target that would be problematic.

Yeah, it was "simming highly" in the pre-raid stack ranks cos people actually put time into optimizing them. The ones on the front page are not optimized in the slightest.

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Hey guys. A feral dps druid in my raid was talking about neck enchants and didnt know what he should be using now. Think hes using Satyr. I told him id ask here for some info for him since i had an account. Soooo, what are you guys using as your best neck enchant now?

Satyr is correct.

[Lycanoth]

Well ofc, it's not about feral being in a pretty "bad" spot in Legion, it's about a lot of other classes being in a better one.

A few specs got overbuffed with the new aura's added this patch. I am certain there will be a balance hotfix before nighthold next week because you got several specs pulling over 700-800k+ sustained before tier is accessible.

Feral also has some bugs right now with FB+OoC causing abilities to "fail" and combo points not being read properly on the UI.

Hey guys. A feral dps druid in my raid was talking about neck enchants and didnt know what he should be using now. Think hes using Satyr. I told him id ask here for some info for him since i had an account. Soooo, what are you guys using as your best neck enchant now?

Depends how far you are willing to go to min/max.

Satyr is good for ST and short lived add fights while mark of the trained soldier is better for sustained cleave/AoE. For NH I will be carrying two necks with these enchants to swap out depending on the fight.

[Deleted]

The change to OoC doesnt feel good at all, was pulling around same numbers on single target as before patch, but I get into those low energy situations more and especially when theres any multidotting involved i feel starved. Had some bugs aswell with the procs. I dont know if its just that im not used to it yet. Miss those free savage roars...

[Deleted]

The change to OoC doesnt feel good at all, was pulling around same numbers on single target as before patch, but I get into those low energy situations more and especially when theres any multidotting involved i feel starved. Had some bugs aswell with the procs. I dont know if its just that im not used to it yet. Miss those free savage roars...

It felt really bad with new OoC, before patch i usually used procs for Savage Roar/Rip - it helped a lot with pooling (I'm using energy ring). Now it feels so weird.
Sometimes i got a proc while pooling at 5cp and im thorn between using my low energy for finisher and then OoC for Shred or wasting more procs by not using them asap.

Imho the old good OoC was way better, crap change as a whole.

[Zer0xChan]

I've been pretty frustrated with the changes to OoC so far. I really liked having charges of it up for refreshing savage roar. It's hard to say so early, but at least looking at ranks on Warcraft Logs for EN it's not too encouraging for feral.

I haven't cleared Mythic EN this week, but at least Odin I was down 20 percentile ranks compared to pre patch

[Nivrax]

Anyone else missing blizzard aura from proccing instant regrowth from finishers? The Omen one is still there so I didn't disable it by accident.
And I do agree with new Omen being really clunky. It feels extra bad given how unforgiving is the rotation.

[Deleted]

Havent really felt the need to complain about feral stuff earlier, been doing high mythic+ with monks and warriors and never felt useless least with that comp and on raids its been fine. Like you said, it feels really clunky now and it for me at least affects the gameplay and how i enjoy it, which i value higher than pure dps numbers. After EN/trials clear it seems dmg is about the same, but everyone elses is gone up, some of the classes who cried in ptr about nerfing to ground are in a pretty good place after all.

[Deleted]

A few specs got overbuffed with the new aura's added this patch. I am certain there will be a balance hotfix before nighthold next week because you got several specs pulling over 700-800k+ sustained before tier is accessible.

Feral also has some bugs right now with FB+OoC causing abilities to "fail" and combo points not being read properly on the UI.

They'd better be. We did some crash 7/7 Mythic EN raid last eve with my guildies to test things out, and it came out that SP/DHs/Rets are pulling twice our dps. We got some pretty solid players ranking 95+ pretty often so it's not a "get gud" problem. At around 887 with gloves/ring as my best legs, I sim at around 500k dps which is more or less what I pull on ST. I used to destroy our Sin rogue and several other dps of my roster before, and now I'm only ahead of our Enh shamans and MM hunters which got hit pretty hard from their own sayings, and our rogue outdps me by a solid 100k on pure ST. Feels a little "meh" seeing our SP who could never manage the S2M rotation to pull over a million on Xavius without it or he being with our ret and dhs at over 700/800k on some bosses in which other classes are supposed to "shine". Let's deeply believe everything was taken in account for NH release and our Incarn, 4pcT19, CoF build can level us on ST.

As you were talking about bugs, since 7.1.5 I have experienced the usual bugs :
- Prowl sucks
- My attacks miss for no reason, costing energy but not applying dots neither granting combo points.

On an other hand, I tried some builds in MM+ with my boosting group (understand big fat pulls boosting 4-12s with a fully geared group with a lot of dps) :
- BS/SR/BrS : HUGE AoE. With my haste BrS has a 10s CD, lowered to 7-8 with Ursoc trinket procs. On 6+ keys I could outdps the DH in AoE. But damage on boss was a bit low without BT. So solid numbers, like around 700k overall on an Arcway 6 which is really nice as a feral, I think.
- Pred/SR/BT : Really good AoE in a few dungeons where there are a lot of adds that die separately. With Teeming it was even better. Best dungeon for this kinda build is Neltharion's Lair because you can also trigger Predator on each boss. Anyway the AoE was good enough to be just a little behind the others, while still maintaining some good ST dps.
- BS/SR/BT : Still good on 10+ imo. Can't do much at lower levels because mobs die too fast.

Last, OoC changes feel weird, but definitively are energy positive. Feels weird not to FB/Rake on it anymore but the empowered Shreds are sweet while making us save 5 more energy than what we would have using a Rake. Also I feel like it's a lot less easier to miss-use Omen procs since they just don't disappear whatever is casted.

Tonight we're going to keep trying our builds on Odyn/Guarm Mythic so I'll test out some more ST to see how it goes.

[Lycanoth]

They'd better be. We did some crash 7/7 Mythic EN raid last eve with my guildies to test things out, and it came out that SP/DHs/Rets are pulling twice our dps. We got some pretty solid players ranking 95+ pretty often so it's not a "get gud" problem. At around 887 with gloves/ring as my best legs, I sim at around 500k dps which is more or less what I pull on ST. I used to destroy our Sin rogue and several over dps of my roster before, and now I'm only ahead of our Enh shamans and MM hunters which got hit pretty hard from their own sayings, and our rogue outdps me by a solid 100k on pure ST. Feels a little "meh" seeing our SP who could never manage the S2M rotation to pull over a million on Xavius without it or he being with our ret and dhs at over 700/800k on some bosses in which other classes are supposed to "shine". Let's deeply believe everything was taken in account for NH release and our Incarn, 4pcT19, CoF build can level us on ST.

I would be very surprised if they let this continue into NH because we are back to 7.0 disparity between specs and a whole class in a very bad spot. Our 4pc is good but it is no where near good enough to compete with ret/sin/sp with theirs. What is strange to me is ret and sin rogue were not pulling those numbers on ptr a couple weeks ago so either there was a last second buff or something is bugged.

Feral didn't get nerfed they got their damage shifted around while it looks like every other class got buffs. Our damage stayed roughly the same as 7.1. Enhance also got something similar except their rotation changed. BM/MM hunters were bad all PTR cycle and blizzard ignored them.

[Thorim]

I would be very surprised if they let this continue into NH because we are back to 7.0 disparity between specs and a whole class in a very bad spot. Our 4pc is good but it is no where near good enough to compete with ret/sin/sp with theirs. What is strange to me is ret and sin rogue were not pulling those numbers on ptr a couple weeks ago so either there was a last second buff or something is bugged.

Feral didn't get nerfed they got their damage shifted around while it looks like every other class got buffs. Our damage stayed roughly the same as 7.1. Enhance also got something similar except their rotation changed. BM/MM hunters were bad all PTR cycle and blizzard ignored them.

Don't know about the damage staying the same, on a dummy with no distractions in 7.1 I was hovering around 480-500 depending on AB procs/general crits etc and now its hovering around 450k, definitely lost something in there.

[Deleted]

Don't know about the damage staying the same, on a dummy with no distractions in 7.1 I was hovering around 480-500 depending on AB procs/general crits etc and now its hovering around 450k, definitely lost something in there.

Felt a small tiny loss as well but that could be due to a bad cycle which was before compensated by OoC and is no longer, or bad itemisation which the sec stat shift might have made a bit more "fragile". Globally I agree with what Lycanoth said. There's really nothing wrong with the feral atm, we just got our damage execution smoothed out a bit. But god... Why is our Ret pally still at 1.2M dps after 1min of Mythic Guarm ? It's the feeling of those other classes being frankly overtuned that makes us feel feral is in a bad spot... Raidwise at least. Changes for mythic+ seem overall to be pretty good.

[Deleted]

Guys for a returning feral druid with 860 un optimized gear, what talents are best for most dps in mythic+ thanks guys. Also my dps seems low in m+ can anybody give me some tips pretty plz

[Deleted]

I see a lot of ferals taking Blood Scent over Lunar Inspiration now. Has that become superior?