The Terrifying Stakes Of Repealing Obamacare Without A Clear Replacement

[Adam Jensen]

Democrats may be grooming Cory Booker as their 2020 guy by the way. Get ready for two terms of Trump everyone.

As long as they don't act like retards and "fix" the primaries and give all the candidates a fair chance, maybe we'll be rid of Trump.

But watch them make the same fucking mistakes again and then blame the voters.

[Theodarzna]

As long as they don't act like retards and "fix" the primaries and give all the candidates a fair chance, maybe we'll be rid of Trump.

But watch them make the same fucking mistakes again and then blame the voters.

Looking at the post election democrat reaction, I suspect they haven't learned dick. If Booker is their man, then this party is fucked.

[Blade Wolf]

As long as they don't act like retards and "fix" the primaries and give all the candidates a fair chance, maybe we'll be rid of Trump.

But watch them make the same fucking mistakes again and then blame the voters.

https://theintercept.com/2017/01/12/...e-from-canada/ Booker already fucked over democrats by siding with republicans on this. Ted fucking Cruz was on the side of Bernie and Booker went against it.

[NYC17]

As long as they don't act like retards and "fix" the primaries and give all the candidates a fair chance, maybe we'll be rid of Trump.

But watch them make the same fucking mistakes again and then blame the voters.

Way too early to tell. There will be a few interesting names. Warren again, Kamala Harris etc..

[Spectral]

Democrats may be grooming Cory Booker as their 2020 guy by the way. Get ready for two terms of Trump everyone.

Without much additional commentary, my thoughts are that Cory Booker is a grandstanding piece of shit. If Booker and Ellison on the plan going forward, the lesson that the party seems to have learned is that they simply haven't been sufficiently identity politics oriented.

[judgementofantonidas]

forcing people to pay for insurance does not drop health costs. the insurance companies now are ensured customers and can raise the rates with impunity.

there are countries with health care equivalent or even better than the united states that do not bleed their citizens dry in order to pay for it.

[Teebone]

What if the Republicans literally just started referring to the ACA as Trumpcare instead of Obamacare?

People would be dumb enough to eat that shit sandwich.

[Adam Jensen]

People would be dumb enough to eat that shit sandwich.

Obummer bad!
Trump good!

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https://theintercept.com/2017/01/12/...e-from-canada/ Booker already fucked over democrats by siding with republicans on this. Ted fucking Cruz was on the side of Bernie and Booker went against it.

What sort of bizarro world is this when Ted Cruz and Bernie Sanders are on the same side on anything?

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forcing people to pay for insurance does not drop health costs. the insurance companies now are ensured customers and can raise the rates with impunity.

there are countries with health care equivalent or even better than the united states that do not bleed their citizens dry in order to pay for it.

Sure, there are problems with the ACA. But just throwing the baby out with the bathwater isn't the solution.

Fix the problems. Bring in single payer. But don't leave people without insurance in the meanwhile.

[Deleted]

Pure liberalism and capitalism at its finest.

The overall good of the people does not matter, if the people in power have it better.

[Osmeric]

And how did they manage before Obamacare?

Often, they didn't.

Of course, making medical care essentially free is a recipe for developing ever more expensive treatments. Not sustainable short of deliberately blocking such developments.

If Trump is smart, he will play to his base and go after the professional class (doctors, for example) who benefit from the restrictions government regulations place on who can deliver medical care, and on laws that force the delivery of the highest quality treatment regardless of cost.

[Masark]

https://theintercept.com/2017/01/12/...e-from-canada/ Booker already fucked over democrats by siding with republicans on this. Ted fucking Cruz was on the side of Bernie and Booker went against it.

Unfuck your own shit rather than leeching off our efforts.

[Blade Wolf]

Unfuck your own shit rather than leeching off our efforts.

You import medication from America so stop leeching on american products.

[Masark]

You import medication from America so stop leeching on american products.

We negotiate our own prices.

If you want sane prices, form your own price control instrument rather than leeching off our government's efforts.

[Spectral]

Sure, there are problems with the ACA. But just throwing the baby out with the bathwater isn't the solution.

Fix the problems. Bring in single payer. But don't leave people without insurance in the meanwhile.

The quickest short-run fix would just be renaming the fucking thing to Trumpcare so Trump can tweet about it and grandstand about how Trumpcare is saving lives. I shit you not, I think this would actually work.

[schwarzkopf]

Of course, making medical care essentially free is a recipe for developing ever more expensive treatments. Not sustainable short of deliberately blocking such developments.

Incorrect - Australia has free health care, but the free health care is baseline level in the public hospitial system. In addition to that you can have private insurance and private hospital treatment.

The core part of ensuring prices don't escalate is to have a controlled baseline provider.

If the US implemented the Australian model, it would save the US over $1 trillion per year in health costs.

[Spectral]

Often, they didn't.

Of course, making medical care essentially free is a recipe for developing ever more expensive treatments. Not sustainable short of deliberately blocking such developments.

If Trump is smart, he will play to his base and go after the professional class (doctors, for example) who benefit from the restrictions government regulations place on who can deliver medical care, and on laws that force the delivery of the highest quality treatment regardless of cost.

At a bare minimum, more regulatory shifts to allow nurses to provide additional care seems like an obvious good. I don't want an unregulated medical market, but the barriers to entry that exist at present are classic rent-seeking.

[Masark]

I'm confused. They're importing medication from us that we then want to import back at a lower price? Explain how the fuck that works.

1. Pharmacies in Canada purchase medications from companies at prices negotiated by the Patented Medicines Price Review Board.

2. Americans, who lack a government that give a fuck about their health, then order their medications from said Canadian pharmacies to get the above negotiated prices rather than the fuck-me-with-a-piledriver-and-16-feet-of-curare-tipped-wrought-iron-fence-and-no-lubricants prices their Free Market gives them.

[Spectral]

Incorrect - Australia has free health care, but the free health care is baseline level in the public hospitial system. In addition to that you can have private insurance and private hospital treatment.

The core part of ensuring prices don't escalate is to have a controlled baseline provider.

If the US implemented the Australian model, it would save the US over $1 trillion per year in health costs.

I think you're talking past each other a bit. American healthcare culture is pretty bizarre - everyone wants the nominal latest and greatest treatments (even though a lot of these aren't actually very good) and what @Osmeric is referring to is that making these "free" ensures that they continue to rise in demand and cost.

I think your policy suggestion is so obviously good that it drives me nuts that we can't just implement it.

[schwarzkopf]

You import medication from America so stop leeching on american products.

Just because Australia, and Canada organise bulk purchase prices for medicines, but the US insists on each patient independently dealing with the drug companies - doesn't make us leeches, just makes us smart.

[Osmeric]

Incorrect - Australia has free health care, but the free health care is baseline level in the public hospitial system. In addition to that you can have private insurance and private hospital treatment.

That's not making medical care essentially free, it's making a limited subset of medical care essentially free.

Everybody can get treated for everything using the best treatments? That will drive the development of ever more expensive therapies, because the if they are marginally more effective there will be a guaranteed subsidized market.

Put it another way: the need to say no to desperate patients is not optional. It has to be done, one way or another.

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Just because Australia, and Canada organise bulk purchase prices for medicines, but the US insists on each patient independently dealing with the drug companies - doesn't make us leeches, just makes us smart.

It means you are being free riders on developments subsidized by the US medical system. Being a free rider is smart, yes, but it's still being a free rider.